Shooting with my Wife

[powaybob]

We have a cabin in a remote desert location not far from the Mexican border. The nearest sheriff is over 50 miles away, so we need to be somewhat self-reliant for self protection. There have been some break-ins by illegals but no confrontations yet. My wife mentioned recently that she wanted to shoot the guns I keep out there, so this trip we took a morning and went to our shooting spot and tried several out. I told her I wanted her to try out several types and sizes and note the differences in operation, recoil, and control. We went over the basic safety rules, which she knew, and I described the sight picture she should achieve. We only shot a load or two in each and even with that she got tired after something like 50 or 60 rounds.

She is left handed, and like me is opposite eye dominant.

We started with an H&R top break .22, then went to a Charter .38 snub nose, then to an old S&W .38 police model, then a Ruger Security Six (4 inch barrel), then a Ruger P-89 9mm, a Springfield Armory 1911, and finally my Springfield XD in .45.

She fired the revolvers double action and between the size of the revolvers and finger strength had a somewhat difficult time. With the Ruger Security Six she actually had to use two fingers and a weird grip to fire it. We were set up at seven yards and she was consistently within the six inch target circle even then. Her objection with the semi autos was the difficulty in loading rounds into the magazines.The Ruger P89 was too fat for her to grip correctly, the 1911 was a little better but still too big.She did not like the recoil of the XD, which surprised me because I thought it was more comfortable to shoot than the 1911.

One of her self imposed ground rules is not to buy anything for her, but after seeing that what I buy for my big hands just do not fit hers. (I'm 6'3" and she is almost a foot shorter). I somehow need to get her to a shop or range where she can try some other handguns that fit her hand better.

We do keep a nice old Remington 16 gauge double there that she handles well, but I'd like to get her a handgun that works for her.

With all that said, I am open to suggestions from anyone on ways to take the next step towards getting her a handgun more suited to her needs. I might even have to trade something in to abide by her "don't buy anything new" condition.

[movie zombie]

sounds like a good trip and shooting experience!

first, do not get any of the light/air weight smith revolvers. seriously. i almost didn't pick up another gun after that.

i have a colt officers mark iv series 80 [.45 acp] that i bought from another calgunner. i love this gun.....however, many will tell you to replace the spring system. i tried that but went back to the original set up because being a shorter woman than your wife and with not that big of hands, i couldn't put the gun back together! so i went back to the original system and bought extra parts from colt directly should there be a bushing failure. again, this gun fits my hand, its metal, and at 7 yards i'm deadly with it.

my real love is revolvers .38/.357, smith and wessons to be exact:

model 60 fits my hand very very well. i bought this snubby new. i love this so much i'm considering even getting it in the 3 inch barrel. i considered ruger's sp101 which is a very fine gun but it did not fit my hand as well.

model 19 bought used is also a snubby and worth considering. i'd go a longer barrel if i had it to do over again.

model 66 is a real jewel! mine is pre-lock, etc. and purchased from a calgunner. it is not a snubby, i think its a 3 inch barrel. it is the upper end of what fits my hand for smiths....its a k-frame. L-frame is way to big for me to control....although now that i'm more experienced, i'd try to shoot a 686 to see if i've found my grip for it.

for a rifle i selected a marlin 1994CP .38/.357 also purchased new. i love this rifle!

you are a wise man to realize that the size of her hand is an issue. the more she tries out, the more she can narrow the field. however, i started out only going to buy one gun and as you can see i bought several......

not from your area so i can't recommend any ranges with guns for rent. others will chime in on that, i'm sure. perhaps there are gun clubs as well or other calgunners will offer to meet with you?

good luck!

oh, and i didn't start with the .45acp......i started with the model 60 revolver. i was already familiar with guns as i was raised in a household with guns and had a rifle when i was 8.....but i was't sure how i'd do with a .45acp. the calgunner i bought from was very gracious and met me at a range to allow me to fire it before making the purchase. for this i am forever grateful....actually, he brought some of his others for me to try as well and i found i didn't like the kahr at all [spent shells went into my hair].

also, i you can buy auto loaders for magazines. i haven't got one yet but may do so. i find i don't have the hand strength to fully load the appropriate magazines for my semi-autos.

[katokat]

If she didn't like the recoil of the XD 45cal, try it in 9mm - makes a big difference. Iron Sights has a lot of varieties to rent, and you're not too far from them. My main pistol is a 9mm M&P, because I can control the flip better than my 1911. If she is having trouble with grip size, the M&P (and probably others) have different size palm swells.

[gmcal]

first, do not get any of the light/air weight smith revolvers. seriously. i almost didn't pick up another gun after that.

I attended a tactical pistol class with my wife and there was another female shooter there with a Taurus airweight snub nosed 38. The recoil was so harsh she had bruises on her hands and left before lunch.

also, i you can buy auto loaders for magazines. i haven't got one yet but may do so. i find i don't have the hand strength to fully load the appropriate magazines for my semi-autos.

Magazine loaders are great. My wife has one and wouldn't be able to fully load her magazines without it.

I recommend finding a "women and handguns" class if possible. These specialize in introducing women to handguns, and often address the unique concerns that a woman may have regarding handguns. The class may also have several different handguns for your wife to shoot. Local shooting clubs, ranges, training schools and the NRA offer these classes.

If you can't find a class, at least take her to a range where she can rent and try different guns.

This website has some info for woman regarding handguns:

http://corneredcat.com/

If decide to go with an auto loader make sure your wife is comfortable racking the slide. There is an article on cornedcat for the correct method to rack a slide, if your wife has no physical limitations then she should be able to do it.

BTW, my wife selected a S&W M&P 9mm and is interested in getting the compact version for concealment. She like the adjustable backstraps the M&P has so it fits her hands better. She also wants her own AR 15!

[Steyrlp10]

Congrats to the Mrs. for trying to come to a prudent decision. From your description of how far LEO assistance is from you, I'd be seriously hashing the thought also on how to defend myself in the worst case scenario.

I agree with MZ... I am a big fan of the 1911, but when the world turns upside down, I really don't want to fiddle around with possbile malfunctions. I have several revolvers for that purpose.

The other thing is the Remington 870 just because...

[powaybob]

Thanks to all of you for your comments. I will pass them on to her. I did not try to over teach her in this session, just let her see the differences among the types and sizes. I did have her load each one, whether revolver or semi-auto. I had a mag loader for the 45s but it was a new mag for the 9mm and even I had trouble loading rounds into it.

She is familiar with guns having grown up in North Carolina with a father who hunted.

As for security in the area, many of us are armed, and I have other weapons there other than mentioned, including rifles and shotguns.

[xdchique]

I have an XD 9 mm and it fits my small hands well. Not much recoil at all!

[powaybob]

My wife and I took the next step and visited Poway Weapons and Gear and talked with the owner, John Phillips. We explained that we had tried shooting with the handguns I had bought for my large hands and wanted to find some examples that fit hers better and felt comfortable to her. She liked the Glock 19 best, then the S&W MMP 9, with the XD-9 a distant third.

John gave us the name of an instructor, Laurence Renner, and suggested that she should go to Iron Sights in Oceanside and have a session with him while trying out the different models she liked in the store.

I have to commend John for talking to my wife and working with her to find what she was comfortable with, even knowing that we were not planning to buy anything that day.

We will keep you posted on the results of the next step, Sharon's lesson with the instructor.

[ElvenSoul]

Get her on Calguns so she can ask the other Lady Shooters herself.

[powaybob]

ElvenSoul,
It is amazing to me that she has gone this far. I have mentioned the forum and shown her the responses but she is not ready to participate yet.

Maybe as she learns more she will have questions she can get answered in the forum. Thanks for the suggestion.

[movie zombie]

thanks for the update! please, keep us posted.........and, sharon, please join us here one day!

[onequickshift]

I have a home very south of Texas, and I've had issues with ILLI's around the area as well. But a neighbor checks my home there for me OFTEN, and I paid extra to be connected so I could check property via online.

In anycase, protection is very important for me as well, since I am a slightly single slightly taken, lets put it at complicated. In anycase, guns that work for my brothers and my uncles, as well father; needless to say won't really fit me lol. I've been painstakingly acquiring fire arms on my own, to better suit my size and need, like larger rifles? I chose the Spikes shorter signature rifle, as well LWRC's PSD, and a few other offerings from other companies. I'd say take her to a range that offers rentals, have her handle and feel the guns, she may prefer ones fit and weight over another, if its a revolver, have her try and fire say the 357 since it will fire both that and 38, right? She may like having the ability to use either or, for and in terms of ammo. Glocks are a bit blocky, I dunno her hand size, but if like me she has SMALL hands? She may like Kahr, and sig, etc. And trading in a fire arm you dont readily use, could be a good idea! Could get something for her that shed be able to have and enjoy. Everytime I am in TX I head to my parents, and pickup my revolver....pistols, rifles, and shotguns I keep at their house and safe, bring a few containers of ammo each, lights, etc. Its nice having equipment specifically I like, I chose, and sized for me, than taking stuff meant for my family side of guys.

[powaybob]

I am going to revive this thread with some news. Finally Sharon and her friend Karen made it to the range (Iron Sights in Oceanside) for a two hour session with instructor Larry Renner. Karen's husband Dick and I left the ladies to Larry and we started shooting. We used my XD .45 and SA GI 1911 in .45. Larry started them off with a classroom session and instructed them for about a half-hour. Then they came to the range. Sharon started with a Glock 17 and Karen started with Dick's .357 revolver (S&W I think). They took turns at the line, and Larry schooled them in sight picture, trigger control, as well as getting them confident with the operation of semi auto's- inserting the magazine, operating the slide, loading the magazine and so on. Dick and I observed in silence, taking turns in an adjacent lane. Larry managed to give us some pointers too.

When they became available we rented a Glock 19 and S&W M&P 9, guns Sharon had tried at the Poway Weapons and Gear store and liked the balance of them. Sharon said that she liked the Glock more, but Larry told her she was shooting better with with the S&W.

Later Sharon said they were both fine, but she liked the Glock a little more, and besides that, her friend Robin has one.

With about 10 minutes left of the two hours we paid Larry, Sharon said she had enough- tired of being on her feet, and the gun was starting to feel heavy, so the lesson ended.

Later the four of us had a pleasant lunch at a nice seafood place on picturesque Oceanside Harbor, and both women considered the morning a very positive experience. Sharon I think is looking to acquire a Glock 19 of her own. I told her she had to pass the Cal Handgun Safety Certificate test so she could buy it herself, though I would give her the money. The money comes from my annual profit sharing which despite a record year the company cheaped us out, and lest anyone think I am being condescending, Sharon makes more money than I do.

One thing that we all agreed on was the noise from shotguns and rifles in the range was uncomfortable. It really did not make much sense to us to be shooting M-16 type weapons at targets 10 yards away.

So to all those that recommended an independent trainer and no spouse intervention, I can only say how right you are. There were no spousal schisms created, and the idea that we would give them their independent experience amplified the experience. We definitely endorse independent instruction for spouses.

For reference, all four of us have well over 30 years experience developing systems for DoD.

[movie zombie]

this is a detailed and very positive update! thank you for taking the time to do so.

i particularly like this sentence: "There were no spousal schisms created, and the idea that we would give them their independent experience amplified the experience."

i also like that Sharon stuck to her guns....literally and figuratively! she is the one doing the shooting and knows how it feels in her hand.

glad you all had a great day!

[powaybob]

I never really pushed her into it, she came to the conclusion on her own. This Saturday, we are going to Poway Weapons and Gear where she will take the test for the handgun safety certificate and then buy a Glock 19. THis has evolved over nearly six months, but that is the pace she created. Lots of other things going on in our lives too.

RiddleB- she actually said she does not want this to be a hobby. She looks at it as more of a tool she can use appropriately. She has gone shooting with me before over the years, and her father actually taught her shoot a .22 when she was little. So guns have been around in her life, not a big deal, and she just decided at this point that she wanted her own gun and be able to use it. Your wife probably has a lot of other interests you share, so don't worry about the gun part.