Any way to get this gun into my name?

[Suavegato]

I have an opportunity to buy a modern semi-auto handgun from a friend. I know the weapon is NOT stolen but I do have some concerns. It was traded to my friend for some work he did by the son of the legal, registered original owner but was not done through an FFL. The original owner (the kids father) is no longer in the state and is now "estranged" from the son and family, restraining order etc. so there is no way to get him to sign any paper work. I know that private party handgun sales have to go through an FFL. My friend doesn't know what to do with the weapon and is afraid to get caught with it, since it's not in his name and has offered it to me at a VERY cheap price, but I first need to know if there is any way for me to do the sale through an FFL and get it into my name? Otherwise, I won't buy it either for fear of being caught with it.

Do any of you guys know if there is any way or if it's a lost cause?

Thanks,

P.S. I'm in California if that matters? But I do have partial residency in Nevada though if that matters / helps?

[Jeepers]

go buy it and have him do the paperwork, a handgun does not have to be in his name to sell it, if he knows its legal and not stolen there should be no issues,if he does not want to do a transfer threw a FFL.... run,dont walk away from the deal

[Cokebottle]

+1

The gun will be legally in your name after the transfer at the FFL.
Do not tell the FFL the story of the gun's history... he might decide that something is up and refuse the transfer, even though you are doing nothing illegal.

You'll need an HSC ($25 if you don't have one), and the gun will need to be provided with a lock and you will need a receipt for that lock.
If the seller has a lock, have him write up a separate receipt for it. If he does not, then the FFL will sell you one for $5 or $10.

The transfer for a person to person sale is legally limited to $35, so assuming you need an HSC and lock, you're looking at around $70 total.

[Suavegato]

Hello and thank you for the quick responses!
That sounds like GREAT NEWS! a couple of follow Q's and clarification if you don't mind.
1) does my friend, the one I am getting the gun from, have to be present at the FFL or can I just bring the FFL the papers signed by my friend, copies of his lic. etc. or whatever else?
2) Am I correct in assuming that you are saying in Ca. that MAXIMUM amount an FFL can charge for private party handgun transfers is $35? TOTAL? that's DROS and any of his own fees? I thought that the FFL usually tagged on their own "service fees"? I have the handgun cert. card, but I think it's expired, I will likely have to do it again or renew it.
3) if i hypothetically happened to have another handgun that wasn't in my name, could I do the other(s) at the same time to save on DROS fees or "FFL service fees"? Or, would each one be a separate charge?
4) what would happen if someone got caught just possessing (not concealed carrying, using in a crime etc.) a handgun that wasn't in their name? Criminal charges? Fines? forfeiture of weapon or could they register it and get it back?
the hypothetical here is the recent weapon I have a chance to buy but it also made me think this may be a good time for some housekeeping on my part and square away what might be some other loose ends I've been meaning to get to...

5) last but not least, just to protect myself and make sure, is there any easy way for me to run the serial number to MAKE SURE it is not HOT first? I trust the person selling it but he could have been fed a line from who he got it from? I have a cop friend, could he run it for me?

Great info. / heads up on the lock. He actually does have a lock with it, even is the same brand as the weapon but I will make sure that he makes me a receipt for the weapon AND the lock, thank you!

Oh, P.S. Do I still the HSC if I have a current CCW permit?

+1

The gun will be legally in your name after the transfer at the FFL.
Do not tell the FFL the story of the gun's history... he might decide that something is up and refuse the transfer, even though you are doing nothing illegal.

You'll need an HSC ($25 if you don't have one), and the gun will need to be provided with a lock and you will need a receipt for that lock.
If the seller has a lock, have him write up a separate receipt for it. If he does not, then the FFL will sell you one for $5 or $10.

The transfer for a person to person sale is legally limited to $35, so assuming you need an HSC and lock, you're looking at around $70 total.

[Cokebottle]

1) does my friend, the one I am getting the gun from, have to be present at the FFL or can I just bring the FFL the papers signed by my friend, copies of his lic. etc. or whatever else?

Normally, the buyer and seller are present when DROS is initiated.
The FFL may, at his option, allow the seller to come in first and complete his paperwork... that's how consignment sales are handled.

The seller will only be run through background check if the buyer fails and the gun has to be returned to the seller (and it would then be registered to him).

2) Am I correct in assuming that you are saying in Ca. that MAXIMUM amount an FFL can charge for private party handgun transfers is $35? TOTAL? that's DROS and any of his own fees? I thought that the FFL usually tagged on their own "service fees"? I have the handgun cert. card, but I think it's expired, I will likely have to do it again or renew it.

FFL transfers are not limited.
PPT transfers between two California residents using the same FFL at the same time are limited by law to DROS+$10.

The higher FFL transfer fee comes in when the gun is shipped into the shop from a seller elsewhere in the state, or outside of California.

3) if i hypothetically happened to have another handgun that wasn't in my name, could I do the other(s) at the same time to save on DROS fees or "FFL service fees"? Or, would each one be a separate charge?

No need to do anything.
Handguns transferred prior to 1991 were not required to be registered. Possession of an unregistered handgun is in and of itself not a crime, though it does enhance the penalties for other crimes that may be committed while the gun is in the direct possession of the person committing the crime.
Generally, possession of an unregistered handgun during the commission of a crime will bump a misdemeanor to felony status.

4) what would happen if someone got caught just possessing (not concealed carrying, using in a crime etc.) a handgun that wasn't in their name? Criminal charges? Fines? forfeiture of weapon or could they register it and get it back?

Non-issue. It's not a crime.
The crime would have been the unlawful transfer. That was a one-time occurrence. Due to the statute of limitations, it would be difficult for the state to prosecute.

5) last but not least, just to protect myself and make sure, is there any easy way for me to run the serial number to MAKE SURE it is not HOT first? I trust the person selling it but he could have been fed a line from who he got it from? I have a cop friend, could he run it for me?

Your cop friend would be able to run it for you.

Oh, P.S. Do I still the HSC if I have a current CCW permit?

I'm not 100% sure. I believe the CCW is an exemption, but I'd check with your FFL to be sure.

[ripro75]

Cokebottle pretty much summed it up.

A current CCW does exempt you from the HSC.

[kemasa]

In addition to what was said above:

You would save money by doing multiple PPTs of handguns at the same time. The after the first DROS, the total DROS fees are $21, so you would save $4 per additional firearm. But then you need to arrange all the other parties to come to the FFL at the same time or before (if the FFL agrees).

You are exempt from the HSC if you have a CCW:

http://ag.ca.gov/firearms/hsc2.php

If the firearm is stolen and you are not aware of it, it is the seller who would have a problem, not you.

[Cokebottle]

You would save money by doing multiple PPTs of handguns at the same time. The after the first DROS, the total DROS fees are $21, so you would save $4 per additional firearm. But then you need to arrange all the other parties to come to the FFL at the same time or before (if the FFL agrees).

I got the impression that he already has a number of handguns that are not currently registered, and of course in many counties that precludes their use under his LTC, so the $19 VolReg would do the job.

If the firearm is stolen and you are not aware of it, it is the seller who would have a problem, not you.

Unless it's one he has and is running a VolReg.

And of course, in the case of the felon's gun, he wouldn't want to put an innocent 3rd party at risk.


And OP, keep in mind that there is nothing you need to do for long guns. Your unregistered rifles and shotguns are perfectly legal (beyond any issues as to the legality of the transfer that put them into your possession).
You can VolReg a rifle or shotgun if you'd like, but there's no legal reason to do so as long guns are not registered (until 2014).

[Cokebottle]

ETA:

My above post may be a bit confusing... I got this thread confused with another current thread about someone wanting to find a legal way to transfer a handgun from a felon.

[Suavegato]

WOW, great info. guys, thanks again. I am still a bit confused on a couple things though?

1) what is "VolReg" and "LPT"?
2) If I am understanding this right, I can go into an FFL with my friend who is selling me the gun, even though it is NOT in his name, and we can do the P-work and transfer it into my name legally. (assuming of course I pass the background and have the HSC or my CCW supersedes the HSC). and the MAX price for that is DROS +$10. BWT, Is DROS still $25?

OR, if I find an FFL who is willing, I can have my friend go in and do his P-work and I can go in at a diff. time and do mine. Who brings the weapon to the FFL in that case or does it matter? I would assume my friend brings it in, does his P-work and leaves the weapon with the FFL? Then I go do my P-work and return to pick it up after the wait period?

Now, "hypothetically" say I had another weapon or two that were manufactured after 1991 that we never transferred into my name. How can I clear that up now and get them into my name, if the the person they came from is not available? Can I just go to an FFL with them and say, I'd like to register these guns in my name? And as long as they aren't stolen, I'm good to go? And if I did that at the same time, what is the additional cost per weapon?

Thanks again guys, appreciate you helping me get my mess straightened out.

[Cokebottle]

1) what is "VolReg"

http://ag.ca.gov/firearms/forms/pdf/volreg.pdf

Fill out the form, send it and $19 to the DOJ, voila... you're registered.

and "LPT"?

You mean License To Carry? LTC is the CGF-preferred way to refer to CCW, as it is (especially with UOC now outlawed) truly a License to Carry, which is unconstitutional under McDonald

2) If I am understanding this right, I can go into an FFL with my friend who is selling me the gun, even though it is NOT in his name, and we can do the P-work and transfer it into my name legally. (assuming of course I pass the background and have the HSC or my CCW supersedes the HSC). and the MAX price for that is DROS +$10. BWT, Is DROS still $25?

Correct.

DROS is still a total of $25. That is broken down as a $19 DROS, $1 Firearms Safety Testing fee, and $5 Safety and Enforcement fee.
(PC sections 12071(b)(11), (12))

On the VolReg, only the $19 DROS fee applies (even though it is not a "dealer record of sale"... it's just a registration procedure).

OR, if I find an FFL who is willing, I can have my friend go in and do his P-work and I can go in at a diff. time and do mine. Who brings the weapon to the FFL in that case or does it matter? I would assume my friend brings it in, does his P-work and leaves the weapon with the FFL? Then I go do my P-work and return to pick it up after the wait period?

If the FFL is willing, yes, it is legal.
The seller would have to bring the gun in and initiate the paperwork. At that point, the gun goes into the dealer's bound book and his safe.

Now, "hypothetically" say I had another weapon or two that were manufactured after 1991 that we never transferred into my name. How can I clear that up now and get them into my name, if the the person they came from is not available? Can I just go to an FFL with them and say, I'd like to register these guns in my name? And as long as they aren't stolen, I'm good to go? And if I did that at the same time, what is the additional cost per weapon?

That's what the VolReg would be best used for.
Since it would be neither a PPT nor an FFL transfer, the dealer would just look at you and say "Why would you want to register them?"

[Suavegato]

http://ag.ca.gov/firearms/forms/pdf/volreg.pdf

Fill out the form, send it and $19 to the DOJ, voila... you're registered.

That's what the VolReg would be best used for.
Since it would be neither a PPT nor an FFL transfer, the dealer would just look at you and say "Why would you want to register them?"

Wow guys, this all very good info. THANK you all so much for sharing... I was busy over the holidays etc. but getting back to taking care of this. Really the only reason I want to get one of these particular weapons into my name (VolReg I guess?) is to add it to my CCW, or LTC I guess is the correct term now? As I understand it, any weapon listed on the LTC (Sac County) has to be legally registered to me. So, sounds like for $19 I can do the VolReg and get it into my name! AFTER I have my cop friend run it to make sure it's clean.

So as for any of my other hypothetical handguns that are not registered to me, at this point, I guess there is really no point to putting them in my name, right? As I will not be using them in any crimes nor adding to my LTC. Cool Beans Guys, Thanks a bunch!

So as for the VolReg, I guess I just download and fill out the form and send it into DOJ with a check, that's it?

Thanks.

[Librarian]

Wow guys, this all very good info. THANK you all so much for sharing... I was busy over the holidays etc. but getting back to taking care of this. Really the only reason I want to get one of these particular weapons into my name (VolReg I guess?) is to add it to my CCW, or LTC I guess is the correct term now? As I understand it, any weapon listed on the LTC (Sac County) has to be legally registered to me. So, sounds like for $19 I can do the VolReg and get it into my name! AFTER I have my cop friend run it to make sure it's clean.

So as for any of my other hypothetical handguns that are not registered to me, at this point, I guess there is really no point to putting them in my name, right? As I will not be using them in any crimes nor adding to my LTC. Cool Beans Guys, Thanks a bunch!

So as for the VolReg, I guess I just download and fill out the form and send it into DOJ with a check, that's it?

Thanks.

1 form, 1 fee for EACH gun.

OTOH, it is not the case that the state requires guns on your LTC to be registered; some issuing agencies have that preference.