Kimber Failed Me :(

[Dont Tread on Me]

I have the same problem with safeties on H&Ks, Berrettas, S&Ws etc. I don't have the same concern about readability and capacity with these guns.

"Personally a sweep down thumb motion with a adrenaline rush in place is a very natural and easy to do for me."

How have you tested that?

[BigMac]

You'll notice the 1911 problems go up in fancier 'race guns' with ultratight tolerances - sensitivity to ammo, mags, etc.

An out of the box Colt 1911 doesn't have these problems.

I'd bet my life on any of my 1911s using factory ammo. I've never had a problem with them and they are the equal of my Glock 21, performance wise.

I love these threads about what gun is better than this or that.. the worst factory stock 1911 I ever owned was a Colt series 80.


Bill, what have you dont to the board members here that they all tiptoe around disagreeing with you?? Isn't that the point of a discusion board is to hash stuff out we disagree about?

[s281c]

I have the same problem with safeties on H&Ks, Berrettas, S&Ws etc. I don't have the same concern about readability and capacity with these guns.

"Personally a sweep down thumb motion with a adrenaline rush in place is a very natural and easy to do for me."

How have you tested that?

Yes.........

[taloft]

In times of stress you tend to fall back on your training. If you trained to drop the thumb safety, then you will drop the safety without thinking about it. Building muscle memory is critical in self defense. If you don't train with the 1911 platform, then the safeties or limp wristing might get you in a world of trouble. Range guns are a poor choice to test reliability. You can find examples of winners and losers in every model if you look for them. Look on most forums and you will hear stories of every model having issues.

Simply put, all firearm designs have their own inherent problems. It is your job to make sure the gun you use for defense is fuctioning properly, clean, and you're trained with it. It is a poor craftsmen who blames his tools. JMHO.

[SnWnMe]

What materials and manufacturing techniques have we developed over the last one hundred years?.

You're answering my question with a question. You made a statement about how the 1911 is a compromise of manufacturing techniques. I ask, in what way?

[slick_711]

Clearly this debate can only be settled in one way.

3pm tomorrow, at the flagpole. Bring your friends.


You shoot what you're comfortable with, have trained with, and shoot well. We're all bound to have differences of opinion, so let's respect eachother's opinions in that regard.

That said, anyone who dislikes the 1911 is wrong. It's seen more combat, in more countries, in the hands of more people, than any other pistol I can think of that is still in use today. And for the guys saying "well, have you put yourself to the test in taking off the safety?" No, I haven't been tested. But I've trained myself long & hard, and under pressure, muscle memory & training are king. How do I know that? Because people who have seen action and have been tested, have proved it.

You can all go shoot Glocks & HKs and Sigs all you want, I've never said a bad thing about any of them. But if I don't die of old age I'll die with an empty AR a few feet away and an empty 1911 in my hand, surrounded by brass from both and the bodies of whoever came for me. You couldn't convince me to rely on anything else in a time of need. I understand though that by rambling online I'm not going to convince any of you to rely on a 1911 because I said so... so let's agree to disagree.

[Dont Tread on Me]

Yep, we've elicited some diverse opinions on the 1911! I'm certainly always amazed by the number of folks who just really love the platform. I might have to buy one.

[gunsnrovers]

ca_brit, that's pretty classic. You titled one of your posts "reliability sucks" yet you've never owned a 1911?

[slick_711]

I was wondering about that myself. Seems to always be those who have not tried it that want to talk it down.

[Dont Tread on Me]

ca_brit, that's pretty classic. You titled one of your posts "reliability sucks" yet you've never owned a 1911?

I was wondering about that myself. Seems to always be those who have not tried it that want to talk it down.

Gents, I made my experience with watching others shoot the 1911 very clear in my earlier post with this title. I have also had plenty of training and trigger time on the platform so it is an informed choice not to own one. I might get one as a safe queen range gun as they do look cool and have nice triggers but I'll never trust my life to one.

[bwiese]

I think this thread is running out of steam, so I will lay my cards on the table.

A previous poster suggested that I probably had "a bad experience" with a 1911.

My experience with 1911s has been mixed. I do currently own two Kimber 1911s including the one the original poster rented. I either own or have owned the following 1911s, all of which I purchased new.

Custom Classic
Custom Stainless
Pro Elite
Compact CDP II
TLE/RL2
Compact CDP II
TLE II
Springfield TRP
Baer TRS

Of these, 1/3 had function problems out of the box that were not magazine or ammunition or "limp wristing" or "break in" related.

So you have just reported on mostly-Kimber reliability, not 1911 reliability.

Yes, shorty 1911s do have a few more issues than std 5" 1911s but there are plenty of Colt Commanders and Officers' ACPs that work just fine.

I think people try to move regular 1911s too much toward 'race gun' category. JM Browning designed the platform for a certain amount of slop/tolerance and when things get pushed beyond this, weirdness ensues.

Also, people are shooting some weird-*** ammo these days, when 1911 was designed for 230gr FMJ. I've also seen Glock 21s & Sig 220s have feed issues with some 180gr TMJ flat nose rounds.

[Lotsa folks shooting the fancy guns are also shooting reloads, which cloud the gun-failure stats.]

That being said, I would not trade one my Colt 5" 1911s for 3 top-end Kimbers.

[leelaw]

That being said, I would not trade one my Colt 5" 1911s for 3 top-end Kimbers.

I wouldn't trade my top of the line Kimber for three of your My Little Ponies

[psriley]

Thank you. This is what I said in my earlier post. But instead of questioning technique. Most would rather argue about which gun is best. This guy that had this problem normally shoots a 38 special revolver and refers to magazines as clips. Obviously does not know squat about pistols. Limp wristing is very likely the cause as I stated earlier. But go ahead and just keep arguing about which pistol is best.
Guess most aren't really interested in reviewing the entire situation anyway.

OP stated that Kimber had failed him and that he was discouraged about 1911s. I related a similar experience after firing several different guns from several different manufacturers, and what I did to ultimately achieve a satisfactory result, hoping that this might be of some help to the OP. Pretty on-target as far as I'm concerned.

[chickenfried]

One could just replace the word "1911" with "latest uber modern wunder pistol" and your paragraph would be just as true .

I don't know if it's the money people sink into 1911s or the lore behind them, but there's always some attempt to compartmentalize reported problems. "Oh, it's just Kimbers that are the problem." "Oh, it just needs Wilson magazines." "Oh, it doesn't work with Wilson magazines, it needs PowerMags." "Oh, it just doesn't like Federal ammo." "Oh, it just needs more extractor tension... less extractor tension... the feedramp polished..."

There is a strong similarity between guys who defend 1911s and women who stay with men who beat them. The 1911 also reminds me of this little poem:

There was a little girl
Who had a little curl
Right in the middle of her forehead;
And when she was good
She was very, very good,
But when she was bad she was horrid.

[chickenfried]

You got me a few of those are 1911 specific. But a lot of them are standard excuses for any type of firearm. Sure 1911's aren't perfect but neither are the latest uber wunder pistols, despite what the ads and gunwriters say

Oh, it's just the early XXX guns or XXX series guns that had problems.

Oh, you just need to find ammo the gun likes.

"Needs more lube" -- Nope

"Needs less lube" -- Probably!

"Needs to be cleaned" - Nope

"Limpwristing" -- Warranty dept verbiage for "we sold you a gun that doesn't work right but we don't want it back."

"Breakin period" -- Warranty dept verbiage for "we sold you a gun that doesn't work right but we're really slammed with other returns right now, can you please send it back later."