MP Shield LCI

[vintagearms]

Bought the No profile one. Tap out the pin (not all the way), remove the factory one. Place the no profile one in and gently tap the pin back in place. Literally took less than a minute.

[WartHog]

AS much as I hate them, and most of my guns don't have them

the LCI on the shield is pretty much easily ignored

Ditto - I pulled mine off and soaked it in some paint remover for a couple of hours and was easily able to remove the red paint and white lettering. I really don't see what all the whining is about other than the fact that the PRK forced the Chamber Load Indicator upon us.

[Mayor McRifle]

So my question is how hard is it to swap this out? I see the Apex LCI is the way to go but what about installing? Can it just be tapped out?

It's not hard at all. I put the "no profile" Apex LCI replacement in my Shield.

Just watch this and follow along:

http://youtu.be/ndRRZG8AQ3M

[Mayor McRifle]

FYI.

CA requires a Chamber Load Indicator (CLI) [PC 16380], not a Loaded Chamber Indicator (LCI).

All Chamber Load Indicators are Loaded Chamber Indicators, but not all Loaded Chamber Indicators are Chamber Load Indicators.

Chamber Load Indicator (CLI) on the S&W M&P Shield...


Loaded Chamber Indicator (LCI) on the S&W M&P Shield...



Penal Code 16380
As used in this part, "chamber load indicator" means a device that plainly indicates that a cartridge is in the firing chamber. A device satisfies this definition if it is readily visible, has incorporated or adjacent explanatory text or graphics, or both, and is designed and intended to indicate to a reasonably foreseeable adult user of the pistol, without requiring the user to refer to a user's manual or any other resource other than the pistol itself, whether a cartridge is in the firing chamber.

Are you implying that this requirement applies to pistols after they are purchased? If so, could you cite that section of the California Penal Code?

These sections are all I could find on LCIs and magazine disconnects, and they appear to only apply to guns submitted to the State of California for safety testing and initial sale:

California Penal Code Section 32010(d)(2):
Commencing January 1, 2007, no center-fire semiautomatic pistol may be submitted for testing pursuant to Sections 31900 to 32110, inclusive, if it does not have both a chamber load indicator and a magazine disconnect mechanism.

California Penal Code Section 16380:
As used in this part, "chamber load indicator" means a device that plainly indicates that a cartridge is in the firing chamber. A device satisfies this definition if it is readily visible, has incorporated or adjacent explanatory text or graphics, or both, and is designed and intended to indicate to a reasonably foreseeable adult user of the pistol, without requiring the user to refer to a user's manual or any other resource other than the pistol itself, whether a cartridge is in the firing chamber.

California Penal Code Section 16900:
As used in this part, "magazine disconnect mechanism" means a mechanism that prevents a semiautomatic pistol that has a detachable magazine from operating to strike the primer of ammunition in the firing chamber when a detachable magazine is not inserted in the semiautomatic pistol.

[John Browning]

He is not implying that at all. Quiet knows his stuff.

[Quiet]

Are you implying that this requirement applies to pistols after they are purchased? If so, could you cite that section of the California Penal Code?

These sections are all I could find on LCIs and magazine disconnects, and they appear to only apply to guns submitted to the State of California for safety testing and initial sale:

California Penal Code Section 32010(d)(2):
Commencing January 1, 2007, no center-fire semiautomatic pistol may be submitted for testing pursuant to Sections 31900 to 32110, inclusive, if it does not have both a chamber load indicator and a magazine disconnect mechanism.

California Penal Code Section 16380:
As used in this part, "chamber load indicator" means a device that plainly indicates that a cartridge is in the firing chamber. A device satisfies this definition if it is readily visible, has incorporated or adjacent explanatory text or graphics, or both, and is designed and intended to indicate to a reasonably foreseeable adult user of the pistol, without requiring the user to refer to a user's manual or any other resource other than the pistol itself, whether a cartridge is in the firing chamber.

California Penal Code Section 16900:
As used in this part, "magazine disconnect mechanism" means a mechanism that prevents a semiautomatic pistol that has a detachable magazine from operating to strike the primer of ammunition in the firing chamber when a detachable magazine is not inserted in the semiautomatic pistol.

Penal Code 31910
As used in this part, "unsafe handgun" means any pistol, revolver, or other firearm capable of being concealed upon the person, for which any of the following is true:
(b) For a pistol:
(1) It does not have a positive manually operated safety device, as determined by standards relating to imported guns promulgated by the federal Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives.
(2) It does not meet the firing requirement for handguns.
(3) It does not meet the drop safety requirement for handguns.
(5) Commencing January 1, 2007, for all center fire semiautomatic pistols that are not already listed on the roster pursuant to Section 32015, it does not have both a chamber load indicator and if it has a detachable magazine, a magazine disconnect mechanism.

[iambrian]

When you guys put in the Apex no-profile indicator, do you leave the spring in or just remove it?

[Mayor McRifle]

Penal Code 31910
As used in this part, "unsafe handgun" means any pistol, revolver, or other firearm capable of being concealed upon the person, for which any of the following is true:
(b) For a pistol:
(1) It does not have a positive manually operated safety device, as determined by standards relating to imported guns promulgated by the federal Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives.
(2) It does not meet the firing requirement for handguns.
(3) It does not meet the drop safety requirement for handguns.
(5) Commencing January 1, 2007, for all center fire semiautomatic pistols that are not already listed on the roster pursuant to Section 32015, it does not have both a chamber load indicator and if it has a detachable magazine, a magazine disconnect mechanism.

Again, that is a listing of requirements for guns to be added to the roster of approved handguns for initial sale within the state. Subsection 7 of Section 31910 even discusses the microstamping requirements. Do you have any citations for penal code sections that mandate such features on handguns after their initial sale?

[Mayor McRifle]

When you guys put in the Apex no-profile indicator, do you leave the spring in our just remove it?

I left mine in so I wouldn't lose it, but it doesn't matter whether you leave it in or take it out.

[pacrat]

Penal Code 31910
As used in this part, "unsafe handgun" means any pistol, revolver, or other firearm capable of being concealed upon the person, for which any of the following is true:
(b) For a pistol:
(1) It does not have a positive manually operated safety device, as determined by standards relating to imported guns promulgated by the federal Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives.
(2) It does not meet the firing requirement for handguns.
(3) It does not meet the drop safety requirement for handguns.
(5) Commencing January 1, 2007, for all center fire semiautomatic pistols that are not already listed on the roster pursuant to Section 32015, it does not have both a chamber load indicator and if it has a detachable magazine, a magazine disconnect mechanism.

That quote of PC-31910 is parsed from the section [31900 thru 31910]. Which deals with requirements to place handguns ON the ROSTER of SAFE Handguns. It has nothing to do with what modifications an owner can make to a handgun after purchasing it.

http://www.leginfo.ca.gov/cgi-bin/displaycode?section=pen&group=31001-32000&file=31900-31910

And is mentioned as such in the PC quote from Mayor McRifle.

California Penal Code Section 32010(d)(2):
Commencing January 1, 2007, no center-fire semiautomatic pistol may be submitted for testing pursuant to Sections 31900 to 32110, inclusive, if it does not have both a chamber load indicator and a magazine disconnect mechanism.


Further down PC 31910 in section [7], it mentions micro stamping requirements to place on roster. Doesn't mean all semi auto pistols are now illegal if the don't have micro stamp ability. It means they can't be submitted for testing.

EDIT............well poop, Mayor McRifle posted while I was composing this post and getting a cup of coffee.

[vintagearms]

I left mine in so I wouldn't lose it, but it doesn't matter whether you leave it in or take it out.

If there is any play between the non LCI and the upper, retaining the original spring does add tension keeping it from any movement. (however slight that may be)