Does anyone still prefer .40?

[riderr]

And yet performance on target is extremely similar. Shots on ballistic gelatin pretty consistently show similar cavity and penetration depth. How well the hollow point expands relies on a number of factors (plus a bit of luck), but at times 9mm HP loads have expanded to be the same size or at times greater than expanded 40SW HP loads.

I am sure you can prove it if compare the best 9mm with the worst .40. However, the average expanded .40 is larger than the average expanded 9mm. Same goes for the gel ballistic tests.

Even when they do not, it usually isn't any greater than .05'', hardly significant and hardly anything worth noting. It is splitting hairs.

Even in your (biased) example, it's 13%. More statistically accurate estimate will be around 20%. My biased probe will go up to 25%. So, 20% is not a game changer, but something you'd certainly consider, wouldn't you? I am sure some 9mm JHP expanding 20% over competitors' will win the market overnight (considering all other characteristics are similar)

And 147gr vs 180gr or 124gr vs 165gr, about 40gr of difference, again splitting hairs.

again it's 18%-25% difference. No big deal for you? Well, it's half way between 9mm 147gr and .45 230gr. So, if 147gr is the same as 180 gr on your scale, then I will make a statement, that 180gr is 230gr to me

So, in the nutshell, expanded .40 is about 20% larger and 20% heavier than 9mm. Whether it's important or not is a personal decision.

Another one of "Obama's sons" isn't going to be able to tell the difference between em. If you really gotta hulk out it can be done with the 9mm, +p+ will do it, it just isn't popular because it doesn't make enough difference to worry about.

I've heard this point many times. If you are rich enough to practice with +p+, go for it. Otherwise, practicing with 9mm reloads and carrying +p+ is kind of inconsistent. The recoil difference might be surprising.

Couldn't disagree more. As someone has had 40 to 9 conversion kits, they are not reliable. The slide face of the 40 is larger, which gives a little play for the extractor. The ejector is different and there is also the potential for misfeeds with the magazine. Are they cool at the range, sure? In your no law situation, not very cool. What I learned from 40 to 9 conversions, your gonna favor one. Get the one in the caliber that you favor. If you really want both, than buy both.

Back when I was green and bought my first handgun it was a Glock in 40. I have never owned another 40 again and never will. That was the only 40 I've ever shot well. Haven't shot any other 40s well. I hate 40.

I'll soften my stance. It may depend on the gun. Possibly Glocks have this issue. I tried it with P226 and Shield. Bangs every time with all kind of ammo. The added value (again, it's no law situation) is that P226 .40 10rd CA-compliant mag holds 12 9mm rounds ('course I've never tried it, just saw a vid on interwebs ). Coincidentally, it's 20% extra too

[Intel0116]

And yet performance on target is extremely similar. Shots on ballistic gelatin pretty consistently show similar cavity and penetration depth. How well the hollow point expands relies on a number of factors (plus a bit of luck), but at times 9mm HP loads have expanded to be the same size or at times greater than expanded 40SW HP loads. Even when they do not, it usually isn't any greater than .05'', hardly significant and hardly anything worth noting

Thats not an accurate statement. The Winchester Ranger T series chambered in .40 can reach up to .91 inches when expanded. Isent the best expanding 9mm around .78? to me thats noteable....

Also, ballistic gelatin dosent have bone or muscle.....

[Steve_In_29]

Bought a Ruger in .40SW back in the day but quickly decided the caliber was an answer to a question I never really asked. So I sold it to my brother and continued on with my 1911s.

[crufflers]

What sold me on it mainly is that in the right pistol, it can be very easy to shoot. Many handguns are indeed "snappier" with .40, Glocks in particular are my least favorite for .40 S&W, but the P229, USP, 4006, and CZ75 are very pleasant to fire in .40

It is very accurate and pleasant to shoot in my first .40 S&W gun - a CZ40B. I think that gun cost me $300 new and is a great shooter. Basically a CZ75 with a 1911 type grip angle and alloy frame. Not heavy or punishing to shoot in the least. My gen3 Glock 22's are nice to shoot too.

[PseudoTsuga]

ROTFLMAO! I don't think its PseudoTsugo living in his mommas basement. I hear these wild SHTF scenarios, and I really wonder about the people that dream them up.

Thanks. Me too. I just shake my head and wonder what people are thinking, mostly.

[GunNut666]

I started shooing 40 last year, because my wife won an M&P40 at a CWA dinner. It was shorty before it fell off the roster. This caused me to buy dies and reload another caliber. Which caused me to buy a glock 20sf because the dies are the same. I'm now happily shooting both.

[SB1964]

I have a G23 that I like & finally bought a Stormlake 9mm barrel for it. The conversion barrel is really accurate & I like the gun in a 9mm configuration. Ammo is a bit cheaper & when everyone flips out next summer/fall, I can use .40 or 9.

To answer, I'd say for the most part no.

[jdmacl]

Yes

[Fishslayer]

I think he means .40SW or 40 Short and Weak.

AKA the 10mm Kurz...

[crufflers]

I'm curious, since I see this argument a lot, how these strides have somehow only been made in the projectiles for 9mm, and not also in the same projectiles from the same companies...in the .40 size and the .45 size?
It's a strange argument to make...to me.

IMHO, there had always been an ancient race of mostly OLD 1911 guys that said just shoot good old ball ammo or 230 grain FMJ out of your .45 and it is just peachy (and it will actually feed reliably cause that OLD gun was not designed for thangs like new fangled bullets with holes in them). The best thing since sliced Wonder bread. Big round nosed atomic copper cannon ball sized holes will bleed a BG out instantly and turn him inside out without the need for speed or the need to blossom like a gay flower. Why worry about flowers blooming when you can just lob a HUGE 230 grain slug at an amazing 800 fps!

I always felt like it made sense only if you were comparing a .45 acp ball round with say 350 to 400 ft lbs of energy (yep, that's all they have) to a modern 9mm with something like 147 grain HST's or similarly awesome new FAST bullet that opens up reliably and predictably to eighty caliber or something ridiculous.

YES, .40 S&W and .45 ACP and 10mm, etc... have benefited from new bullet technology as well.

[crufflers]

9mm HST 147 326@1000
9mm Gold Dot HP 147 317@985
9mm +P HST 147 360@1050

40 SW HST 165 468@1130
40 SW GDHP 165 484@1150

[kayaker]

If you think your 9mm will do the same thing a .40 or .45 will do, go shoot some steel plates or poppers. .40 and .45 hit with similar authority, 9mm. not so much.

[epwegmann]

Only if you have visible abs.

[kayaker]

Don't even try to shoot a .40 unless you have visible abs, you won't be able to handle the massive recoil.

My wife has visible abs though.

[Steve_In_29]

Don't even try to shoot a .40 unless you have visible abs, you won't be able to handle the massive recoil.

My wife has visible abs though.

Worthless without pics to back it up.