Roster Question

[liamettocs]

I have a roster question. I have been looking for a particular handgun that is ON THE ROSTER, but have not been able to find it anywhere. I've already done a thorough on-line search. I finally found this gun on-line, but it comes with a standard cap magazine (>10 rounds). Really, it's the same gun except for the magazines. The on-line dealer told me he could ship it to my FFL with 10 round magazines. But here's the thing - the two guns have different identification numbers. For example, the gun listed on the roster is number A1234, while the gun with the standard magazine is number B1234. (Note: these numbers are not on the gun, it can use either type of magazine. It's sort of like a SKU number). Do you think I can get my local FFL to DROS it with the 10 round magazines using the roster identification number? I know the only sure way to find out is to ask my FFL, but I wanted to get some feed back from fellow CGers before I talked to them about it. Thanks in advance for your help.

[Librarian]

It's a problem for the FFL.

The Roster is mindlessly specific, and if the model number or SKU on the Roster is different from the one on the box, even though the difference is magazines which have been appropriately substituted, an FFL might reasonably call that copy off-Roster and not be able to transfer it to you.

[madoka]

That situation happened to me with my CZ SP-01.

I could not find a 10 round version, but I did find the normal capacity mag version. So I asked the seller to ship without the mags. I thought that would be okay, but OC Armory told me that they have to go by the SKU. As a result, I was forced to SSE it even though it's exactly the same gun as the one on the roster.

[liamettocs]

It's a problem for the FFL.

The Roster is mindlessly specific, and if the model number or SKU on the Roster is different from the one on the box, even though the difference is magazines which have been appropriately substituted, an FFL might reasonably call that copy off-Roster and not be able to transfer it to you.

I hate to be nit-picky, but my issue is inherently nit-picky. When you say, "It's a problem for the FFL," do you really mean the FFL may see it as a problem.

Let me use another example. None of the Glocks on the roster have similar SKU or other identifying numbers associated with them except the model number (e.g. "22 / Steel, Polymer"). If I order a Glock 22 from the Glock Store, they just take a Glock 22 from inventory and send it to my FFL with 10 round mags. There's no issue, because there's no SKU listed on the roster.

So I would try to persuade my FFL that when he receives the gun at issue with 10 round mags, its not a B1234, its really an A1234.

If it's just a matter of persuading my FFL, I'll take a run at that, but if you think this could get my FFL in trouble, I don't want to do that so I'll have to figure another solution to this conundrum.

[-hanko]

It might help just a bit...

...if you'd name the weapon.

I've had luck calling the manufacturer, speaking to someone in the sales department, and asking who the manufacturer uses for distributors.

Then it's just some calling local FFL's to see with distributor(s) they use.

hth

[dyson]

Persuade might not help. shop around.

[Oldmandan]

I had the same issue looking for an XD awhile back. Called every FFL in my area, nobody would do the transfer due to the part #, even though the gun was the same. Only difference was mags also.

If you're in OC, give up now... nobody will do it. I was eventually able to find the CA version about 3 months later.

[BOYET]

That situation happened to me with my CZ SP-01.

I could not find a 10 round version, but I did find the normal capacity mag version. So I asked the seller to ship without the mags. I thought that would be okay, but OC Armory told me that they have to go by the SKU. As a result, I was forced to SSE it even though it's exactly the same gun as the one on the roster.

Same thing happened to me. Did the same thing. Luckily the FFL I used didn't care or missed the sku. Same darn gun different #. Good thing I bought a bunch of 10 rounders before it came.

Anyway... Tell the seller to send the gun in an unmarked/un-stickered tuppaware with just the invoice. I figure if the invoice matches the gun/barrel/etc the FFL shouldn't have an issue. Am I wrong?

[adamjay]

You intentionally ask the sender to misrepresent the item, or exclude info because it is off roster - seems like you might be committing a crime.

Your FFL agrees to your request to misrepresent - seems like you're both committing a crime.

Your FFL doesn't catch it and it slips through - that kind of slipup could go very badly for him and his license.

Doesn't seem to be a legal course there.

I think if you told us which gun, general region where you are, we might be able to help more. We are in this boat together and many of us like to help each other out.

Good luck.

[-hanko]

You intentionally ask the sender to misrepresent the item, or exclude info because it is off roster - seems like you might be committing a crime.

Your FFL agrees to your request to misrepresent - seems like you're both committing a crime.

Your FFL doesn't catch it and it slips through - that kind of slipup could go very badly for him and his license.

Doesn't seem to be a legal course there.

I think if you told us which gun, general region where you are, we might be able to help more. We are in this boat together and many of us like to help each other out.

Good luck.

Are you an attorney?

[Tiberius]

If I understand correctly, I've handled this through Robby at Golden State Tactical near Sacramento (he's highly recommended on Calguns, and provides great service). Basically, he'll act as the receiving FFL, and you can order the gun yourself, in which case its up to you to get the right model and version, or you can have him do it. And, in my experience, he'll get it sorted and do it right.

Not sure where the OP is, but having an FFL handle this mostly solves the problem - as long as they're satisfied the gun is correct, all is well. The roster as applied has become so byzantine and complex that it seems that no one really knows what's going on with it.

[Legasat]

Go to a couple of dealers. Ask them to find you one with the correct SKU #, and agree on a price when they do. One of the big distributors should be able to find one or order one from the manufacturer.

Keep looking around. If your dealer cannot find one, check on the manufacturer's forum and see if anyone has seen one. Maybe your FFL will transfer one in for you.

DO NOT try to buy the wrong SKU#. It won't turn out well.

[Librarian]

I hate to be nit-picky, but my issue is inherently nit-picky. When you say, "It's a problem for the FFL," do you really mean the FFL may see it as a problem.

...

If it's just a matter of persuading my FFL, I'll take a run at that, but if you think this could get my FFL in trouble, I don't want to do that so I'll have to figure another solution to this conundrum.

It's illegal for the FFL to transfer an off-Roster handgun unless the buyer is exempt from the Roster (LEO), the gun is exempt from the Roster (ex: C&R), or the transaction is exempt from the Roster (PPT or intrafamilial). The FFL could lose his/her license.

If the gun is not clearly on-Roster, there's too much risk via the next DOJ audit.

[liamettocs]

It's illegal for the FFL to transfer an off-Roster handgun unless the buyer is exempt from the Roster (LEO), the gun is exempt from the Roster (ex: C&R), or the transaction is exempt from the Roster (PPT or intrafamilial). The FFL could lose his/her license.

If the gun is not clearly on-Roster, there's too much risk via the next DOJ audit.

Thank you for your very helpful knowledge and advice. I don't want to get my FFL in a jam.

[bountyhunter]

I hate to be nit-picky, but my issue is inherently nit-picky. When you say, "It's a problem for the FFL," do you really mean the FFL may see it as a problem.

What they mean is that any competent FFL will KNOW it is a potential problem and not risk his butt to process a gun where he knows the SKU number does not comply with the roster. It may be sheer idiocy, but it's the law. Been there.