who hates this?

[SD13]

^^
The gang colors is legitimate though. If school's won't allow you to wear gang colors on campus, it's only logical that a gun shop probably shouldn't either. The last thing any store wants is to do is have people associate their store with gangs; it's worse for a gun store since it may give people the impression that you're arming the gangs, too. You would have to be monumentally crazy/retarded to be wearing local gang colors when you're not in a gang; since dealers can't sell guns to mentally handicapped or insane people, it makes no sense to let them in :P.

Look how well that policy has worked for public schools, i mean no disrespect to you but anyone whos gone to a public school could tell you their policies are anything but efficient.

If you really wanna get down to it look at columbine and any other act of school related violence...the bangers arent the ones to worry about if you look at it from that perspective its the nerdy white kids that sit at home and play violent video games right????

point being stereotypes suck, almost everyone believes them and their hardly true.

[ZirconJohn]

What is is with older guys in gunstores being self righteous jerks? Maybe it is being conservative in California for so many years makes you standoffish and overbearing when you have the chance. I agree that people shouldn't dress like they are gang members or wear hats sideways, but to deny them service you are only hurting yourself. If they were real gang members, they'd buy stolen ones off the street for a fraction of what you are selling them for. Plus, if your header is to be believed, you live in Ukiah, WHAT GANGS?

Anyway, as it's been stated, do as you please, it's your store. But don't think that by being incredibly inflexible you are helping get the younger generation into shooting sports and save our hobby. You probably don't care since you'll be dead by the time our rights are in mortal jeopardy, and you probably already have your fun stuff grandfathered in so the bans and restrictions don't hit you so hard.

BDD

Now, now... calm down, please relax. This here exactly what I am talking about, attitude check.

We are talking big picture, general info at various locations. You cannot think of only what you want; think outside that box and meet the old guys in the middle... common ground and the world is your oyster.

I am not asking you to break your attire code, I am merely asking you to bend your attire code a little so we can meet in the middle. Notice I said take it easy on the baggy pants thing, turn the hat all the way back, or front... wear a shirt, and not a 'wife beater' etc, etc.

I will still hold my ground, it is my store, and so please be presentable, and most of all respectable, and you will be MY BOSS! - Serious, I mean it... I will call you Sir.

But, so too does it work the other way... you want to be Mr. Attitude, little man wanna be big tough guy... I become your boss and then so... so that's that!

Capieshe!

Strictly business... you understand.

[SD13]

Now, now... calm down, please relax. This here exactly what I am talking about, attitude check.

We are talking big picture, general info at various locations. You cannot think of only what you want; think outside that box and meet the old guys in the middle... common ground and the world is your oyster.

I am not asking you to break your attire code, I am merely asking you to bend your attire code a little so we can meet in the middle. Notice I said take it easy on the baggy pants thing, turn the hat all the way back, or front... wear a shirt, and not a 'wife beater' etc, etc.

I will still hold my ground, it is my store, and so please be presentable, and most of all respectable, and you will be MY BOSS! - Serious, I mean it... I will call you Sir.

But, so too does it work the other way... you want to be Mr. Attitude, little man wanna be big tough guy... I become your boss and then so... so that's that!

Capieshe!

Strictly business... you understand.

Like you said it all comes down to attitude.

You were our age once Im sure you can understand when I say that the young bucks naturally get a little more confrontational when were told we cant do something we have the right to do, however if someone gives me the respect i deserve for being me not what I wear I will be alot more likely to respectfully pull up my pants, etc in their presence.

Kinda like smoking, if someone comes up to me outside on a public street with a condescending attitude and tells me to put out my cigarette dont be surprised when you get a face full of smoke, however if you kindly walk up to me and politely ask me to put it out because it bothers you I will no questions.

[pingpong]

Look how well that policy has worked for public schools, i mean no disrespect to you but anyone whos gone to a public school could tell you their policies are anything but efficient.

If you really wanna get down to it look at columbine and any other act of school related violence...the bangers arent the ones to worry about if you look at it from that perspective its the nerdy white kids that sit at home and play violent video games right????

point being stereotypes suck, almost everyone believes them and their hardly true.

That doesn't prove it's ineffective though. As you pointed out, we should worry about the nerdy white kids sitting at home playing violent video games, right? But maybe that's because gang-related shootings at school have dropped off some (I'm not saying that is has, of course) to the point that white-nerdy-video-game violence has overtaken it. What it comes down to is the image that you want to convey to the public at large; you want to show people that you have a strong stance against gangs.

[SD13]

That doesn't prove it's ineffective though. As you pointed out, we should worry about the nerdy white kids sitting at home playing violent video games, right? But maybe that's because gang-related shootings at school have dropped off some (I'm not saying that is has, of course) to the point that white-nerdy-video-game violence has overtaken it.

touche, i honestly didnt think about it that way until you put it like that.

[B.D.Dubloon]

Maybe I did have a bit of an attitude, for that I am sorry. But seriously, please tell us about the gang problems in Ukiah. Really, I at least want to know. It's my understanding that there aren't a lot of minorities up in that area, who comprise the majority of gang members in larger metropolitan areas. Are there Bloods and Crips there, or just a bunch of white punks? It seems to me that without a gang presence in the area, red and blue ought to go back to just being colors.

And I wasn't talking about you particularly, I have no idea about your customer service style. I bet if I came into your store we'd get along fine, I dress well, speak well, and am in general polite. But I have noticed a lot of bad attitudes from older guys working in gunshops, they mostly seem condescending and aloof. I've bought guns in this state from San Diego to San Jose, and it seems pretty regular to me.

BDD

[SD13]

Maybe I did have a bit of an attitude, for that I am sorry. But seriously, please tell us about the gang problems in Ukiah. Really, I at least want to know. It's my understanding that there aren't a lot of minorities up in that area, who comprise the majority of gang members in larger metropolitan areas. Are there Bloods and Crips there, or just a bunch of white punks? It seems to me that without a gang presence in the area, red and blue ought to go back to just being colors.

And I wasn't talking about you particularly, I have no idea about your customer service style. I bet if I came into your store we'd get along fine, I dress well, speak well, and am in general polite. But I have noticed a lot of bad attitudes from older guys working in gunshops, they mostly seem condescending and aloof. I've bought guns in this state from San Diego to San Jose, and it seems pretty regular to me.

BDD

man i want red back period it's my favorite color and i wear it alot....didnt help growing up in L.A. I got stabbed in 5th grade for it with a pair of scissors in the shoulder (true story) and got a death threat every couple months in highschool.

[Vacaville]

Maybe I did have a bit of an attitude, for that I am sorry. But seriously, please tell us about the gang problems in Ukiah. Really, I at least want to know. It's my understanding that there aren't a lot of minorities up in that area, who comprise the majority of gang members in larger metropolitan areas. Are there Bloods and Crips there, or just a bunch of white punks? It seems to me that without a gang presence in the area, red and blue ought to go back to just being colors.
BDD

There are Hispanic and white gangs in the Ukiah area, don't know about Bloods or Crips. I used to live up there. Actually had a young girl working for me who was the get-away driver for a gang murder. Came to work acting weird as hell and the cops arrested her the next day. Travel about 20 miles east of Ukiah and you get into Lake County which has probably one of the highest concentrations of ex-cons in the state. It's a drug-dealing, tweaker heaven.

[ZirconJohn]

Like you said it all comes down to attitude.

You were our age once Im sure you can understand when I say that the young bucks naturally get a little more confrontational when were told we cant do something we have the right to do, however if someone gives me the respect i deserve for being me not what I wear I will be alot more likely to respectfully pull up my pants, etc in their presence.

Kinda like smoking, if someone comes up to me outside on a public street with a condescending attitude and tells me to put out my cigarette dont be surprised when you get a face full of smoke, however if you kindly walk up to me and politely ask me to put it out because it bothers you I will no questions.

Well of course I understand... I was once your age. I aint no dang know-it-all, and I aint no dang tough-guy either. All we ask is respect, exactly the same respect you are asking of us old guys - it is the SAME thing coming from either party.

I have a job for you...

Try this when next you walk into a gun store... wait your turn if you have to, and casually approach the salesman. Do whatever you have to do, say whatever you have to say, but get the message across that you are interested in asking for their expert advice, say words like Sir, Mr, thank you, say please, be polite. Wear a nice shirt, don't have to be dress shirt... just a regular nice shirt... but wear your hat sideways and let the salesman see your sideways cap. Then when he approaches you, say "oh, excuse me Sir", straighten your hat and let him see you do it. Look the salesman in the eyes and ask for permission to pick something up form the top of the counter, even though you can because it's there for you to pick-up... say please, but ask. Make a friend, let the 'firearms expert' helping you tell you everything he knows about firearms. He just wants some respect, that's all... then he gonna give a same repect right back to you.

When you have a conversation with the older guy salesman, ask him about what we are talking about here... ask him.

Go try it, you have nothing to lose... however, you have everything to gain.

Come back and let us know what happened.

Thank you,

[ZirconJohn]

Maybe I did have a bit of an attitude, for that I am sorry. But seriously, please tell us about the gang problems in Ukiah. Really, I at least want to know. It's my understanding that there aren't a lot of minorities up in that area, who comprise the majority of gang members in larger metropolitan areas. Are there Bloods and Crips there, or just a bunch of white punks? It seems to me that without a gang presence in the area, red and blue ought to go back to just being colors.

And I wasn't talking about you particularly, I have no idea about your customer service style. I bet if I came into your store we'd get along fine, I dress well, speak well, and am in general polite. But I have noticed a lot of bad attitudes from older guys working in gunshops, they mostly seem condescending and aloof. I've bought guns in this state from San Diego to San Jose, and it seems pretty regular to me.

BDD

Thank you Sir, I really appreciate your post very much. The only thing separates us is difference in age, and what we are doing here is bridging the gap between said age so we can "all just get along". - You know who said that, right?

I will elaborate on your 'what's it like in Ukiah?' question later... I just had to respond to your post and acknowledge your tremendous respect!

When I was about 21 years of age I received some very good advice from a gentleman of the same age I am now, and that advice is this, he said "Delgado, there is no such thing as problems... there are only opportunities in which to improve ourselves".

Thank you for the opportunity you have given me that I may better serve you when we conduct business.

Respectfully,

[chiz]

wearing gang colors dont mean you are in a gang. i see people dressed all in blue one day.hat ,shirt,shoes and belt. and the the very next day they are dressed in all red. are they gang members or peolpe that like to have there clothes match. unless you know them pesonally you dont know what there story is.the only way to find out is to actually talk to them. but you pass them over because of the way they look you will never get to know them. also almost any color can be aassociated with gangs not just red and blue.
when i want to give MY money to someone else i dont expect poor treatment because of the way i dress.

[tango5]

I'd have to agree with you. When I went to buy my OLL I asked the guy if he handled OLL AR15's and he said, "No, and even if we did, you dont have enough money to even buy the grip" and I said "Oh, okay, I guess I'll have to take this elsewhere then " and showed him the $1300 I had in cash



Ended up going to another shop, completely customized the entire gun, had them build it for me, and made it mine for $834 including DROS and tax

Go talk to Ken and Bill at Diablo Valley Gun Works in Pleasant Hill/Concord. Great guys. If the shop you had a bad experience with happens to be in Antioch, then go to DVGW.

[lorax3]

FFL

First impressions of a dealer are important to me, and dealers should be aware that treating their customers equally is very important.

Not to categorize, but I would say those who are of the younger crown are more likely to use the internet or post on forums, so if you treat an legitimate shopper who is 18 like sh** then expect to have a forum topic posted about your bad service as a dealer.

I have a few places that I visit now regularly because of how kind and helpful they were when I was first learning about guns.

There are also places on the other hand that I will never walk into again, because I was ignored and when I asked questions I got short answers and was given no eye contact.

-lorax

[Linus]

Bought my first rifle when I was 18 and never got any weird faces. I just proved my age and they started throwing all kind of rifles/shotguns at me. By the way this was a RC-gun exchange in Sac.

[bohoki]

if someone said cuz that many times i would probably be less respectful