Interfamilial transfer...sort of technical...

[Infantry H2]

So I read the calguns foundation info but I can't get a clear explanation about transferring a long gun to my brother in law. It's actually a couple AR lowers registered as long guns. I see I can give them to my mom and my mom can give them to my sister and my sister can then give them to my brother in law. But the forms I found say not to list long guns. WTH? Seems legit, right? Son to mother, mother to daughter, wife to husband. Correct? Just where do I document this? Thanks in advance CalGuns.

[foxtrotuniformlima]

At this time, only handguns need to be registered. IIRC, there is a voluntary registration form for long guns but I don't think anyone uses them.

My dad gave me a shotgun. According to the DOJ, there is nothing to report.

As long as everyone involved has a good memory, you have no worries. If the people involved have bad memories or you think they may go sideways on you someday, write the transactions up and get those involved to sign their name on the dotted line.

Not needed but not bad to have to CYA.

[Infantry H2]

Thanks any other thoughts?

[Librarian]

Until the new provisions added by AB 809 go into effect (Jan 1, 2014) there is no intrafamilial paperwork or fees for long guns.

But after 2014, if that stays law, it will be cheaper to PPT the long gun than to do 3 intrafamilial transfers.

Keep in mind the intrafamilial transfer provision isn't meant to cover your situation - if it were, the definition of 'family member' would have been more expansive.

[Mssr. Eleganté]

Thanks any other thoughts?

Transferring firearms to your brother-in-law that way is a violation of California law. Penal Code Section 12072(a) prohibits using the intrafamilial exemption to "bounce" transfers off of exempt relatives to get a firearm to somebody who would not be exempt from the real transfer.

12072. (a)

(4) No person, corporation, or dealer shall sell, loan, or transfer a firearm to any person whom he or she knows or has cause to believe is not the actual purchaser or transferee of the firearm, or to any person who is not the person actually being loaned the firearm, if the person, corporation, or dealer has either of the following:
(A) Knowledge that the firearm is to be subsequently loaned, sold, or transferred to avoid the provisions of subdivision (c) or (d).
(B) Knowledge that the firearm is to be subsequently loaned, sold, or transferred to avoid the requirements of any exemption to the provisions of subdivision (c) or (d).
(5) No person, corporation, or dealer shall acquire a firearm for the purpose of selling, transferring, or loaning the firearm, if the person, corporation, or dealer has either of the following:
(A) In the case of a dealer, intent to violate subdivision (b) or (c).
(B) In any other case, intent to avoid either of the following:
(i) The provisions of subdivision (d).
(ii) The requirements of any exemption to the provisions of subdivision (d).

[kemasa]

While you might get away with it, the above post is correct and you have to wonder if it is worth the risk vs. the cost to just do a PPT directly.

[popups]

Out of State Handgun Transfers

For an example, can you transfer a handgun (off list) from a child (21yrs+) that resides out of state, to a parent that resides in California through a FFL?

Would it be illegal if the parent were to then transfer/sell/gift, through a FFL, to another child within the state that can legally own firearms, said handgun? Or is there a period of time the parent must wait?

Out of state child -> FFL -> California parent -> FFL -> California child

[kemasa]

The answer to the first question is yes, a firearm that is not on the list can be transferred from a child out of state to the parent through a CA FFL, but you need to make sure that the FFL knows how to do it.

The second question is more difficult since it is more of a legal question and how the CA DOJ would view it and how they would view your intent. If you got a firearm in that way and then decided that you did not like it and decided to give it to someone else or sell it, then it is legal. If you intend to do that in advance it could be considered a means of getting around the law and be illegal.

[popups]

So I would make the assumption, if a transfer to the CA child was done soon after the out of state transfer, they may perceive that as an attempt to circumvent the spirit of the law.

How long after the out of state transfer would it be reasonable for the parent to sell/gift the handgun within the family?

[kemasa]

They might not care or they might really care and that can change from time to time.

Only the CA DOJ knows how long would be reasonable.

[Dingoguns]

"Reasonable" being a rather subjective term when applying it to the DOJ.