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Problem with my name, DROS, and pick up/release

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  • Ugly
    Junior Member
    • Nov 2011
    • 16

    Problem with my name, DROS, and pick up/release

    I went to pick up my rifle from being in jail for 10 days and ran into some complications with one of the workers at the shop and was wondering who is in the wrong. Sorry in advance if this is a long post.

    Filling out DROS form...

    (I won't be posting my real name here on the forum so this is just an example)

    It ask for:

    First name: John Jacob (I have two first names)
    Middle name: Jingleheimer
    Last name: Smith

    Drivers license: Only shows first name and last name; does not show middle name.

    FN: John Jacob
    LN: Smith

    I was told there was a discrepancy with my paperwork in regards to my name and that in order to pick up my rifle I would need to show documents with my full name - first, middle, and last along with my address on the same document because my drivers license did not show my middle name: "Jingleheimer"

    She said my car registration would not work cause it only showed : "John J Smith" not "John Jacob Jingleheimer Smith". My passport would not work because it did not show my address but it had my full name which included my first, middle, and last name. My Social Security card would not work for the same reason my passport wouldn't work cause it did not show an address. None of my bills/paperwork have my full name and address on it as they only show "John J Smith"

    She then proceeded to tell me that it was my fault for filling out the form the way I did and that I should've put "Jacob" as my middle name, not "Jingleheimer" and the only way to get my rifle out was to have a government issued ID card with my first, middle, last name, and address printed on it.

    I told her what she was telling me to do was to put my name down incorrectly on a federal document, pretty much perjury and maybe even "falsifying my identity" and she just stood there and said, "Its your fault for filling it out the way you did." I told her I filled out the form exactly as it shows on my birth certificate, which was true and correct, and I wasn't going to fill it out like she said I should risking jail time and losing my firearms for perjury. She still proceeded to tell me I was wrong.

    I have purchased many firearms and filled out the DROS form exactly the way I have been doing using my correct full name and had no problems obtaining my firearms after the 10 day wait period. Now, who was wrong/who was right?

    Were the FFL's that I've dealt with in the past letting me obtain my firearms without the proper documentation? Was she right for not releasing my rifle to me because of my middle name not being displayed on any other documents?

    I ended up going to the DMV and having them add my middle name onto my DL just to avoid any complications with future purchases but was it even necessary?
  • #2
    ixta70
    Senior Member
    • Mar 2011
    • 600

    Not an FFL but that seems excessive. I think she's wrong since you're showing or can show her several different documents that match. Curious to see what an actual FFL as to say.

    Comment

    • #3
      wastemore
      Junior Member
      • Nov 2006
      • 85

      No, it was not necessary.

      Comment

      • #4
        71MUSTY
        Calguns Addict
        • Mar 2014
        • 7029

        I had a similar situation with my wife's name because she was born lets say

        Betty Sue

        But she always went by Sue so when we got married she had the judge legally change her name to B. Sue which is her legal name and is on her DL, her passport, and her Social security Card.

        Manager at a Turners insisted we process her DROS under Betty.

        I told him her Legal Name is B. Sue and that Betty didn't exist.

        I asked him to give me a letter in writing confirming he knew and was deliberately selling a firearm to someone who didn't exist.

        5 minutes later he was processing the DROS under B. Sue
        Only slaves don't need guns

        Originally posted by epilepticninja
        Americans vs. Democrats
        We stand for the Anthem, we kneel for the cross


        We already have the only reasonable Gun Control we need, It's called the Second Amendment and it's the government it controls.


        What doesn't kill me, better run

        Comment

        • #5
          CSACANNONEER
          CGN/CGSSA Contributor - Lifetime
          CGN Contributor - Lifetime
          • Dec 2006
          • 44093

          CA DOJ is looking for ANY reason to F with legal gun purchases. So, yea, it was necessary to change your DL to avoid future harassment.
          NRA Certified Pistol, Rifle, Shotgun and Metallic Cartridge Reloading Instructor
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          Comment

          • #6
            tenpercentfirearms
            Vendor/Retailer
            • Apr 2005
            • 13007

            Their shop, their rules. If you had written you name exactly like it was on your DL, they would not have known any better, the ATF/DOJ would not know any better, and you would have your gun by now.

            I would ask her if you could complete a new 4473. Probably not legal, but worth a shot.
            www.tenpercentfirearms.com was open from 2005 until 2018. I now own Westside Arms.

            Comment

            • #7
              flyer898
              Senior Member
              • Feb 2009
              • 2017

              Who is the FFL. it would be helpful to known so others of us can avoid them.
              Never argue with a fool, onlookers may not be able to tell the difference. So said somebody but not Mark Twain
              "One argues to a judge, one does not argue with a judge." Me
              "Never argue unless you are getting paid." CDAA
              "I learned long ago, never to wrestle with a pig. You get dirty, and besides, the pig likes it." George Bernard Shaw

              Comment

              • #8
                Brian Nussbaum CO
                Senior Member
                • Mar 2014
                • 569

                Originally posted by flyer898
                Who is the FFL. it would be helpful to known so others of us can avoid them.
                Avoid the FFL

                Sorry but the ID and paper work filled out by the buyer did not match that makes it a "no go"

                That being said the person in the store should have caught that when the DROS was started and had it fixed at that time

                Comment

                • #9
                  Ugly
                  Junior Member
                  • Nov 2011
                  • 16

                  Originally posted by tenpercentfirearms
                  Their shop, their rules. If you had written you name exactly like it was on your DL, they would not have known any better, the ATF/DOJ would not know any better, and you would have your gun by now.

                  I would ask her if you could complete a new 4473. Probably not legal, but worth a shot.
                  The DROS form asks for my middle name so I filled it out exactly how I should have...first name, middle name, and last name. If I had filled it out exactly on my DL then I would have left where it asks for your middle name blank. Its not about whether or not they, the DOJ, or the ATF would've known better if I falsified my true first and true middle name, its about filling out a federal document under the penalty of perjury to be correct and true.

                  Like I said, I've purchased multiple firearms and DROS'd them through different FFL's before in which I had filled out the form with my first, middle, and last name and never had an issue picking up my firearm until DROSing at this particular shop.

                  I went to the DMV and had them change the info on my DL so now it provides my first, middle, and last name. I went back later that evening with my DMV print out and was able to take my rifle home from a different employee.


                  Originally posted by flyer898
                  Who is the FFL. it would be helpful to known so others of us can avoid them.
                  Discount Gun Mart off Morena Blvd in San Diego. I will never go back to that shop nor will I ever refer anyone to that shop/range ever. Their customer service sucks and so does their range.

                  Comment

                  • #10
                    acespawnshop
                    CGN/CGSSA Contributor
                    CGN Contributor
                    • Jun 2012
                    • 2852

                    I have the same problem because thats my name too.
                    Interstate Transfers $100 (DROS included with the price)
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                    Or call 626-968-5900

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                    Comment

                    • #11
                      kemasa
                      I need a LIFE!!
                      • Jun 2005
                      • 10706

                      Originally posted by nico619
                      IF on the DROS she did not put your middle name, then: On the 4473 line out your middle name and initial it. You are allowed, I believe, 3 mistakes on the 4473 before you have to re-dros. Now the 4473 matches your ID card, and hopefully matches the DROS. IF NOT...
                      The DROS is CA, the 4473 is Federal. Mistakes on the 4473 do not require the DROS to be re-done.

                      There is no three strikes and you are out on the 4473. If you can't fill it out, then perhaps you should not buy a firearm though. If a FFL saw someone having a problem with entering their name, that should raise questions.

                      There is also no rule that your ID/DL has to match your FULL legal name. If the place has an issue, then I would suggest that they contact the BATF.

                      If you have a middle name, you need to put that on the 4473 since that is your middle name and that is what is being asked. You are NOT being asked to put your name as it is on your ID.
                      Kemasa.
                      False signature edited by Paul: Banned from the FFL forum due to being rude and insulting. Doing this continues his abuse.

                      Don't tell someone to read the rules he wrote or tell him that he is wrong.

                      Never try to teach a pig to sing. You waste your time and you annoy the pig. - Robert A. Heinlein

                      Comment

                      • #12
                        Condorguns
                        Still lost in the desert
                        CGN Contributor - Lifetime
                        • Dec 2007
                        • 3302

                        We have the added issue of traditional Hispanic names out here. When you scan the DL it will put first, middle, and last name as listed on the DL. When in fact it is listing the first, last, and last names. The first last is the name they use as what we would call a last name. When the person fills out the 4473 they will often use the first last name as the last name ( Jose Lopez Torres will become Jose Lopez). California DMV says the last name is Torres, but the customer identifies with Lopez.
                        We train everyone to check the 4473 as soon as it's filled out to keep any problem from popping up later.
                        You, you, and you: Panic. The rest of you, come with me.
                        Incoming fire has the right of way.

                        Comment

                        • #13
                          kemasa
                          I need a LIFE!!
                          • Jun 2005
                          • 10706

                          Don't listen to what a CA DOJ person says regarding anything Federal. They should never speak of anything Federal, nor should a BATF person say anything about CA issues, other than that you should speak to the CA DOJ for state issues and the BATF for Federal issues.

                          I would like to see the law which states that it has to match letter for letter on the ID since the CA DL/ID has limited characters.
                          Kemasa.
                          False signature edited by Paul: Banned from the FFL forum due to being rude and insulting. Doing this continues his abuse.

                          Don't tell someone to read the rules he wrote or tell him that he is wrong.

                          Never try to teach a pig to sing. You waste your time and you annoy the pig. - Robert A. Heinlein

                          Comment

                          • #14
                            JazzyJames
                            Member
                            • Aug 2014
                            • 170

                            I think the moral of the story is don't give your kid two first names.

                            Comment

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