Received 03 SOT...have questions

[THT]

I have had my 01 FFL for two months now and just received my 03 SOT. I, of course, have questions about what I've gotten myself into (seemed like a good idea at the time).

1. What is the protocol for making purchases from manufacturers? Fill out a Form 3 for what I want to stock and send it in to the ATF to approve then forward the approved Form 3 to the manufacturer?
2. Do you have to order the Form 3 and Form 4 documents from the ATF or will they accept a print out of the PDF they provide online?
3. Is it normal to have a customer pre-pay for the NFA stuff when ordering through you?
4. How does logging cans and SBRs into/out of your bound book work?
5. Am I correct in saying that as an 03 SOT, the only way to get a select fire, post-86 machine gun is with a demo letter from the CLEO?

[ke6guj]

I have had my 01 FFL for two months now and just received my 03 SOT. I, of course, have questions about what I've gotten myself into (seemed like a good idea at the time).

1. What is the protocol for making purchases from manufacturers? Fill out a Form 3 for what I want to stock and send it in to the ATF to approve then forward the approved Form 3 to the manufacturer?

I'll use Serbu as an example: You want to get some Super Shorties. You call Mark and tell him you want to order some. You give him your FFL and SOT info (dunno if you need to mail/fax it to him or not). HE fills out the Form 3 to get permission to transfer those SSS's from him to you, he sends it to ATF. ATF approves it and sends it back to Serbu. Serbu then boxes up the SSS's and ships them to you.

That is how it basically works AFAIK. There isn't even a space for you, the transferee, to sign the Form 3.

2. Do you have to order the Form 3 and Form 4 documents from the ATF or will they accept a print out of the PDF they provide online?

you can use the PDF forms on the website, that is what they are provided for.

4. How does logging cans and SBRs into/out of your bound book work?

AFAIK, it gets logged in the same way that Title 1 firearms do, but some/many/most dealers keep a separate log book of their Title 2 stuff.

5. Am I correct in saying that as an 03 SOT, the only way to get a select fire, post-86 machine gun is with a demo letter from the CLEO?

yup, and that applies to pre-86 dealer samples as well (imported MGs). But with pre-86 stuff, you can keep them if you let your SOT expire (which is why pre-86 DS's are often almost as expensive as transferables).

[THT]

Somehow, I knew you'd be the first to chime in; thanks!

Someone on another board mentioned that an 03 SOT can purchase post-86 MGs from a SOT who is letting their license lapse and getting out of the business without the need for a demo letter. I haven't been able to find anything to substantiate that though.

[ke6guj]

Somehow, I knew you'd be the first to chime in; thanks!

Someone on another board mentioned that an 03 SOT can purchase post-86 MGs from a SOT who is letting their license lapse and getting out of the business without the need for a demo letter. I haven't been able to find anything to substantiate that though.

AFAIK, it is only 02SOTs (07FFLs) that can do that. sorta makes sense when you think about it. An 02 can make a hundred post-86 MGs if he wants to, why should he need a love letter to buy one? So, ATF will allow them to buy those post-86 guns from an SOT who is letting his SOT expire, no love letter needed, but I think they still need the letter if they were to just buy a post-86 MG if there isn't a SOT expiration involved.

[GoingQuiet]

Somehow, I knew you'd be the first to chime in; thanks!

Someone on another board mentioned that an 03 SOT can purchase post-86 MGs from a SOT who is letting their license lapse and getting out of the business without the need for a demo letter. I haven't been able to find anything to substantiate that though.

If you are an SOT - an SOT period, regardless of class you can sell your post 86 samples without a demo letter to another SOT.

That having been said - You'll almost never see any come up for sale because the SOT network is pretty tight. Any SOT worth their salt will have everything spoken for pretty quick if they decide they are throwing in the towel.

[GoingQuiet]

I have had my 01 FFL for two months now and just received my 03 SOT. I, of course, have questions about what I've gotten myself into (seemed like a good idea at the time).

1. What is the protocol for making purchases from manufacturers? Fill out a Form 3 for what I want to stock and send it in to the ATF to approve then forward the approved Form 3 to the manufacturer?
2. Do you have to order the Form 3 and Form 4 documents from the ATF or will they accept a print out of the PDF they provide online?
3. Is it normal to have a customer pre-pay for the NFA stuff when ordering through you?
4. How does logging cans and SBRs into/out of your bound book work?
5. Am I correct in saying that as an 03 SOT, the only way to get a select fire, post-86 machine gun is with a demo letter from the CLEO?

The previous post nailed it - and I'll expand a little here.

1. You order the item and THEY do the paperwork. In this business, seller does paperwork.

2. Adobe Professional will be your friend. You will likely have templates for everything - lord knows I do. Submit in duplicate - don't print the instruction part, they are wastes of paper.

3. Absolutely normal. Only thing that is different from Title 1 is that once paperwork starts, you can't just "cancel" a transaction because they changed their mind. All my special order items are 100% prepaid to start paperwork - and that's me ordering it - not the customer form 4.

4. You log it out when it goes out. I currently have probably 40 entries in my bound book with forms pending on 25+ of them. When it goes out the door, take it out of the book. What I do is I keep two entire shelves of items that have been paid for in full with ATF approval pending so I don't get it mixed up with my available for sale items. It can be VERY easy to sell the same item twice - and that would be bad.

5. That is correct.

[ke6guj]

If you are an SOT - an SOT period, regardless of class you can sell your post 86 samples without a demo letter to another SOT.

huh, AFAIK, all post-86 samples sold from one SOT to another SOT require the demo letter, unless the selling SOT discontinuing his SOT and the receiving SOT is an 01 or 02 SOT, not an 03 SOT.

The transfer of a machinegun manufactured
after May 19, 1986 to a qualified manufacturer or qualified importer . That fact that
the transferring FFL is discontinuing business must be documented with the submission of the transfer
applications. Transfer of a machinegun manufactured after May 19, 1986 from an FFL/SOT going out
of business to a qualified dealer requires compliance with section 479.105(d).

http://www.atf.gov/publications/down...chapter-14.pdf

[GoingQuiet]

Let me rephrase that because the statement that I made was specifically in regard to your non-renewal statement.

In the event you are an SOT with post samples and you do not renew your SOT....

You can sell your post samples without a demo letter to any SOT.

....is the way I've always understood it. I'll write ATF a letter.

[ke6guj]

everything I've read online says that the "No letter" deal only applies to manufacturers/importers, not dealers.

the FFL/SOT going
out of business to transfer machinegun(s) manufactured after May 19, 1986 to a Federal, State or local
government entity, qualified manufacturer, qualified importer, or, subject to the provisions of
479.105(d), to a qualified dealer. Transfer of a machinegun manufactured after May 19, 1986 from an FFL/SOT going out
of business to a qualified dealer requires compliance with section 479.105(d).

that 479.105(d) section is the requirement for the demo letter to dealers, even if the seller is disposing of post-86 MGs because his SOT is expiring.

[GoingQuiet]

Mea culpa, you nailed it. I checked both versions of the NFA book I have because I wanted to be sure but I got it wrong.

OP - sounds like you are out of luck. Perhaps you should do an 07 like I did.

[THT]

Mea culpa, you nailed it. I checked both versions of the NFA book I have because I wanted to be sure but I got it wrong.

OP - sounds like you are out of luck. Perhaps you should do an 07 like I did.

Nah, not in a hurry to get into the MG game...yet

[m24armorer]