Selling a gun for my sister?

[Lethal_addict]

need to ask... Here's the deal.

"PLEASE ONLY RESPOND IF YOUR A LICENSED FFL DEALER"

My sister lives in AZ I live in Ca. Several yrs ago she gave me her pistol to hold as she went through a divorce when she lived here. (It was originally mine, that I sold to her as new). So I still have her pistol and she doesn't want it and doesn't feel comfortable with it in her home.

She asked if I could sell it for her then ship it and transfer it to an FFL to be picked up and sold. I know that you can sell & ship to an FFL and have the gun Droz'd for pick up if its yours. But can I do it for her?

So the question is can I do this for her legally in CA, and include her AZ Drivers License and a bill of sale signed by her in the package to the FFL? That way I can offer this fine SIG P230 (.380) CCW GEM to other calgunners...

Thanks in Advance,

Lethal Addict

[kemasa]

No, you can not do it for her. If a FFL were to see the return address not matching the documentation, they should start asking questions or just refuse to deal with it.

When you sold it to her, did you do a transfer (DROS)? If not, then it is still registered to you.

[jtmkinsd]

need to ask... Here's the deal.

"PLEASE ONLY RESPOND IF YOUR A LICENSED FFL DEALER"

My sister lives in AZ I live in Ca. Several yrs ago she gave me her pistol to hold as she went through a divorce when she lived here. (It was originally mine, that I sold to her as new). So I still have her pistol and she doesn't want it and doesn't feel comfortable with it in her home.

She asked if I could sell it for her then ship it and transfer it to an FFL to be picked up and sold. I know that you can sell & ship to an FFL and have the gun Droz'd for pick up if its yours. But can I do it for her?

So the question is can I do this for her legally in CA, and include her AZ Drivers License and a bill of sale signed by her in the package to the FFL? That way I can offer this fine SIG P230 (.380) CCW GEM to other calgunners...

Thanks in Advance,

Lethal Addict

P230 is not on the roster...so first off, it can only be sold in CA to a roster exempt individual, or out of State. While there is nothing in the law which forbids what you are asking to do...finding an FFL in your area willing to go along may be difficult. What you would need to do is have your sister call the FFL you want to use and explain the situation...she could fax or email a copy of her ID and information to the FFL and you could bring the firearm to the FFL. If you found a local roster exempt individual, then the FFL could treat it as a shipped in transfer. She is in AZ...so what I would recommend you do is ship the firearm to an FFL in AZ close to your sister (since she's so skittish about guns). She could then go down to the FFL with her ID and they could work out what to do from there. Perhapse she could leave it on consignment with the FFL in AZ.

[pdq_wizzard]

No, you can not do it for her. If a FFL were to see the return address not matching the documentation, they should start asking questions or just refuse to deal with it.

When you sold it to her, did you do a transfer (DROS)? If not, then it is still registered to you.

I know I'm not an FFL but, it depends on how many years ago this was as to if the gun is register to anyone.

edit to add, Ca started Handgun registration in 1991.

[kemasa]

The DROS has been required before 1991 and the information for handguns has been recorded. There is no real "registration" in CA, but CA does maintain a list of serial numbers to owners for all that they can get their hands on.

[kemasa]

If the P230 was owned by a CA resident, then it could be transferred as a PPT as that is exempt from having to be on the roster.

There IS something in the law which forbids what is being asked and that is that a FFL has to record who they actually got the firearm from. In this case, the firearm is coming from one person and the paperwork is claiming it is coming from another person. The FFL can not go along with that.

[jtmkinsd]

If the P230 was owned by a CA resident, then it could be transferred as a PPT as that is exempt from having to be on the roster.

There IS something in the law which forbids what is being asked and that is that a FFL has to record who they actually got the firearm from. In this case, the firearm is coming from one person and the paperwork is claiming it is coming from another person. The FFL can not go along with that.

Problem is she's not a CA resident now...he state's gun isn't his...she's in AZ...what would you recommend?

[Lethal_addict]

I am kinda confused with what you said here. I bought that gun here in Ca. 8 yrs ago... It was on the roster, was it taken off? In addition to that let me clarify...

I was the original owner, purchased in turners in 2002ish (i think). We transferred the firearm under her name legally while she lived in Ca., the gun has never left the state.

Two questions:

1) Could it be shipped from her (her address and info) to the FFL
2) Could I take the gun to the FFL with a copy of her Drivers Lic. and credentials and a bill of sale.
3) What else could be done?

Thanks in Advance

P230 is not on the roster...so first off, it can only be sold in CA to a roster exempt individual, or out of State. While there is nothing in the law which forbids what you are asking to do...finding an FFL in your area willing to go along may be difficult. What you would need to do is have your sister call the FFL you want to use and explain the situation...she could fax or email a copy of her ID and information to the FFL and you could bring the firearm to the FFL. If you found a local roster exempt individual, then the FFL could treat it as a shipped in transfer. She is in AZ...so what I would recommend you do is ship the firearm to an FFL in AZ close to your sister (since she's so skittish about guns). She could then go down to the FFL with her ID and they could work out what to do from there. Perhapse she could leave it on consignment with the FFL in AZ.

[pdq_wizzard]

"OWNERSHIP REPORT" is still Registration (I don't care what they want to call it) and is required for all handgun transfers or if you move into the state with handguns.

IANAL but if all of this happened before 1991 it could all be a mot point. He has the gun and it was given to him. and it don't matter if the gun is not on the roster (as long as it was here before the roster started)

but I would like to see what someone in the know has to say.

[kemasa]

I asked a question as to whether it was actually transferred to her by means of a DROS being submitted. If not, then he is the legal owner and could sell it PPT.

If the transfer was done, then his sister could come and take it to a FFL or ship it to a buyer.

[kemasa]

"OWNERSHIP REPORT" is still Registration (I don't care what they want to call it) and is required for all handgun transfers or if you move into the state with handguns.

Yes, but that started well before 1991. Only transfers since the law was changed are recorded, so a person could have legally purchased a firearm from a person, but the state is not aware of it. It also does not change the legal ownership of the firearm if the state does not know about it.

The real point is that all the firearms that were purchased before are not required to be registered or anything else, although it can cause issues if there is police involvement.

[jtmkinsd]

I am kinda confused with what you said here. I bought that gun here in Ca. 8 yrs ago... It was on the roster, was it taken off? In addition to that let me clarify...

Sig did not renew the P230 as it's an older model.

I was the original owner, purchased in turners in 2002ish (i think). We transferred the firearm under her name legally while she lived in Ca., the gun has never left the state.

Two questions:

1) Could it be shipped from her (her address and info) to the FFL

Yes

2) Could I take the gun to the FFL with a copy of her Drivers Lic. and credentials and a bill of sale.

Another FFL might do this for you...but you may have trouble finding one. I have taken firearms from 3rd parties to dispose of for the owner...but there's a lot of communication, faxing, emailing...and most probably don't want to be bothered.

3) What else could be done?

It is legal to ship firearms to yourself. So let's say, for instance, she can come to your place box up the firearm, and ship it to her address in AZ...she can then take that box to an FFL that offers consignment sales and dispose of it that way.

She can list it on gunbroker or another sight and ship the box to the buyers FFL.

[kemasa]

The answer to question 1 is only yes IF she is the one sending it, not if another person actually sends it and claims it is from her.

[tenpercentfirearms]

need to ask... Here's the deal.

"PLEASE ONLY RESPOND IF YOUR A LICENSED FFL DEALER"

My sister lives in AZ I live in Ca. Several yrs ago she gave me her pistol to hold as she went through a divorce when she lived here. (It was originally mine, that I sold to her as new). So I still have her pistol and she doesn't want it and doesn't feel comfortable with it in her home.

She asked if I could sell it for her then ship it and transfer it to an FFL to be picked up and sold. I know that you can sell & ship to an FFL and have the gun Droz'd for pick up if its yours. But can I do it for her?

So the question is can I do this for her legally in CA, and include her AZ Drivers License and a bill of sale signed by her in the package to the FFL? That way I can offer this fine SIG P230 (.380) CCW GEM to other calgunners...

Thanks in Advance,

Lethal Addict

Legally no. Now, if you shipped it with a copy of her DL and the return label had her address, would anyone know any different? Well it doesn't matter, that would be the wrong thing to do.

Again if you tried to do a PPT here in CA, technically this would be illegal because it is not your handgun. Again, how would the participating FFL know and would the DOJ care? Again, this is the wrong way to think as it would be wrong.

Basically, the only right way to do it is to have her pick up her gun and dispose of it in accordance with the law.