AR Pistol from 80% Lower

[Sir Stunna Lot]

Ok, i think ive read a lot of post regarding ar pistols in general, however, i still have a few questions left that just need a simple yes or no to put my mind at ease before i tackle this project:

1.)
If building from an 80% lower that i completed myself, can the pistol have the foregrip/heat shield? Would this violate any Ca State law or Fed Law or is it uncertain and left open to interpretation?

2.)
Will the pistol from said receiver need any "stamp tax" or needs to be registered as an AOW, SBR, or any other 3 letter acronym? Any paperworks need to be filled out and submited to the State of Ca or to the Feds?

3.)
Can a pistol built from said receiver have a vertical foregrip? Will this violate any Ca State law or Fed Law or is it uncertain and left open to interpretation?

4.)
Can said pistol have magpul's AFG? Will this violate any Ca State law or Fed Law or is it uncertain and left open to interpretation?

5.)
Can a legally pocessed 10+ round mag be used on said pistol?

My ultimate goal is something similar to the picture below + bullet button

[FIREBALL_BRIAN]

I'm not best versed but I will attempt some and give you a money back guarantee ha ha.
1. Yes?
2.doesn't need to be registered because you machines it yourself.
3.no forefrip
4.some say gray area.
5. No normal cap mag

Please correct me if I am wrong. I don't feel solid about my response. Only an attempt

[morrcarr67]

Answers in quote.

Ok, i think ive read a lot of post regarding ar pistols in general, however, i still have a few questions left that just need a simple yes or no to put my mind at ease before i tackle this project:

1.)
If building from an 80% lower that i completed myself, can the pistol have the foregrip/heat shield? Would this violate any Ca State law or Fed Law or is it uncertain and left open to interpretation? YES, no Fed laws broken, the magazine lock you install will make CA happy

2.)
Will the pistol from said receiver need any "stamp tax" or needs to be registered as an AOW, SBR, or any other 3 letter acronym? Any paperworks need to be filled out and submited to the State of Ca or to the Feds? Only if you plan on building a AOW, SBR's are against the law in CA.

3.)
Can a pistol built from said receiver have a vertical foregrip? Will this violate any Ca State law or Fed Law or is it uncertain and left open to interpretation?
It can have a VFG If you build a Title 1 Firearm which is over 26" OAL and a barrel of less than 16" and no extra paper work is needed. If you build a Pistol which is less than 26" OAL and a barrel of less than 16" you just built a AOW and would need to register it as such. Which would also mean that you will probably need an NFA Trust.

4.)
Can said pistol have magpul's AFG? Will this violate any Ca State law or Fed Law or is it uncertain and left open to interpretation? YES, no CA or Federal laws broken, no special registration needed.

5.)
Can a legally pocessed 10+ round mag be used on said pistol? NO, the maximum you may use in a gun with a fixed magazine is 10 rounds.

My ultimate goal is something similar to the picture below + bullet button

[morrcarr67]

Here are your corrections

I'm not best versed but I will attempt some and give you a money back guarantee ha ha.
1. Yes?
2.doesn't need to be registered because you machines it yourself. Wrong
3.no forefrip Wrong
4.some say gray area. You're right but no reason to worry.
5. No normal cap mag Not sure what you mean but a 10 round magazine is ok.

Please correct me if I am wrong. I don't feel solid about my response. Only an attempt

[707electrician]

Answers in quote.

Only one. Correction on yours; no you can't use 10+ mags in a gun with a mag lock

[morrcarr67]

Only one. Correction on yours; no you can't use 10+ mags in a gun with a mag lock

I missed the +. I thought it just said 10. Thank you Sir. I will fix my earlier post.

[Tripper]

Hmm, reading from phone I can't tell what the actual answers are

[Tripper]

It appears morrcarr is suggesting it must be registered??

Didn't 9th circuit say a vfg doesn't change it from a pistol and along the line made it legal, I could very well be thinking of the wrong circuit or mixing cases??

[morrcarr67]

It appears morrcarr is suggesting it must be registered??

Didn't 9th circuit say a vfg doesn't change it from a pistol and along the line made it legal, I could very well be thinking of the wrong circuit or mixing cases??

A VFG doesn't change it from being a pistol.

It does trigger NFA rules though.

A VFG on a pistol makes the pistol an AOW and would be subject to all NFA rules including registration as such.

[gun toting monkeyboy]

A VFG doesn't change it from being a pistol.

It does trigger NFA rules though.

A VFG on a pistol makes the pistol an AOW and would be subject to all NFA rules including registration as such.

Ummm.... No. As you noted in a prior post, if the OAL is >26", it does not turn it into an AOW. And why does it need to be registered? If you make it, doesn't that mean you do not have to register it?

-Mb

[morrcarr67]

Ummm.... No. As you noted in a prior post, if the OAL is >26", it does not turn it into an AOW. And why does it need to be registered? If you make it, doesn't that mean you do not have to register it?

-Mb

3.)
Can a pistol built from said receiver have a vertical foregrip? Will this violate any Ca State law or Fed Law or is it uncertain and left open to interpretation?
It can have a VFG. If the pistol you build is over 26" OAL no extra paper work is needed. If the pistol you build is less than 26" OAL you just built a AOW and would need to register it as such. Which would also mean that you will probably need an NFA Trust.

Read it again MB. The only thing I didn't bring up before was the Title 1 Firearm issue. Federal and CA law have different definitions of "Handguns/Pistols".

I did go back and update my first post with the difference between a Title 1 Firearm and a Pistol.

No need for any paperwork for a Title 1 Firearm.

If you build a firearm regulated by the NFA you will need to register it as such or you would be in big trouble.

[torquefliteterror]

here is a link to franklin armory's page on their ar "other" as you can see it is legal, as long as it is 26" or over. only thing as long as you don't tuck it under your coat it remains "other" if you were to theoretically conceal it , you would be creating an AOW. I think thats how it would be but don't quote me on that. read the letters and you come to your own conclusion.

http://www.franklinarmory.com/PRODUCTS_XO-26.html

here is a link to the afg question. it is the last one answered , yes its legal on a pistol build

https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&pid=explorer&chrome=true&srcid=0B0qyloA 48O3XZWFjYjMwYTMtYTg1MC00NzVhLWI3NmMtZDRiNTMzNzdhM zUx&hl=en&pli=1

[gun toting monkeyboy]

A VFG doesn't change it from being a pistol.

It does trigger NFA rules though.

A VFG on a pistol makes the pistol an AOW and would be subject to all NFA rules including registration as such.

But your first sentence and your last sentence contradict each other. The first one says a VFG doesn't change it, the last one says it does. And you still haven't answered where it says we have to register 80% lower route handguns.

[Sir Stunna Lot]

thank for all the answer so far, however, more questions came to mind as i read over the answers:

6.)
Is there a difference between building an AR pistol (from 80% lower) with an OAL <26" vs OAL >26" (both have barrel <26")

7.)
Do i need to "register* it as an AOW with either one of the options above?

[Cokebottle]

1.) If building from an 80% lower that i completed myself, can the pistol have the foregrip/heat shield? Would this violate any Ca State law or Fed Law or is it uncertain and left open to interpretation?

The issue is the "barrel shroud"
The AR platform has a magazine outside of the pistol grip, therefore it MUST have a bullet button to be legal (applies to rimfire as well).
The bullet button cancels the fact that the "barrel shroud" is an evil feature.

2.) Will the pistol from said receiver need any "stamp tax" or needs to be registered as an AOW, SBR, or any other 3 letter acronym? Any paperworks need to be filled out and submited to the State of Ca or to the Feds?

Negative. Build it, shoot it, enjoy it.

3.) Can a pistol built from said receiver have a vertical foregrip? Will this violate any Ca State law or Fed Law or is it uncertain and left open to interpretation?

Federal law, no uncertainty at all. A vertical forward grip creates an AOW and would require an NFA trust and tax stamp.

4.) Can said pistol have magpul's AFG? Will this violate any Ca State law or Fed Law or is it uncertain and left open to interpretation?

I would not do it because the AFG does allow for a "pistol style grasp"
Many Calgunners use it and nobody has reported any problems.
The BATFE has stated that the use of the AFG does NOT create an AOW, however, the BATFE accepts a long gun as legal so long as the extended length is 26", California requires the minimum length to be 26".

So the issue is, how would a California prosecutor and jury view the AFG?

5.) Can a legally pocessed 10+ round mag be used on said pistol?

No.
10rd limit applies to all semi-automatic centerfire rifles and all semiautomatic pistols with a fixed magazine.
The 10rd limit does not apply to fixed-magazine semi-automatic shotguns.

My ultimate goal is something similar to the picture below + bullet button

That would be perfectly legal.