Need Thoughts On Buying a Gun

[ThinkingAboutIt]

I grew up in a family that had guns, but only as a "just in case". My brother would shoot his occasionally, but other than that I haven't been around them much, and to be honest I have a fear of them. But my fear of someone breaking in and harming me/family is stronger.
I have been thinking of getting one, but am hesitant because I don't know where I would store it with a toddler in the house that would be safe yet accessible. I also worry about it being more of a hazard than a help (stories about people getting shot with their own gun), and more.
Any thoughts here? Should I get one, should I not? And if so what tips can you give me? Thanks so much.

[SSP.Tactical]

You have the right attitude and questions when considering a Firearm for personal defense.

There are many ways to secure your Firearm (store it) while preventing unauthorized access from intruders, your toddler (or any other children for that matter). These options will also allow fast access for emergency situations that require self defense in the home.

As for Firearm selection - I would recommend finding a person who is VERY EXPERIENCED and SAFETY MINDED, then go to a Shooting Range with Gun Rentals. Try Firing, LOADING, Unloading, and handling each weapon until you determine which one is most suitable. If you are still uncertain, then hiring a Firearms Instructor might be the best choice.

I have witnessed many men and women that cannot LOAD a firearm they own for personal defense, and further, cannot effectively fire the weapon.

As for getting shot with your own weapon - you need to train, train, train!

Areas like:

Room to Room Searching Techniques
Weapon Retention training
Close Quarters Training

and other training can really help to prevent that scenario.

Bottom line: If you don't have a Firearm and the "Bad Guys" do, you are as good as dead in my opinion.

Note: this is MY professional opinion in a quick and hasty message. DO NOT take this as a set of instructions from me on what to do, or not to do. I am just offering FOOD FOR THOUGHT.....nothing more.

CONSULT A PROFESSIONAL before you buy a FIREARM.....you need to be educated to make the right choice!

Be Safe and Good Luck!

[wildhawker]

There are many knowledgeable women on this forum that can better address these questions from such a perspective. However, generally:

...and to be honest I have a fear of them. But my fear of someone breaking in and harming me/family is stronger.

Some great posts in this thread (start w/ post #144) and this post from earlier in the thread (ignore some of the noise in between); mmartin and KylaGWolf made some excellent points on the subject of fear.

I have been thinking of getting one, but am hesitant because I don't know where I would store it with a toddler in the house that would be safe yet accessible.

There are options like a GunVault available if you're talking about a handgun. For effective home defense (especially for a newer shooter) I would strongly suggest a 20 gauge shotgun for your primary defensive firearm; Chuck Hawks elaborates in this excerpt:

"20 Gauge

The 20 is an excellent self-defense caliber, particularly for those who dislike the recoil of the 12 gauge. I recommend the 20 gauge over the more popular 12 for home defense. Choose the 20 gauge 3" shell Federal "Classic" #2 buckshot (F207-2-5PK) with 18 pellets, or the Winchester "Double XX" Magnum #3 with 24 pellets (X203C3B). If your gun cannot accept 3" shells choose the Remington #3 with 20 pellets (SP20BK5PK-3). All of these loads provide definitive short-range stopping power.

I specifically recommend the 20 gauge for women and recoil-sensitive men who dislike the blast and recoil of the 12 gauge. "Delivering roughly the ballistic force of two .44 Magnum rounds at once," comments the knowledgeable Ayoob, the 20 "delivers 75% of the lead for only 50-60% of the recoil". Many police departments have found their officers shoot much more accurately in realistic training exercises with the lighter-kicking but still potent 20 gauge.

If you are new to shotgunning and considering getting one for self-defense I strongly urge you to buy the reliable and reasonably-priced "Mossberg 500 Special Purpose" 18.5" barrel 20 gauge pump shotgun (catalog #50451). This tried-and-true workhorse is the standard shotgun of the U.S. Armed Forces and costs a little over $200. You'll be much happier with the lighter-kicking 20 gauge than the 12 gauge version used by the military, and - most importantly - you'll shoot the 20 more accurately and rapidly.

For an in-depth look at the 20-versus-12 gauge issue I recommend all shotgun owners (and potential shotgun owners) read 'Stressfire II: Advanced Combat Shotgun' by Massad Ayoob. Perhaps I am beginning to sound like a broken record on the theme of Ayoob's books, but once you've read them you'll understand why I recommend them so highly (and repeatedly). Note: Ayoob dislikes the 20 gauge Remington 870 pump shotgun and recommends you choose the Mossberg 500 in 20 gauge for general self-defense and home-defense use. So do I.

For ultra-close range home defense birdshot will do the trick. Choose any #4, BB or larger high brass lead hunting load, and have the balance of the magazine filled with #3 buck in case the birdshot doesn't put them down fast enough.

Avoid slug use in 20 gauge; you are better off defending yourself with buckshot. If you must use slugs, pick the Dynamit/Nobel or Federal "Classic" (F203-RS) rifled slugs. Using slugs requires careful aiming and rifle sights: few 20 gauge shotguns have the latter."

I also worry about it being more of a hazard than a help (stories about people getting shot with their own gun), and more.
Any thoughts here?

Buy a firearm, ammo and train with a local instructor. Learn how to safety handle, operate, clean and troubleshoot your firearm. Your confidence will increase exponentially as you gain experience and develop a solid working understanding of the fundamentals of firearms. Having a serious auto accident or being struck with some other malady is far more probable than an incident with a firearm; for more information, I highly suggest you pick up a copy of Dr. John R. Lott, Jr.'s The Bias against Guns. You might also pick up Massad Ayoob's book In the Gravest Extreme as well; both provide very useful information on these topics.

Should I get one, should I not? And if so what tips can you give me? Thanks so much.

Ultimately, this choice is a very personal one. I can tell you that my wife and I both are much more comfortable knowing that we have a line of defense between us and an intruder. The police take at least a few minutes to arrive after being called to respond (and we're in a pretty good neighborhood); those few minutes would be an eternity if we were at the mercy of the intruder(s) without any means to end the encounter. My wife's co-worker recently had a neighbor nearly strangled to death by some home-invading thiefs (a woman who lived alone in a $MM home in an very affluent area, the intruders thought she was dead when she passed out and fell limp)- once very anti-gun (an MD), he recently went with us to the range and is now strongly considering purchasing a firearm for home defense as well as one for local target competitions (very much like Doritos, it's hard to limit yourself to just one ). I pray that we'll never experience such an event as his neighbor faced, but if we do, we won't be forced to accept whatever the jerks want to dish out (definitely speaking more towards those risks my wife might face if I were not present, incapacitated or killed).

One last point- the shooting community is filled with the most fun, genuine and caring people we have ever met, including through church. You'll enjoy countless weekends or weeknights at the range, shoot-n-que barbeques and other fun activities. Lindsay (my wife) enjoys competing and really loves the unique challenges this sport offers. Once you get involved, I'm confident you'll find it's a much more open and multi-faceted experience than you might at first believe. Welcome to Calguns!

[Sinixstar]

I can't stress enough the importance of trying multiple guns before you settle on one. I've seen a number of people buy a gun for self defense thinking 'oh anything will do', or looking to spend as little as possible - and then are afraid to shoot it because they have a hard time handling it.
Try revolvers, try semi autos, try shotguns - then try 'em all again.

Find the one that fits you, that you find easy to use, and that you're comfortable shooting.

[CHRIS MARTIN]

Although a shotgun makes sense in some situations, as a mother, your first move when danger presents itself will be to go to your child and pick them up, leaving you only one hand for the shotgun...not a good situation. No, you need to go with a pistol. The questions become revolver or semi-auto? (answer: revolver (or semi-auto withOUT a safety like a Glock, H&K P7 series, Kel Tec, etc.)) what caliber? (22 to 38 Special/9 mm) where do you keep it? (in a central location, NOT at one end of the house or apartment) should it be a lightweight carry" gun or a full sized piece? (full weight but small size) should it be kept loaded or not? (loaded) what type of intruder are you most likely to be "involved" with? That LAST question is perhaps the most important...most in-home attacks on a woman come from ex-husbands and ex-boyfriends. Those attacks rarely come from them breaking down the door, which would give you plenty of time to react...they tend to happen after YOU have let them in "to talk"...and you let them in withOUT a gun in your hand (if you felt the need to be armed, hopefully you wouldn't let them in in the first place!). Then they grab you in a bear hug or similar, giving you little chance to get your gun...so the discussion about what kind of gun to get for those situations will seem pretty much a waste of air at that point. So, if you write off those type of attacks, when its a known person assulting you (and you weren't armed by choice/by decision), then what you have left is the very remote chance of a bad guy randomly targeting you that you need to defend yourself against. Those events are well publicized BECAUSE they so rarely occur. Considering the lifetime chance of that happening to you versus the lifetime chance of your child (or someone else's child) of getting the gun, then you have to wonder if the potential payoff is worth the potential risk. But, if you are worried about the random bad guy, then buy a revolver with a short barrel (because a long barreled pistol is easier to grab and take away from you). Go to ranges that have rental guns and find the one that points the best for you. Try point shooting (NOT aimed shooting!) with one hand at a 15 foot range. Which gun puts you on target by itself? Then, buy the biggest caliber that you can handle with the biggest slow bullet that you can get (like, for example, a 200 grain 38 Special versus a 95 grain super high velocity cartridge). Store it loaded in a quick release one gun "vault". Practice 50 rounds a month POINT shooting only...never depend on aimed fire.

[Steyrlp10]

I agree with all the good advice posted on here and ultimately, you need to find something you're comfortable and confident with.

I really like my 1911s because I've seen the difference in stopping power between a .45 and a 9mm, but that's me. However, as I'm sure you know, semi-autos have more moving parts than a revolver. For my home, I prefer to have both, including the Remington 870.

I've raised six kids in my day because my sister was killed years ago, so I've always had a safe, plus talking to the kids about the dangers of firearms without proper supervision. As they say, if a gun is out, treat it like it's loaded. It's not a toy.

I think as you become more familiar with handling a particular gun you like, understanding how to use it properly, you'll feel more confident -- and you will get better.

Best of luck!

[wildhawker]

Let me begin by saying that I cannot intelligently comment on the instincts you touched on (for obvious reasons).

That said, training and meditation on the subject of defensive tactics will show that the goal is to end the encounter- quickly and effectively. You're doing you and your baby (and other family members) a disservice by placing them in the line of fire and mitigating your ability to physically respond.

While your suggestions of a pistol can work for many, my wife prefers her 1911-platform guns to others now (and has a 12ga at her bedside); try many (you may end up with more than one, ie pistol for carry and shotgun for bedside) and practice often. For home defense, one must also consider the risk of overpenetration some calibers may pose (to other family members, neighbors).

Obviously maintaining a firearm on your person full time would be preferrable to keeping it in a safe/gunvault/nightstand and being caught unprepared; however, it's really a matter of your unique circumstances and acceptable level of risk. We have 2 dogs (100lb Akitas), and my wife does not answer the door for people she does not know to be friendly- we have layers of protection (maintain low profile>door>dogs>armed response). Even so, she often carries when I am not home.

Although a shotgun makes sense in some situations, as a mother, your first move when danger presents itself will be to go to your child and pick them up, leaving you only one hand for the shotgun...not a good situation. No, you need to go with a pistol. The questions become revolver or semi-auto? (answer: revolver (or semi-auto withOUT a safety like a Glock, H&K P7 series, Kel Tec, etc.)) what caliber? (22 to 38 Special/9 mm) where do you keep it? (in a central location, NOT at one end of the house or apartment) should it be a lightweight carry" gun or a full sized piece? (full weight but small size) should it be kept loaded or not? (loaded) what type of intruder are you most likely to be "involved" with? That LAST question is perhaps the most important...most in-home attacks on a woman come from ex-husbands and ex-boyfriends. Those attacks rarely come from them breaking down the door, which would give you plenty of time to react...they tend to happen after YOU have let them in "to talk"...and you let them in withOUT a gun in your hand (if you felt the need to be armed, hopefully you wouldn't let them in in the first place!). Then they grab you in a bear hug or similar, giving you little chance to get your gun...so the discussion about what kind of gun to get for those situations will seem pretty much a waste of air at that point. So, if you write off those type of attacks, when its a known person assulting you (and you weren't armed by choice/by decision), then what you have left is the very remote chance of a bad guy randomly targeting you that you need to defend yourself against. Those events are well publicized BECAUSE they so rarely occur. Considering the lifetime chance of that happening to you versus the lifetime chance of your child (or someone else's child) of getting the gun, then you have to wonder if the potential payoff is worth the potential risk. But, if you are worried about the random bad guy, then buy a revolver with a short barrel (because a long barreled pistol is easier to grab and take away from you). Go to ranges that have rental guns and find the one that points the best for you. Try point shooting (NOT aimed shooting!) with one hand at a 15 foot range. Which gun puts you on target by itself? Then, buy the biggest caliber that you can handle with the biggest slow bullet that you can get (like, for example, a 200 grain 38 Special versus a 95 grain super high velocity cartridge). Store it loaded in a quick release one gun "vault". Practice 50 rounds a month POINT shooting only...never depend on aimed fire.

[Peter W Bush]

I have to say this is one of the best first posts I've seen in a long time. I recommend going to a range and trying out different handguns and shotguns and seeing what you feel most comfortable with. Or better yet, find a training course close to where you live. Usually they will rent you the guns. You can learn the basics and then some, as well as much needed safety training. Good luck.

[Bigballaizm]

Hi TAI, PWB has good advice about going to a range and trying out different types of guns with different calibers. Also since you have toddler safety is first in my opinion. Hers is a link to a Biometric Gun Safe with Fingerprint Lock, just an idea for safe storage.

http://www.overstock.com/Sports-Toys/Biometric-Valuables-Gun-Safe-with-Fingerprint-Lock/3232471/product.html?token=144583-14458320090729948824-1-06d683&track=emailrecips&cid=144583&fp=f

Good luck with your search!

[scratch]

As you see you will receive a lot of great information and it can become more inundating.

I would suggest a slow walk process whereby you read some different women authors, that have asked the same questions and have arrived at their conclusions, so you can make the biggest decision....to buy a gun or not.

You can do a google search for authors, however one I highly suggest is Paxton Quigley; look in your local library for her titles.

http://www.paxtonquigley.com/

My single mom daughter just moved back in with a 11 month grandson. Although I am really looking forward to teaching him gun safety and taking him to the range and field, he is starting to walk and I have had to rethink my gun security. Trust me he will not be able to get to any of them, however now I have to retrain how I will get to them if needed.

Please keep us posted as to what you decide and why because it is important for others that may be in similar situations that are hesitant to ask.

If you decide to get a gun to protect you and your family, then you can start looking at the different types, calibers and most importantly training. I would suggest professional training, from the basics to tactics. Again take it slow.

If you are in the So Cal South Bay area, I would be more than happy to show you the difference in hand guns and shotguns, as I'm sure any of the members of Cal Guns would.

[AbbyCat]

When I started to think about getting my first handgun, I was lucky enough to come across the Cornered Cat website, http://www.corneredcat.com/TOC.aspx

It is written by Kathy Jackson. She has put a lot of thought and research into the website. There is a wide range of info to be found there. She talks quite a bit about gun safety and specifically concerns around children.

[scratch]

When I started to think about getting my first handgun, I was lucky enough to come across the Cornered Cat website, http://www.corneredcat.com/TOC.aspx

It is written by Kathy Jackson. She has put a lot of thought and research into the website. There is a wide range of info to be found there. She talks quite a bit about gun safety and specifically concerns around children.

AbbyCat, that's an awesome site. I'm bookmarking for further reading....Thanks!!

[Sheepdog1968]

Some excellent advice. I really agree w the detailed on re 20 gauge shotgun. Ayoob is an excellent authority on firearms.

What I really want to point out is that gun safes can be purchased for 300 to 500 from companies. I highly reccomend a gun safe and that should ease your mind. I have one mostly because I don't want to get shot w my own guns. I have insurance if they get stolen.

[johnny_22]

Please take a NRA "Basic Pistol" class

My wife and sister-in-law took the class this year (I retook it just to be with them). Great for covering the safety basics and you get to shoot the instructor's guns. You'll find that one of those guns will be one you really like and that is the one you'll probably buy.

For anyone's first gun, I recommend the .22 LR (revolver or semi). It is so much fun. I find that the .22s are the first gun I reach for, when going to the range. The "self defense" caliber (9mm) is always second.

[deb7566]

Go to a range and take some lessons from a professional. Then rent and practice with a lot of different guns until you find one that you are comfortable with and like shooting. Also take a home defense course.

I ended up buying a 9mm semi automatic Beretta.

As for storage, I store my gun in a gun vault in a keyed lock box. The key is on my car key ring, so I open it every night when I come home and it gets locked every time I leave the house. The gun is stored with a loaded magazine and the safety on.

When I go to the shooting range to practice, I practice picking the gun up, flipping the safety off, loading the magazine and firing 3 rounds, 1st 2 to the body, 3rd to the head.

I did have a situation where someone was trying to break into my house in the middle of the night. I was fortunate that the police showed up very quickly and took the person into custody and I did not have to use my gun. But, I was prepared to.