Hi cap mag sale question

[SDProtection]

Need some advice from FFL's please.

I have a customer who wants to buy hi-caps off my website. Customer is a CA resident but wants them shipped to out of state address. Sounds like he wants to do it as a gift to family member or something....

with that said, what say you all? Would this get me a visit by DOJ?

[SanPedroShooter]

Im not an 01ffl, but i've had fulton send 10+ regular mags to my address out of state. There a pretty big outfit.

[kemasa]

As long as it appears to be a gift or for use out of state, it should not be a problem. Make sure you document where the magazines go to (as required) and I would suggest getting a signature from where it is delivered to and keep all the shipping records.

[SDProtection]

As long as it appears to be a gift or for use out of state, it should not be a problem. Make sure you document where the magazines go to (as required) and I would suggest getting a signature from where it is delivered to and keep all the shipping records.

Good point on delivery confirmation. will do. BTW, where do you find the documentation that says we have to "document where the magazines go to (as required)." what/where is the requirement detailed so I can make sure I am up to speed on that.

thanks for the input.

[kemasa]

Second page, third paragraph of:

http://ag.ca.gov/firearms/forms/pdf/CLlcmpapp.pdf

Large Capacity Magazine permittees will be required to maintain acquisition and disposition records for all large capacity magazines they purchase, import or export. The records must be maintained at the dealership location for three years and upon request, be made available to law enforcement.

I use a sheet similar to the bound book. I also list each magazine separately since if you combine them and then sell them individually, it gets harder to document.

[SDProtection]

so in looking up 12079, there is nothing in the "law" itself that require A&D type of tracking for mags versus the "law" stating the requirement of an A&D in 12071 for an FFL to track firearms. therefore, the requirement to track is a policy of DOJ, correct? I am just a bit baffled, how do you track an item that has no serial #?

I know DOJ is requiring it based on the application, but it still is a bit perplexing as there is nothing in the law that requires the documentation.

anyway, guess I had better get to work on some sort of spreadsheet.

Thanks!

[TripleT]

Interesting thing is, the code says "The records must be maintained at the dealership location for three years and upon request, be made available to law enforcement." Doesn't say anything about BOF needing to review the records. As I understand it the BOF doesn't concern itself with your bound book, that is an issue for the ATF. Here they want the Mag A&D to be available for LE. I think they just want to know the mags are being tracked and the info would be available to LE. I don't think an audit of the records is likely but I could be wrong.

With all that said, this is what I use:
MagLog.jpg

[ugimports]

How do you guys log out rebuild kits (assuming you sell them) or mags you block?

[tenpercentfirearms]

As far as records go, here is my thought on the subject.

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showpost.php?p=3318061&postcount=18

[jksupplyco]

Heres my question, if you bring in a Firearm w/ "hi cap" (standard) mags, for an LE sale, do you log the magazines in seperately?

[TripleT]

Heres my question, if you bring in a Firearm w/ "hi cap" (standard) mags, for an LE sale, do you log the magazines in seperately?

I always have. I log every high cap mag no matter from where and no matter to where. If I keep a mag for personal, I log it to personal inventory.

To answer ugi, I don't do rebuilds but the part of the spreadsheet cut off is for additions or corrections and could easily be used for a note such as "sold as unassembled rebuild kit"

[TripleT]

Wes,

Clarify this for me.

As a CFD holder, you can legally sell and buy large capacity magazines without a large capacity magazine permit. The only reason you need a permit is to import or sell magazines.

Was the "or" supposed to be an "and" ???

[tenpercentfirearms]

You know, I don't know what I meant there. Just read the PC.

12020

(21) The sale or purchase of any large-capacity magazine to or by a person licensed pursuant to Section 12071.

(26) The importation into this state of, or sale of, any large-capacity magazine by a person who has been issued a permit to engage in those activities pursuant to Section 12079, when those activities are in accordance with the terms and conditions of that permit.

People with CFDs can make sales or purchase (interestingly purchase is not prohibited anyway). People with permits can import or make sales (note that they cannot purchase, but that is because we know it isn't illegal).

That was all I meant.

Interestingly, we cannot manufacture.

[TripleT]

Wes,

Thanks, I thought I knew what you meant, just wanted to get clarification.

In my experience, trying to get a vendor to sell you a standard cap mag on your CFD is pretty much a waste of time. They want the permit. Maybe they think they'd be culpable somehow. The whole thing just needs to go away. Wasted time spent tracking an unenforceable regulation. IMHO.

[tenpercentfirearms]

Wes,

Thanks, I thought I knew what you meant, just wanted to get clarification.

In my experience, trying to get a vendor to sell you a standard cap mag on your CFD is pretty much a waste of time. They want the permit. Maybe they think they'd be culpable somehow. The whole thing just needs to go away. Wasted time spent tracking an unenforceable regulation. IMHO.

If it an out of state vendor, they are doing the right thing. If it is an in state vendor, then they are going above the call of duty. I will send you large caps with no permit if you want.