Interstate Transfer Fee

[Donny1]

So here is my question.

What is a fair price for an FFL to charge to do a transfer from another state?

Considering it is California I don't doubt there are some hoops to jump through.

Also, are the rates in California much different than other states?

The reason I'm asking started from the "rude gun shop" thread. The topic came up about taxing the fee, and so on. I posted about a nearby shop that has a very fair price for the service in my opinion, $44 total, with tax. Today I went to another local gun shop that I had never been to but has an outstanding reputation for great gunsmithing and fair prices. I happen to ask what they charge. He replied, $135.

Now I'm all for, what the market will bare, but wow! Do they not want to do it? How much time and hassle is really involved? Is the process the same every time? Should it be a set fee like the DROS?

Your thoughts please.

[ke6guj]

So here is my question.

What is a fair price for an FFL to charge to do a transfer from another state?

a fair price is, whatever they want to charge since you can go to another FFL what has a better price.


That said, most dealers set their transfer price to be $25-125 + $25DROS. There may be some cheaper and others more expensive, but most fall in that range.

Now I'm all for, what the market will bare, but wow! Do they not want to do it? How much time and hassle is really involved? Is the process the same every time? Should it be a set fee like the DROS?

Your thoughts please.

they either don't want to do transfers, and set the price high to discourage transfer seekers, or feel that transfers take money out of their pocket (since they didn't get to make a sale) and are attempting to make some "profit" on the deal.

should it be a set fee like the DROS, I dunno. Its not like you have to use them to do your transfer. YOu start setting the price too low and you chase off people that would be good dealers, but aren't willing to work that cheaply.

[Donny1]

Interesting

feel that transfers take money out of their pocket (since they didn't get to make a sale) and are attempting to make some "profit" on the deal.

Are they not making a profit by doing the transaction?

If their price was fair I don't think that would be an issue. Say they charge $50 for the transfer. The gun from out of state would have to be at least $70 cheaper considering a shipping charge around $20. or I would just buy it here. I want the person I'm dealing with to make a profit. He deserves a FAIR profit. But $70 or $100 more markup than the guy out of state on say a $500 gun? That's just greed.

I would hope it's the fact they just don't want the hassle.In my case it's something that nobody around has right now and the ones I've found are overpriced. I know, supply and demand but don't complain if I can find it at a NORMAL price somewhere else. Don't rape me because you know you can.

[Donny1]

BTW, What are we talking about so I understand.

Time to file and deal with paperwork, time spent with the customer, etc.

[ke6guj]

Are they not making a profit by doing the transaction?

right, the transfer fee is the profit they make. They don't make a profit on the sale of the gun, but want to be paid for the time and effort they put forward to do the transfer. plus, they have to pay the utilities, and other expenses, and you are "using" their FFL in order to get the gun you want. They want to be paid for the use of the FFL.

If their price was fair I don't think that would be an issue. Say they charge $50 for the transfer. The gun from out of state would have to be at least $70 cheaper considering a shipping charge around $20. or I would just buy it here. I want the person I'm dealing with to make a profit. He deserves a FAIR profit. But $70 or $100 more markup than the guy out of state on say a $500 gun? That's just greed.

remember that many of those out-of-state sellers are basically wholesalers, that have no real storefront and work on the "small profits add up" mentality and can sell for just over cost and by selling hundreds of guns a month can make a living, whereas your local brick and mortar dealer has to get closer to MSRP on the guns he sales, since his volume is gonna be less.

As for calling it greed, is it greed when a place like Best Buy or Target sells their merchandise as MSRP, such as a $500 TV, but a web-seller with no overhead can sell the same TV for $70-100 less?

[Donny1]

Very good points.

Are all FFL's required to do them or can they decline (or just charge enough so you will go away)?

[ke6guj]

an FFL is not required to do any transfer he doesn't wish to, with the exception of PPT transfers (transfer between two CA-residents). So, yes, they can decline, or set the fee at $200 to chase most people away.

[tenpercentfirearms]

Any dealer that sets his transfer fee over $75 let alone $100 simply doesn't want to do transfers. The only time they are willing to do transfers are for stupid people who don't realize there are a ton of dealers that do it for much less.

I don't blame those shops at all. They are trying to protect their profits by forcing you to buy the gun from them so they can get all of your money instead of farming it to some guy who operates out of his garage out of state.

I kept my transfer fee affordable because I want some guys to get good deals on guns. I like it when you find a smoking deal on Gun Broker or some idiot is just blowing out guns at a loss. So rather than ruin your good deal, I try to keep it affordable.

What I do that makes sense and would make more sense if my transfer fee was higher is on any long gun you buy from me, I just throw your transfer fee in. It is already worth it for me to run a DROS on a $150 lower, so if I receive a gun for you and just write it in on the 4473, that is so little work I don't care if you want to add it to your new gun.

This would make more sense if I charged $125 for a transfer. You have a choice of wasting $125 on a transfer for nothing or you can spend $25 more dollars and take home a lower. Or $100 more for a 10/22.

However, I will just keep it at $50. Actually I charged a guy $4.62 for his Daniel Defense lower transfer today. He didn't buy any other long guns. He just had transfered in a DD lower. $4.62 for his transfer to make it an even $30. He however did buy a LMT CQB piston upper today and has like three other handguns stacked up to be DROSed in the store.

My $50 transfer fee can be decreased depending on how much money you spend at the shop. Good solid, returning customers should not expect to pay $50 on transfers unless they ordered something that I could have gotten for them probably cheaper and they didn't check with me first. I usually don't feel sorry for those guys.

[Donny1]

Makes good sense.

Maybe FFL's should have to inform customers that the fee is arbitrary. If someone asks how much, how do they know it's not the standard. I say maybe because people that do not become informed prior are in a way at fault and I don't have a lot of pity for them but it doesn't mean they should be taken advantage of. I prefer to be educated and informed as to not waste peoples time and look like an idiot.

[ke6guj]

Existing law already states that FFL do have to have let customers know that any fees over the $25 in state DROS fees are dealer fees and charges. They can't pass them off as state fees.

How did the ininformed customer find out that he could even have a transfer done through a dealer, someone told him. Perhaps that person should have also explained that every dealer can set their own fees to do the transfer. And that is the situation nationwide, for the most part.

[Capt. Speirs]

Customer comes into my shop and checks out a gun he is interested in. He asks questions and leaves. Two days later that same customer asks me if I would do an interstate transfer for the very same gun. He brags how he found it for much less online. I am disappointed I lost the sale, however I am not bitter, the customer has the right to buy from whomever he wants. Will I do the transfer, hell yes? Will I gouge him, hell no, I want him to come back and buy ammo, accessories and anything else he needs for that gun. That is called free enterprise and god bless America.

[ke6guj]

thats just rude. If you are gonna play that game, don't go back to the same FFL you finger-****ed the product at to do the transfer.

[halifax]

Customer comes into my shop and checks out a gun he is interested in. He asks questions and leaves. Two days later that same customer asks me if I would do an interstate transfer for the very same gun. He brags how he found it for much less online. I am disappointed I lost the sale, however I am not bitter, the customer has the right to buy from whomever he wants. Will I do the transfer, hell yes? Will I gouge him, hell no, I want him to come back and buy ammo, accessories and anything else he needs for that gun. That is called free enterprise and god bless America.

Class act. Which is a helluva lot more than I can say for your customer.

[gunenvy]

Customer comes into my shop and checks out a gun he is interested in. He asks questions and leaves. Two days later that same customer asks me if I would do an interstate transfer for the very same gun. He brags how he found it for much less online. I am disappointed I lost the sale, however I am not bitter, the customer has the right to buy from whomever he wants. Will I do the transfer, hell yes? Will I gouge him, hell no, I want him to come back and buy ammo, accessories and anything else he needs for that gun. That is called free enterprise and god bless America.

Just happened to me. We had a guy call and ask a price on a Stag he has wanted a while, was all hopped up and excited that he would order it on pay day. Pay day comes and he emails to ask us to send our license to this other place for the Stag he got....

His reason, same price as us, but no sales tax, so even with our $20 transfer fee he is saving money.

Bummed.... yeah, but thats how it goes, he is the customer and thats how it goes, at least i got twenty bucks out of him

[tenpercentfirearms]

Just happened to me. We had a guy call and ask a price on a Stag he has wanted a while, was all hopped up and excited that he would order it on pay day. Pay day comes and he emails to ask us to send our license to this other place for the Stag he got....

His reason, same price as us, but no sales tax, so even with our $20 transfer fee he is saving money.

Bummed.... yeah, but thats how it goes, he is the customer and thats how it goes, at least i got twenty bucks out of him

Except you are going to be paying his sales tax if you ever get audited. If he orders it from another retailer, you are considered the actual retailer and should be paying the sales tax. If you get audited the BOE is going to want to know why you didn't pay the sales tax on that retail sale and then they are going to ask for that sales tax on that retail sale plus penalties and interest. Assuming you are talking about a Stag rifle, that is a minimum $100 you will probably have to pay on that $20 transfer.

You could then ask the customer to pay the sales tax, but he will probably tell you to kick rocks because it was not part of the sales agreement and there is no requirement that customers pay sales tax, but only that retailers pay it and can get reimbursed from the consumer for it.

And that guy who just ordered it out of state to avoid the sales tax, still owes use tax on it, so really he is cheating the system and violating the tax code, but you are the one taking all of the risk for him doing it.

Isn't being a dealer fun?