City denying FFL based on "inventory"

[general jacks]

Hey folks, I've been going through the process to obtain my FFL, but am doing so for a home-based business. I only intend to market to a select clientele and do special orders, transfers and some minor repair work.

I obtained a home business permit, fictitious name, COE, tax ID, Sellers permit, and handgun safety instructor. Purchased a safe, installed an alarm, including placing contacts in the safe and sent my FFL application.

I forwarded a cop to the Chief of Police and Sheriff (courtesy only) and was denied by the City for the following:

-Not in a commercial area
-Too close to a school.

The municipal code state they follow DOJ regulations. So the decision is based on their unwritten rules.

After talking with the Chief's office, they are hung up on having inventory in the home, although it would only be special order and transfers.

Any thoughts or suggestions, other than go commercial or give up.

Thanks

[5shot]

I didn't think any FFL's were being issued for residences anymore. Most of the small FFL's I've dealt with recently have been running their out of small offices in their other businesses ( auto repair place, and construction co.). They told me nobody was getting FFL's operating out of houses anymore.

[stormy_clothing]

I didn't think any FFL's were being issued for residences anymore. Most of the small FFL's I've dealt with recently have been running their out of small offices in their other businesses ( auto repair place, and construction co.). They told me nobody was getting FFL's operating out of houses anymore.

depends on where, my friend got approved for one in a mobile home in newport beach but sadly never did anything with it.

I think if you made it clear you were in the business of transferring goods only you would have a good shot that and giving deals to LEO's that really helps too I've heard.

[USMG]

I have heard that in CA the are rarely issuing FFLs unless someone else gives theirs up. One in, one out. Has anyone seen any new gun shops opening up in the last year or so in CA?

[blackberg]

I have heard that in CA the are rarely issuing FFLs unless someone else gives theirs up. One in, one out. Has anyone seen any new gun shops opening up in the last year or so in CA?

several have opened up in the last year
-bb

[SDProtection]

Hey folks, I've been going through the process to obtain my FFL, but am doing so for a home-based business. I only intend to market to a select clientele and do special orders, transfers and some minor repair work.

I obtained a home business permit, fictitious name, COE, tax ID, Sellers permit, and handgun safety instructor. Purchased a safe, installed an alarm, including placing contacts in the safe and sent my FFL application.

I forwarded a cop to the Chief of Police and Sheriff (courtesy only) and was denied by the City for the following:

-Not in a commercial area
-Too close to a school.

The municipal code state they follow DOJ regulations. So the decision is based on their unwritten rules.

After talking with the Chief's office, they are hung up on having inventory in the home, although it would only be special order and transfers.

Any thoughts or suggestions, other than go commercial or give up.

Thanks

I don't know what part of CA you are in but that is how San Diego county handles FFL's. It is a no go for zoning purposes if you are in a residential area. You must be in a commercial zone or multi use business zone. No way around it....

[Gowking]

I'm home based in riverbank. Absolutely no issues getting it back in 2006. Just renewed to 2012

-G

[eltee]

It is crazy in that a small dealer's "inventory" may be far less than a hunter or gun ethusiast's privately owned firearms inventory in the house next door. I might ask to see the chief again and explain that there will be no stocked inventory, primarily LE sales with discounts (don't overplay this hand), and offer to provide gun safety instruction for a local school or youth group. You'd provide assurances of total discretion (to keep neighbors from howling about an arms cache in the neighborhood or traffic / parking issues). Make it a policy that all firearms coming or going will be bagged or boxed, so people are not carrying exposed. Provide evidence of how you are going to arrange security of the premises. Best advice is to make friends with someone in the department or at city hall who can lobby on your behalf.

Good luck.

[vinniesguns]

I got my for my Home this year, I had the hardesttime with the city also, for the same reason. But I measured out the distance to the school, I am more than 1000 feet. I got the city to accept my home business, based on the same reason you are trying. I have no inventory, I do special order only, and I have no open store front for walk in business, it is all by appointment only. Just keep trying and bugging them. Ask for a review in front of the council and bring examples of others in your area already in opperation. Took me a total of 8 months, but here I am.

[tenpercentfirearms]

I don't remember getting permission from the local poilice. Once I received my business permit which stated I was properly zoned, I was good to go.

That sounds like the problem here, you might not be properly zoned. Even in my conservative town, they don't like home based businesses. It isn't about guns, it was about traffic and hours of operation.

[general jacks]

Thanks all. I did get a permit for a home bases business based on the "no inventory" of special orders and transfers, at least the permit department understood that. I'm in public safety myself (fireman) and have made my case about no stocked inventory, but the PD is hanging their hat on that issue. The school zone, is another no-issue in my mind as the DOJ is very clear on the limitations of the area. The bigger issue I see, is that the PD has NO written policy regarding these reasons of refusal and I've met all other stipulations per the municipal code.

I'll keep trying and maybe go before city council, I was hoping to accomplish the task without a lot of argument with the PD.

Thanks again

[eltee]

I don't remember getting permission from the local poilice. ....

On renewals, you have to send a copy of your renewal app to the local chief or sheriff and note same in your BATFE renewal form. Perhaps when you got your initial license it was not required. Also, there is no indication of signoff or approval, the renewal just tells you to send a copy.

[general jacks]

On renewals, you have to send a copy of your renewal app to the local chief or sheriff and note same in your BATFE renewal form. Perhaps when you got your initial license it was not required. Also, there is no indication of signoff or approval, the renewal just tells you to send a copy.

One copy (of the 4) from the original application must be sent to the Chief of Police. I sent a courtesy copy to the Sheriff as well as I live close to some county pocket areas.

[PolishMike]

One copy (of the 4) from the original application must be sent to the Chief of Police. I sent a courtesy copy to the Sheriff as well as I live close to some county pocket areas.

It has to be sent to them, but they do not need to sign off on it. It is just informative for it. They cannot tell you no.

What I don't understand is why your talking to the police... They have nothing to do with it. The city denied your business permit, right? If your not zoned commercial or multi why did you even start the process for a home?


HOWEVER, the criteria to get on the CLFD you need
"A license granted by the duly constituted licensing authority of any city, county or city and county"

Per 12071 this can be done by -
"
(6) A license granted by the duly constituted licensing authority
of any city, county, or city and county, shall be valid for not more
than one year from the date of issuance and shall be in one of the
following forms:
(A) In the form prescribed by the Attorney General.
(B) A regulatory or business license that states on its face
"Valid for Retail Sales of Firearms" and is endorsed by the signature
of the issuing authority.
(C) A letter from the duly constituted licensing authority having
primary jurisdiction for the applicant's intended business location
stating that the jurisdiction does not require any form of regulatory
or business license or does not otherwise restrict or regulate the
sale of firearms.
(7) Local licensing authorities may assess fees to recover their
full costs of processing applications for licenses.
(b) A license is subject to forfeiture for a breach of any of the
following prohibitions and requirements:
(1) (A) Except as provided in subparagraphs (B) and (C), the
business shall be conducted only in the buildings designated in the
license."



Honestly it does not look like you've done all your research.

[general jacks]

I was doing everything required by the DOJ (See below) and even spoke with the firearms division regarding the duplicity of #4 and 5. The DOJ looked it up and advised me that the "City" permit was the standard and nothing needed from PD.

When I went to get the City business license, they advised me there was "another step" that required the PD approve it prior to the issuance of the license. (Nowhere is this written). Thus I am were I am now.

The very first step I did was go to the permit center and ensure this was possible, I had to talk with the supervisor and explain the "no inventory" philosophy. They concurred and provided with permit for "special order, transfer and repair of firearms from a home occupied business", and only then I proceeded with everything else.

What would be the issue if I was only going to gunsmith? The same FFL applies.

California firearms dealers must obtain and maintain the following:

1. A valid FFL,
2. A valid Seller's Permit issued by the State Board of Equalization,
3. A valid COE issued by the DOJ,
4. Any regulatory business license, or licenses, required by local government,
5. A local license granted by the duly constituted licensing authority, valid for one year from the date of issuance, and in one of the following forms:
1. In the form prescribed by the Attorney General;
2. A regulatory or business license that states on its face, "Valid for Retail Sales of Firearms" and endorsed by the signature of the issuing authority; or
3. A letter from the licensing authority stating that the jurisdiction does not require any form of regulatory or business license or does not otherwise restrict or regulate the sale of firearms. After obtaining the above licenses, an Application for Centralized List and appropriate fees are submitted to the DOJ. Upon approval of the application, the dealer will be given a CFD number and placed on the Centralized List of firearms dealers.
6. A listing on the DOJ Centralized List of Firearms Dealers.