Unlicensed Person Shipping to FFL

[eville]

I'm trying to buy a Pistol from a guy in SoCal and have it shipped to a NorCal FFL.
The FFL does not want to provide a copy of their FFL to the unlicensed person.

I have the first thee and last five and have checked their license on EZ Check.

Does EZ Check supply enough information for the unlicensed person to legally ship the gun?

Gunbroker says no, but another dealer site says yes, because most FFLs do not want to go giving away copies of their FFL to unlicensed people.

We tried to have another FFL ship directly to my FFL, but the cost was REDICULOUS.

Please help!

[TRICKSTER]

You can also confirm his FFL info here.

http://www.atf.gov/about/foia/ffl-list.html

[Mssr. Eleganté]

...Does EZ Check supply enough information for the unlicensed person to legally ship the gun?...

Yes it does. If you are unlicensed then using EZ Check to verify an FFL is standard operating procedure. The law only requires FFLs to exchange copies of their licenses with other FFLs. ATF often tells FFLs not to give away copies of their licenses to non-FFLs.

[eville]

That's what I thought but how can I convince the seller?

[Mssr. Eleganté]

...but how can I convince the seller?

Tell him to read this thread?

If he is concerned about making sure he ships to a real FFL then EZ Check is much safer than just a photocopy of a license. The photocopy could be faked. If he wants something for his records to prove that he really shipped to an FFL he could always just do a <PRINT SCREEN> of the EZ Check web page that has the FFLs address verification. If you have a good relationship with the receiving FFL you could see if he would send out a copy of his license with the words "FILE COPY ONLY" written across it a bunch of times in big black marker.

[eville]

Tell him to read this thread?

If he is concerned about making sure he ships to a real FFL then EZ Check is much safer than just a photocopy of a license. The photocopy could be faked. If he wants something for his records to prove that he really shipped to an FFL he could always just do a <PRINT SCREEN> of the EZ Check web page that has the FFLs address verification. If you have a good relationship with the receiving FFL you could see if he would send out a copy of his license with the words "FILE COPY ONLY" written across it a bunch of times in big black marker.

I believe and I would feel comfortable, but I understand his concerns.
And it's not that I don't believe everything I read, but is this information "published" anywhere on the internet like the ATF, DOJ or similar regulatory agency?

[ripro75]

It doesn't get any more "official" than the ATF's EZ check site. https://www.atfonline.gov/fflezcheck/
Alot of people don't even know what a copy of an FFL's license even looks like of if it is even legit. The EZ check is used for exactly your reason, it has the licensee name, address, and expiration.

[eville]

I read that you need a signed copy of the ffl. I have not seen anything "official" that says e check is an approved alternate.
Gunbroker has a section on this topic called shipment by unlicensed person

http://www.gunbroker.com/Support/SupportFAQView.aspx?FAQID=1118&NoCount=1

Damn it shouldn't be this hard.

[ripro75]

That is only what Gunbroker says, it in not required per federal or state law. It IS required for FFL's to get a signed copy though. The seller is making it hard on you, not dealers. The dealer could make it hard and require it to be sent from an FFL.
Have them call ATF and/or DOJ and ask. Good luck!!

[kemasa]

Call the BATF. There is also a thread about this and a link to a newsletter that the BATF sent out which states that a FFL does not have to give a copy of their FFL to a non-FFL. The BATF also says to not give out copies to non-FFLs.

See:

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showpost.php?p=4272186&postcount=9

Perhaps we need a FAQ sticky for these types of things.

[eville]

Thanks to all for the help. I'm just surprised I can't find the requirements clearly written by the ATF somewhere.

[kemasa]

I posted the BATF clear words.

[eville]

I posted the BATF clear words.

thanks, we were posting at the same time, i was just slow because i was on my iPhone. Hopefully this is enough to convince the seller. Otherwise I guess I miss out on my new gun.
thanks.

[kemasa]

If the seller does not accept that, then have them ship it through a FFL (at their cost). The seller can call the BATF to confirm the law/rules.

BTW, if the person can find a low cost FFL, shipping the handgun through a FFL can be cheaper since it can be shipped USPS. If the seller is near Simi Valley, have him contact me.

Timing is everything :-).

[foxtrotuniformlima]

When I have shipped stuff to a FFL, both in and out of state, I have gotten a copy of the FFL.

Seems you have 2 choices ; find another FFL who is not as paranoid about giving out a copy of his FFL or have the seller find a FFL who will not rape them for shipping it.

I guess there is always #3: FTF.