Armed FFL employees

[SDProtection]

The conversation came up the other day about "where" an employee can be armed while at work. Can they be armed walking through the parking lot, from their vehicle to the door of the shop? What about taking the trash out? Basically, we all know they can openly carry in the shop, but where is the line for "business property and public property?

Our shop is in a commercial building that has a large parking lot but also has other tenants in the upper floors. So therein lies the question about where on the property is ok to carry....

anyone have any experience or guidance on this?

Thanks!

[Capt_Communist]

What I did was to have my employees carry inside only... occasionally we went outside to do whatever and we didn't get any hassle from the local LEO because they figured the parking lot is business property and we were good to go.

I'd suggest talking to the other businesses in the building and see if they're gun friendly, so they don't call the cops and make a big stink.... my other businesses were super cool cause the area tended to have less issues with a gun shop around.

Good luck

[blueviper]

Parking lot is a "private property"

[Turo]

Parking lot is a "private property"

It may be privately owned, but if it's accessible to the public then it's not legal to carry a firearm there any more than across the street.

The only time employees can carry firearms loaded and either exposed or concealed is if they are inside their businesses walls or in a closed, fenced-off, area.

[dachan]

The conversation came up the other day about "where" an employee can be armed while at work. Can they be armed walking through the parking lot, from their vehicle to the door of the shop? What about taking the trash out? Basically, we all know they can openly carry in the shop, but where is the line for "business property and public property?

Our shop is in a commercial building that has a large parking lot but also has other tenants in the upper floors. So therein lies the question about where on the property is ok to carry....

anyone have any experience or guidance on this?

Thanks!

Besides where you plan to carry, like having a CCW, you should also ask whether you or your employees are willing and qualified to use the firearm should the need arise, and whether your business is prepared to handle the resulting liability, legal and other issues should a firearm be used.

[spencerhut]

Good thing we have the entire property fenced off. My business neighbors like that we all carry, makes them feel safer when we are around.

[inbox485]

Parking lot is a "private property"

There is a member that doesn't post often anymore that learned the hard way that those protections won't cover you in court (for now at least).

[tube snake boogie]

It may be privately owned, but if it's accessible to the public then it's not legal to carry a firearm there any more than across the street.

The only time employees can carry firearms loaded and either exposed or concealed is if they are inside their businesses walls or in a closed, fenced-off, area.

I don't think so. that is like saying you cannot carry a weapon on the parking lot of your home cause the mailman or Avon lady can walk on it to knock on your door.
what statute or case law do you cite to support your position, or are you just guessing/assuming?

[Librarian]

I don't think so. that is like saying you cannot carry a weapon on the parking lot of your home cause the mailman or Avon lady can walk on it to knock on your door.
what statute or case law do you cite to support your position, or are you just guessing/assuming?

You need to become familiar with the peculiar case of People vs Overturf. See the wiki entry: http://wiki.calgunsfoundation.org/in...oncealed_Carry

[paul0660]

that is like saying you cannot carry a weapon on the parking lot of your home cause the mailman or Avon lady can walk on it to knock on your door.

It sure is. Stick around, you will learn a lot.

[jtmkinsd]

You need to become familiar with the peculiar case of People vs Overturf. See the wiki entry: http://wiki.calgunsfoundation.org/in...oncealed_Carry

In reading this and pondering the OP's question, "employees" are not authorized to carry at work because they have no "...proprietary,
possessory, or substantial ownership interest in the place"...right? Unless they have a concealed carry permit?

That is, if your business is "open to the public"?

[pullnshoot25]

Re: Armed FFL employees

You need to become familiar with the peculiar case of People vs Overturf. See the wiki entry: [url]http://wiki.calgunsfoundation.org/index.php/Unlice

In reading this and pondering the OP's question, "employees" are not authorized to carry at work because they have no "...proprietary,
possessory, or substantial ownership interest in the place"...right? Unless they have a concealed carry permit?

Correct.

[BillCA]

In reading this and pondering the OP's question, "employees" are not authorized to carry at work because they have no "...proprietary,
possessory, or substantial ownership interest in the place"...right? Unless they have a concealed carry permit?

That is, if your business is "open to the public"?

Unless said employees can exclude persons from the business and/or control the activities of the business. This means if the employees can tell any person(s) to leave and can control the activities -- such as refusing to service customers, make appointments, open or close the store, direct others, etc. -- then they have a possessory interest.

Questions for Lawyers:
1. How far from a public thoroughfare (street, sidewalk, etc.) is considered a "public area"? Can you be charged with CCW in your huge front yard when standing 800 ft from a public access point?

2. If the above answer is "yes" because that is a "public place" as referenced by statutes, then may a gov't body legally use that same 800 ft position to post a "public notice", as required by statute, and satisfy the requirement of posting the notice? If not, why is it different?

[pullnshoot25]

Unless said employees can exclude persons from the business and/or control the activities of the business. This means if the employees can tell any person(s) to leave and can control the activities -- such as refusing to service customers, make appointments, open or close the store, direct others, etc. -- then they have a possessory interest.

Questions for Lawyers:
1. How far from a public thoroughfare (street, sidewalk, etc.) is considered a "public area"? Can you be charged with CCW in your huge front yard when standing 800 ft from a public access point?

2. If the above answer is "yes" because that is a "public place" as referenced by statutes, then may a gov't body legally use that same 800 ft position to post a "public notice", as required by statute, and satisfy the requirement of posting the notice? If not, why is it different?

Not quite. A gate has to be involved for your line of thinking to be valid.

[SDProtection]

In reading this and pondering the OP's question, "employees" are not authorized to carry at work because they have no "...proprietary,
possessory, or substantial ownership interest in the place"...right? Unless they have a concealed carry permit?

That is, if your business is "open to the public"?