9mm/.357 mag question

[pyro3k2]

Trying to find an answer to the .45 vs 9mm debate (not a lot of luck with that btw) I came across a very interesting point. The top reason why people talk the 9mm down is because of it's small bullet diameter. Converting it over into the english measuring system it's .354 which is just .003 off from the fabled .357 mag.

The avg. muzzle velocity from a 115gr fmj 9mm is around 1,300fps. The avg, muzzle velocity from the 125gr fmj .357 mag is around 1,600fps. Paintball markers are normally limited to 280fps and 300fps(in tournements) and I have been shot with paint balls at 300fps on multiple occasions and with adrenaline going from the game i've had to have other people tell me when i've been hit since I wont feel it sometimes. So in my mind the 300fps gap between the two rounds isn't a big deal.

With the correct ammunition choices i.e. +p or +p+ 9mm rounds can achieve the muzzle velocity of the .357 mag and even the standard 9mm round has more muzzle velocity than a .38 special which also has a .357 bullet diameter or 9.1mm

My question is: If the 9mm is being downgrade becuase of it's sub-par bullet diameter then why isn't the same being said of the .357mag or the .38special?

[Quiet]

Check out the .357SIG.

[FUBAR]

The 125grn 357 mag has enough velocity to create some serious disturbance inside the human cavity. I think its called hydro static shock. It basically makes your inside into soup. The 38 special has doesnt have the velocity to perform. IMO, the 9mm is plenty for self defense. Its controllable for multiple shots and with the right bullet is a proven man stopper. To me, dead is dead but some just want them deader.

[sirgiles]

http://www.firearmstactical.com/pdf/fbi-hwfe.pdf

This study usually stops discussion on caliber wars.

if your looking for other discussions on these calibers.

http://www.glockpost.com/forums/showthread.php?t=7292

[smittty]

I believe the issue is with type of bullets and the military's negative experience with their use ball ammo. If they could use modern hollowpoint bullets they would have better results.

The caliber debate is really waste of energy. 45acp is great, so is the 40sw, etc. Choose what you like but it really doesn't make a lot of difference. Hitting your target makes the bigger difference.

I like the 45acp but I also like 9mm. I don't have a 40sw anymore because I don't feel it's better than my 9mm and if I feel like making a bigger hole I'll choose the 45.

Your better off with a 9mm pistol with lots of practise!

[FUBAR]

True that smitty.

[elSquid]

My question is: If the 9mm is being downgrade becuase of it's sub-par bullet diameter then why isn't the same being said of the .357mag or the .38special?

Blame gun magazines, and the need to fill space between advertisements.

-- Michael

[slobson]

http://www.firearmstactical.com/pdf/fbi-hwfe.pdf

This study usually stops discussion on caliber wars.

if your looking for other discussions on these calibers.
http://www.glockpost.com/forums/showthread.php?t=7292

a bit tough to take the guy seriously when he thinks handguns top out at 1500 fps. not saying my 45ACP is going 1550 or anything, but there are plenty of modern cartridges that will . . .

but as has been said in this and other threads AD NAUSEAM, the biggest factor in what you are carrying or shooting is where you can put it. if you are a bear of a man and you can snap off double taps with a .454 casull, then more power to you; if a mere mortal like me, then practice extra with a 9 and a 45, a convenient excuse to go to the range more often, albeit completely unnecessary

[-hanko]

a bit tough to take the guy seriously when he thinks handguns top out at 1500 fps. not saying my 45ACP is going 1550 or anything, but there are plenty of modern cartridges that will . . .

but as has been said in this and other threads AD NAUSEAM, the biggest factor in what you are carrying or shooting is where you can put it. if you are a bear of a man and you can snap off double taps with a .454 casull, then more power to you; if a mere mortal like me, then practice extra with a 9 and a 45, a convenient excuse to go to the range more often, albeit completely unnecessary

In addition, a .357 magnum can also handle up to 180 gr bullets, though commonly the top end in factory ammo is 158gr.

The Sig is comparable to the Mag up to 125gr, but that's where the comparison stops.

All the comparisons assume perfect bullet placement, which doesn't happen in the real world. YOUR shooting ability overshadows both caliber and bullet weight.

Finally, don't believe everything you read in magazines or see on the interweb...

Have you ever seen a BAD review in a gun mag??

-hanko

[NotEnoughGuns]

a 9mm bullet is actually .356

[locosway]

The 9mm is a .356, and there's nothing wrong with it. The FBI put out a study that showed there was no difference between any modern semi-auto round that was used for duty, i.e. 9mm, .40, .45.

Now, me personally, I use my 10mm for most things. However, I trust my 9mm just the same where barriers are not involved.

Depending on what you're doing one round may be better than the other. I know when I do competition shooting I find it cheaper to shoot my 9mm over my 10mm. So usually I run around with my 9mm strapped on.

There's also something else. I had this same feeling that maybe there was some truth to the 9mm vs. .45 debate. So I tried to look around and see what models and data were available. I didn't like what I saw so I made my own performance model which you can find at http://gryman.com/rpf/ This model will show you the differences in rounds based on their features such as FPS, grains, and caliber.

[shooting4life]

Most if he down talk of 9mm came from the military because they could not use hollow points and where stck with fmj. With modern bullets 9mm is all you need for a self defense handgun.

[cineski]

10 grains and 300 fps is a darn big deal ballistics wise.

[Flying Bones]

According to "Surgical Speed Shooting" the goal is to cut the spinal cord by placing rounds in the triangle between the nipples and lower throat, negating the bullet caliber debate (more/less) and replacing it with a number of accurate shots in this region as fast as possible.

Just another opinion, not mine, but logical.

[kurac]

If your paint ball was instead made out of lead and moving at 300fps, I am sure you would feel it.