"Ammo stored separately..."

[NoobShooter]

I brought my gun and loaded mags to a range. The guy behind the counter says that I shouldn't have loaded mags anywhere near a gun until I get into the range, or it's considered a loaded weapon. I can see this logic... question tho...

Is this also true if I have a loaded mag in the glove and the gun in the trunk, am I still carrying a loaded firearm?

[Harrison_Bergeron]

Go to "2nd Amend. Politics and Laws" section, check stickies.

[Quiet]

I brought my gun and loaded mags to a range. The guy behind the counter says that I shouldn't have loaded mags anywhere near a gun until I get into the range, or it's considered a loaded weapon. I can see this logic... question tho...

Is this also true if I have a loaded mag in the glove and the gun in the trunk, am I still carrying a loaded firearm?

Your answer be here.

[NiteQwill]

You can have all the loaded magazines you want as long as they are not IN the weapon. The only downside is you may run into people like you encountered, or worse, an ill/uninformed LEO... who will make your day go to crap. The trade off is simple: load at home vs. load at the range. You decide

[leelaw]

Store it separate, as in not touching, inserted, or affixed to the weapon that it is intended to be fired in.

You can keep it within the same locked container (aka: trunk), but follow the above advice.

What the clerk told you is not sound advice.

[Matt C]

What the clerk told you is not sound advice.

I would not go so far as that. It's not the law but it's not necessarily bad advice. I might give the same advice to a relative newcomer to the gun world simply because I don't want them to have the bad experience early in their gun ownership of being mistreated or arrested by an LEO who was trained incorrectly.

As long as they understand that while they would be within the law there is a risk of arrest, and they are willing to take that risk, then I say go for it.

And technically it can be touching or affixed as long as it in not in a position from which it can be fired by operation of the weapon, so your post is FUD as well

[leelaw]

And technically it can be touching or affixed as long as it in not in a position from which it can be fired by operation of the weapon, so your post is FUD as well

In general:

12031(g)PC
A firearm shall be deemed to be loaded for the purposes of
this section when there is an unexpended cartridge or shell,
consisting of a case that holds a charge of powder and a bullet or
shot, in, or attached in any manner to, the firearm, including, but
not limited to, in the firing chamber, magazine, or clip thereof
attached to the firearm; except that a muzzle-loader firearm shall be
deemed to be loaded when it is capped or primed and has a powder
charge and ball or shot in the barrel or cylinder.

In school zones:

626.9(j)PC
For purposes of this section, a firearm shall be deemed to be
loaded when there is an unexpended cartridge or shell, consisting of
a case that holds a charge of powder and a bullet or shot, in, or
attached in any manner to, the firearm, including, but not limited
to, in the firing chamber, magazine, or clip thereof attached to the
firearm. A muzzle-loader firearm shall be deemed to be loaded when
it is capped or primed and has a powder charge and ball or shot in
the barrel or cylinder.

[Ironchef]

Perhaps telling the OP that while it's technically (fully, actually) to have loaded mags in the same storage device as the gun is in, it's likely to cause trouble if ever searched by a cop, and may cause trouble because of the above quoted PC..since the LEO will likely not know the [clark or hale? ruling. sorry, I forget, but it was '96 when it was done...maybe] case law defining "loaded." We usually say such things every week when this type of question comes up..be nice if others in the gun shops, ranges, and patrol cars could get this.

[Matt C]

In general:

Right, but people vs. Clark is case law which trumps the PC...

[bruss01]

There is "legal" and there is "smart".

There's enough confusion surrounding this issue that even lifelong gun-o-philes have differing opinions. Which side do you think an anti-gun cop (yes they do exist) will decide to err on?

The truth of the matter (loaded magazine separate from gun is OK) was decided in a court case. But when the cop who pulls you over for a tail-bulb issue on Friday night ends up by whatever circumstance finding your loaded magazine, the on-duty person back at the PD will not be searching thru court case records, they will be looking at the Public Code. The answer that will likely come back will make the difference between you having an enjoyable weekend vs one spent in jail waiting to see the judge on Monday morning. Forget trying to "teach" a cop about what the law is... that is not something likely to be accomplished when there are red and blue flashing lights behind your car.

Now, when your lawyer shows up Monday morning, then HE gets to explain the court case ruling to the judge and the case is dismissed. But what's the chance of a lost weekend behind bars compared to the convenience of loading your magazines at home before you head to the range?

Legal is legal, but smart is smart. Your choice which one you want to roll with.

[Librarian]

There is "legal" and there is "smart".

There's enough confusion surrounding this issue that even lifelong gun-o-philes have differing opinions. Which side do you think an anti-gun cop (yes they do exist) will decide to err on?

The truth of the matter (loaded magazine separate from gun is OK) was decided in a court case. But when the cop who pulls you over for a tail-bulb issue on Friday night ends up by whatever circumstance finding your loaded magazine, the on-duty person back at the PD will not be searching thru court case records, they will be looking at the Public Code. The answer that will likely come back will make the difference between you having an enjoyable weekend vs one spent in jail waiting to see the judge on Monday morning. Forget trying to "teach" a cop about what the law is... that is not something likely to be accomplished when there are red and blue flashing lights behind your car.

Now, when your lawyer shows up Monday morning, then HE gets to explain the court case ruling to the judge and the case is dismissed. But what's the chance of a lost weekend behind bars compared to the convenience of loading your magazines at home before you head to the range?

Legal is legal, but smart is smart. Your choice which one you want to roll with.

All true. One must act within one's comfort level.

But that risk of being stopped is also pretty low.

And if stopped for a tail-light, when the nice officer asks if you have anything illegal in the car, the answer will of course be 'no', right?

And if the nice officer writes your ticket and then asks if you would mind if s/he looks, just to be sure, your answer will be 'No, I do not consent to a search, officer - am I free to go?', right?

But the correct legal answer to the question is "Yes, you may transport loaded magazines, so long as the magazines are not in the magazine well of the weapon."

[Crazed_SS]

I brought my gun and loaded mags to a range. The guy behind the counter says that I shouldn't have loaded mags anywhere near a gun until I get into the range, or it's considered a loaded weapon. I can see this logic... question tho...

Is this also true if I have a loaded mag in the glove and the gun in the trunk, am I still carrying a loaded firearm?

On the advice of my LEO friend, I always keep mags unloaded when I go to the range.. I guess maybe he might be a FUDster, but I'd rather err on the side of caution with stuff like that, especially when it's coming from a cop. It's not like you're saving that much time by waiting until you get to the range to load.

[ontmark]

On the advice of my LEO friend, I always keep mags unloaded when I go to the range.. I guess maybe he might be a FUDster, but I'd rather err on the side of caution with stuff like that, especially when it's coming from a cop. It's not like you're saving that much time by waiting until you get to the range to load.

+1

I have been told from a friend, who has several friends in LE in Vallejo. The word is to get the guns off the street and then let the owners fight to retrieve them.

[paul0660]

I have been told from a friend, who has several friends in LE in Vallejo. The word is to get the guns off the street and then let the owners fight to retrieve them.
Reply With Quote

I believe this. Cop brownie points are given for this sort of thing. When I go to the range with a gun that isn't on my permit, it is locked in a metal case and the mags ride elsewhere, and the ammo even more elsewhere. Knowing that even the most cockeyed interpretation of the law by the jerkiest policeman won't fly...........is PRICELESS.

[yzErnie]

I believe this. Cop brownie points are given for this sort of thing.

Another ill-informed opinion. Instead of taking jabs at the cops why not give the cops a little credit. I don't understand the constant negitivity on this board when it comes to cops and the jobs they do. Contrary to popular belief, they do not win microwave ovens, toasters or anything else for the amount of arrests they make!!

The mags can be transported loaded but CANNOT be within close proximity to the gun. If the gun is locked in the trunk the loaded mags can be in the locked glovebox. The current rule is the neither can be in close enough proximity of each other or for either to be within arms reach to be grabbed and quickly loaded.