Defense ammo question.

[XDJYo]

+1 on Federal HST. In my wife's Glock 19 (shorter barrel), we use 124 Grain +P. We switched from Speer Gold Dots.

ETA: Youtube test of HST in 9mm +P. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=COVoBwR1oww

Check out tnoutdoors9 youtube channel. He has A TON of ballistic gel tests and are devoid of personal opinion for the most part. He has the same format for all of his tests and displays the same data for each test.

Once you've narrowed down your choices, go to your local gun shop and pick up a box of 20 or so and shoot it to make sure it cycles in your gun. Take your top pick and buy a box of 50 or 100. I would check out sgammo.com They have excellent prices and have a great variety of bullet weights and pressures. Then, make sure those 50-100 cycle in all of your magazines. Then, final step is to get your final box of 50-100. Load those up in your gun and keep in your drawer/safe etc for HD.

Don't forget to carry while you're at home too. Make sure you have a comfortable holster. Scumbags don't always wait until you're asleep to try and rob/rape/kill you.

Be vigilant, keep your head and eyes up, stay safe.

[Friesland]

Bushwack44,"Looking for a bit of education and advice.

I'm going to begin using a CZ PCR 9MM for home defense and not sure what ammo to get. Specifically, I see hollow points run from 115gr to 124 to 147 (have shot all three at the range so I am familiar with recoil management). Assuming in time of need, my target would be no more then 7 yards away. Wouldn't a 115r hollow point be more effective then 147r?"

How does the recoil and target printing change (with the CZ 75 PCR) with the different ammo. weights? I'm under the impression the 115 gr. is snapper and the 147r. is softer recoiling?

[twentyeggs]

Bushwack44,"Looking for a bit of education and advice.

I'm going to begin using a CZ PCR 9MM for home defense and not sure what ammo to get. Specifically, I see hollow points run from 115gr to 124 to 147 (have shot all three at the range so I am familiar with recoil management). Assuming in time of need, my target would be no more then 7 yards away. Wouldn't a 115r hollow point be more effective then 147r?"

How does the recoil and target printing change (with the CZ 75 PCR) with the different ammo. weights? I'm under the impression the 115 gr. is snapper and the 147r. is softer recoiling?

I would think the heavier the weight the snappier. Think newtons laws. If your pushing a 10lbs sack over the table vs a 100 lbs sack. which one is going to give you the most resistance. The only time weight reduces recoil is when it is on the gun itself.

[Bushwack44]

For a quasi-follow up based on my original post...Went to the range last weekend with my CZ PCR and the following ammo:

Remington 115gr FMJ
Remington 115gr HTP JHP
Federal 124gr FMJ
Federal 124gr JHP

I have 4 mags and put a full mag in each. I could not tell the difference between a 115gr in either FMJ or HP. Same applies to 124gr. But I could tell the difference between shooting 115gr vs a 124gr (I also had a box of 147gr Federal FMJ and those definitely have more recoil then a 124gr).

Using the 124gr, I loaded two mags alternating between FMJ & HP. Couldn't tell the difference which round left the barrel. As for any of the 4 rounds I had no FTFs or FTEs (shot 70 rounds total of 115gr, 60 rounds of 124gr FMJ and 50 rounds of 124gr HP).

Purpose of this exercise was to understand managing the pistol (I'll assume under stress as it is for home defense) using 124gr (always shot 115gr previously using this PCR) and to confirm I would have no feed issues with 124gr HP.

Based on previous feedback and some YouTube videos, I'll (hopefully never have to) use Federal 124gr JHP for home defense.

[Bushwack44]

What were your splits? A timer never lies.

I'm not that scientific. I just hope if found in the situation of self defense, I can pull the trigger and not wet my shorts.

[floogy]

Unless FMJ/solid-copper is ideal for things things you might want to defend yourself from. Pretty sure nobody would recommend JHP for a bear. Yes, for HD, JHP is the only way to go. The alternating round thing might be (and is, in my opinion) a good solution for when you don't know if an attacker will have 2 or 4 legs.

Yes, home defense. Not hypothetical bear defense with a 9mm. A 9mm is a poor choice for any animal that requires the penetration of a solid bullet. If you must defend your home or property against animals there's no reason not to use long gun.

9mm fmj is terribly inefficient against man or beast. The alternating magazine for a home defense 9mm is a solution looking for a problem.

If you're talking about say, a 10mm or other capable dangerous animal round it changes a bit. Loading the mag full of 200 grain hard cast won't be any less effective than alternating bullets. No one/thing is going to shrug off a 10 mm hard cast. Except maybe a bear. [emoji1]

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[BoJackUSMC]

People keep saying that 10mm for camping gun or to fight off bear... i go with cheaper route... invite fat friend you can outrun lol...

[Citizen_B]

9mm fmj is terribly inefficient against man or beast.

All handgun rounds share similar in/effectiveness regarding wounds on humans. There is no magic dust in a 10mm that makes bodies explode.

Putting multiple rounds on target is what increases effectiveness.

Animals are a different story.

[NorCalRT]

Is the +p in the HST 147gr not as good as the standard pressure?

Standard pressure tested better, but +P is only 50fps faster so the difference in performance is negligible when you consider different barrel lengths. However, I can only find regular for around $30 a box and +P for $22 a box, that IS a difference I can measure.

[CockedAndLocked]

When it comes to home defense, the most important thing is that you hit the target, it really doesn't matter what ammo you're using at that point.

That all being said, Federal HST 147 is what I have loaded

[XDJYo]

I would also concur with others that no matter what bullet you choose, if you can't hit it, then it don't matter.

Research a good quality HD round. Make sure it cycles in your gun with all your mags. Then, get some training. Local ranges have training classes for SD. Check them out. Practice what you learn. Stay on top of your skills as it is a perishable skill.

Be safe.


Sent by a Monkey in Outer Space

[floogy]

All handgun rounds share similar in/effectiveness regarding wounds on humans. There is no magic dust in a 10mm that makes bodies explode.

Putting multiple rounds on target is what increases effectiveness.

Animals are a different story.

Oh I realize that. That's why I said said bears could shrug off a 10mm hardcast (maybe). But multiple rounds of 9mm fmj will make a pissed off bear more pissed off but not necessarily stop it. I would go so far as to say probably wouldn't. I also noted that if defending against animals was a necessity, (a remote chance almost anywhere here in CA) a long gun is much better.

Honestly I find the whole notion of a "bear handgun" in CA almost laughable. If you aren't stupid enough to feed them or get in between a mom and her cubs the chances of needing the gun and actually using it effectively are vanishingly small. Way too much fantasy about deadly charging black bears. An excellent excuse to buy a shiny .454 Casull.

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[floogy]

When it comes to home defense, the most important thing is that you hit the target, it really doesn't matter what ammo you're using at that point.

That all being said, Federal HST 147 is what I have loaded

Right. I'll also take the edge that good quality jhp gives and HST is some of the best.

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[Bad Caselaw]

I think you missed one.

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Never mind.




Caselaw