Current Sig quality?

[duenor]

RT13 is spot-on.
It is sad, especially since I'm a very big SIG fan. And, FlyingPen, have you ever actually used SIG's "customer support"? I have. I had to pay $85 for UPS overnight, and got my gun back six weeks later... they claimed that they could not see any problem with the gun. One sentence explanation, no apology, no offer of trade-in, no further contact information. Basically, they told me that my gun runs fine. My own company (EAI) is a miniscule manufacturer compared to SIG. But we would NEVER tell a customer that it's all in their head and to go pound sand. Especially if the gun was a known malfunction queen like the Mosquito (and yes, I did use CCI minimags only).

I am not going to be buying a new SIG for a very long time. And, if you don't believe me that the older SIGs were made better... compare any of the west german P6 handguns with a CPO model. You would think the CPO would be better, right? I mean, it's been rearsenaled by the SIG gunsmiths, right, and certified to be just as good as a new one? Yeah, right. The P6 will win every single time in every category but finish, and even then it might still win because the CPO finish simply doesn't stay on the gun. Take your run of the mill CPO, rack the slide maybe about a dozen times. Then take the slide off. You will almost always notice that the finish on the frame rails near where the hammer is has been abraded off and you can see bare metal underneath.

ps: if you own a business or can provide a service, please go to this thread (http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/s...ad.php?t=97200) and add your info to the list that i'm compiling.

[8200rpm]

I miss the old (1990's) SIG when it was so simple...

P220, P225, P226, P228, P229, P230. It was all business: sell purposeful guns to buyers with a purpose.

Now we have... Rail, Equinox, SAS, Platinum, Elite, SRT, GOTM, Blackwater, Navy, etc. These are nothing more than gimmicks and bling to sell more guns to noobs with cash to burn.

Sadly, SIG has become a marketing company and much less a gun manufacturer. I love the original classic designs, but I hate the new marketing ploys. It's an insult to the intelligence of their customers.

Pay attention to putting together guns, and less attention to coming out with a new flashy gimmick every month. But, they don't care about their old customers with rock solid reliable classic series guns. They need new customers, and what better way to get new customers than with flash and bling.

[FlyingPen]

RT13 is spot-on.
It is sad, especially since I'm a very big SIG fan. And, FlyingPen, have you ever actually used SIG's "customer support"? I have. I had to pay $85 for UPS overnight, and got my gun back six weeks later... they claimed that they could not see any problem with the gun. One sentence explanation, no apology, no offer of trade-in, no further contact information. Basically, they told me that my gun runs fine. My own company (EAI) is a miniscule manufacturer compared to SIG. But we would NEVER tell a customer that it's all in their head and to go pound sand. Especially if the gun was a known malfunction queen like the Mosquito (and yes, I did use CCI minimags only).

I am not going to be buying a new SIG for a very long time. And, if you don't believe me that the older SIGs were made better... compare any of the west german P6 handguns with a CPO model. You would think the CPO would be better, right? I mean, it's been rearsenaled by the SIG gunsmiths, right, and certified to be just as good as a new one? Yeah, right. The P6 will win every single time in every category but finish, and even then it might still win because the CPO finish simply doesn't stay on the gun. Take your run of the mill CPO, rack the slide maybe about a dozen times. Then take the slide off. You will almost always notice that the finish on the frame rails near where the hammer is has been abraded off and you can see bare metal underneath.

ps: if you own a business or can provide a service, please go to this thread (http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/s...ad.php?t=97200) and add your info to the list that i'm compiling.

I haven't had to have anything done with Sig but it seems most people on Sig forums are happy with their CS, not saying everyone is since you obviously had a bad experience.

I have compared four P6s to my CPO P226R and mine is better in every way. I am curious how nice the $300 Dan's Ammo P6s are though.

Let's not forget, Sig had it's share of problems in the past too. They redesigned their problematic trigger spring what like over a dozen times? Some of the older Sigs were also prone to rust and I heard of many other problems. They're just not as well known as the current crop of problems because the Internet wasn't quite as popular back in 1985.

I mean, if you have a Sig when they were made in Switzerland, it's probably the best made Sig ever but short of that, I think we're splitting hairs here.

[duenor]

Obviously, my friend, the people on sig forums are going to be a tad biased. =P But perhaps I am being too harsh. there are always bad guns - contrary to what most people think guns are not produced by giant robots with a human doing nothing more than putting them in their robot slots. well, except for perhaps ruger, which really does have a robotic factory.

if you p226r is excellent, then you are one of the lucky ones. I have three cpos and each was problematic. on one the slide literally rattles like a baby's toy when you shake the grip.

as for the P6s, well, they well made guns. one of the interesting things when you get 50 guns shipped in at once is that you get to see them alongside each other. many have names on the boxes, notes, and in some cases, german data sheets.

in one box the policeman who had it wrote, "1 gun, 2 magazines, 16 cartridges 9mm"

i wonder what happened to the cartridges?

[jermzzzzzzz]

I hate how Sig decided to go to Rails for almost all their handguns. So ugly, they need management, kick that kimber guy out.

[RT13]

Rails, bling bling models, kimberization, etc. Has Sig become a sell out?

I do miss the older simpler "to hell and back reliability" Sigs. Sigforum is definitely the place for learning just about anything about Sigs, pros and cons. The P239, P228 and SigPros seem to be the more reliable models today with very minimal or no issues at all. The P226 in all calibers and P229 in 9mm and .357sig are also pretty reliable and has minimal issues. The P226 X5's and Match/Supermatch P220's have good QA since they are inspected meticulously one by one. They better be perfect for $2K guns! Unfortunately, they should be doing this with every Sig they produce and not just the high end ones.

[jermzzzzzzz]

My P228 is CPO and have not had any problems with it. I LOVE IT!!!

[ExcitedPanda]

My new 226R is still my favorite handgun... and most comfortable of any I have ever tried. Never had a single issue, I think the problems with the Mosquito not manufactured by them has bled in to just irrational consumer panic.

[MKE]

I guess I've been rather lucky. I have several SIGs and none have exhibited any reliability problems. My favorite is the P228 (1996 model), followed by the P226R Blackwater. I've never bought a CPO gun so the flaking won't be an issue for me.

I still value all my SIGs and for me, they all have the quality and reliability we've come to know from SIG. Reports of the earlier CPO flaking problems and the FTE issues may be somewhat isolated but I may hold off on future purchases - especially the GSRs series guns.

[Satex]

My P229R is two years old and it's as reliable as they get.

[tonelar]

I have a suspicion as they've prolly been selling alot to the US Mil already... their QC and CS might have taken a back seat for the time being. Hopefully it doesn't turn into a "only the made in W Germany Sigs are worth a damn anymore" situation.

Not many companies can survive enough bad press.

[savasyn]

Wow, this thread exploded over the weekend. Thanks for all the info, guys!
I ended up ordering the rail mount linked to on the first page for my old 229, so I probably won't be buying a new version(unless I find a great deal.)

To add to the experience discussion, I have three Sigs. My first was the 229 .40 from the early '90s and it has been 100% flawless in function with all types of ammo. It has many thousands of rounds through it and still has all the original springs(including recoil, until later this week). I love this gun!

My next one was a two tone 220 .45 that I got while being impatient waiting for the 220STs to come out back in the early '00s(I think). It has been functionally flawless as well. It has the serrated trigger vs the smooth one and not only do I not like the tactile feel of it, it seems heavier and clunkier in pull than the 229. I'll eventually send it to GrayGuns and have it all fixed up, but it's a low priority.

My third was a recent purchase of a used CPO 226 9mm. So far it has been 100 reliable and decently accurate, though I hate the stock dot/bar sights. One of these days I'll put three dots on it like my other ones. I haven't noticed any problems with the finish yet. The only sign of it being of quality loss so far is that the inner roll pin that goes through the firing pin block towards the rear broke in half. The outer pin seems fine so we just centered the inner pin and it's been fine since.

Maybe I just got really lucky with my 226, but other than the sights, I'm very happy with it. All that being said, neither the 220 or the 226 make me as happy as my old tried and true 229 .40!

[duenor]

A CPO is often a good gun. But most of the time you are better off paying the same amount for a little used gun from the original owner... here on calguns or on sigforums, etc.

[Ballistic043]

i have an sp2022 and love it. i love sig for their triggers but HK's for the looks

[8200rpm]

My P229 .40 is from the mid 90's. It's bone stock, but the trigger is far better then my recent P220R which has a SIG Custom Shop action enhancement package. Go figure. My third SIG is a nicely worn P226 9mm police trade-in (KB date code). The DA trigger was a little heavy, but the SA was always a super crisp, glass rod break. I recently replace the mainspring with a Wolff 18lb (vs. 24lb stock), and now the DA trigger is as good as the stock P229 and P220R w/ AEP.

They all run 100%. I have the strongest attachment to and admiration for the P229 .40. But, the P226 9mm has very little muzzle rise, and it's a joy to shoot. Plus, I have a couple fist fulls of pre-2000 15 round magazines. The P220R is my nightstand gun.