FFL lost records.

[masina]

What to do if the FFL I used many years ago somehow did not send in my record all along and then went out of business? Should I just contact DoJ?
I have the record of what I have. and now the record of what they "have".
But still, it has been almost 9 years since they went puff, and no idea where the owner is now.
I know I know "talk to your lawyer". Well, my lawyer has no knowledge of guns. I am not made of Gold to afford to hire a pro-2A lawyers.

Just a simple question so that I know which government branch I should contact and start working on it. DOJ? ATF? Police? Sheriff?

If you have experienced the same thing, what did you do to reconcile your log book?

Yes, you may think that it is no big deal. It is a big deal if one day there was a mass shooting and one of the weapons is in your name, and you never did find out since you thought you sold your gun in a legal manner.

Yes, I have a FFL3, but I do not have records of selling my stuff before 2014. Do you know anyone who still keep meticulous records of buying and selling 11 years ago who do not have any FFL license?

Advice please. And if you are going to say "get yourself a lawyer", please, I know, I will do so if you finance me. I do not have $8k in the bank.

[Tyke8319]

How do you know he did not send in your records?

[CSACANNONEER]

What's the problem? There is no law requiring you to do anything. There is NO LAW in CA prohibiting you from owning "unregistered" firearms. How do you know that the DOJ didn't receive the required paperwork? CA's AFS is chalked full of errors to the point that the inaccuracies in their records would be questioned in court.

BTW, are you talking about a handgun or a long gun?

[masina]

I filed the form to the DoJ, and they came back with a bunch of firearm that I sold through this gun store that is still in my name. Naturally I do not want to name the store, unless you already know. also I don't even know how I can find the manager and the employees. 8 years are a long time ago.
All my firearms using other FFLs are accounted for, except those I sold to that shop, or through them. I still remember having to sign paperwork on paper, not typing on a laptop.
I can understand filing mistake for one or two. Solar Tactical also misfiled one of my rifles, but it is fine, I can always head over there to sort things out. However I cannot understand when it was more than a 3 year period along with more than a dozen "misfiled". I don't think those are honest mistakes.
Does an FFL need to turn in the log when they go out of business?

I am now waiting for the DoJ reply and see what will be done. But maybe one of you has gone through this?

[edgerly779]

Newbie is way to paranoid. Stop stressing.

[G-forceJunkie]

Fill out a "no longer in possesion" form for the ones you know you sold.

https://oag.ca.gov/sites/all/files/agweb/pdfs/firearms/forms/bof-4546-nlip-09-2016.pdf

File a Firearms Ownership Report for the ones you want to be put under y our name: https://oag.ca.gov/sites/all/files/a...rms/volreg.pdf

$38 and your done. Your barking up the wrong tree if you think the DOJ is going to help with paperwork from an out of buisness FFL. Their bound books got shipped to the ATF when they closed and are sitting in a dusty box in a wherehouse in DC.

You did your due dilligence by using an FFL for transfers, any mistake they made is on them, not you. Rest easy, I personally would not do anything. Why stir the pot. Fill out the above forms I linked to above if you really feel you need to.

I filed the form to the DoJ, and they came back with a bunch of firearm that I sold through this gun store that is still in my name. Naturally I do not want to name the store, unless you already know. also I don't even know how I can find the manager and the employees. 8 years are a long time ago.
All my firearms using other FFLs are accounted for, except those I sold to that shop, or through them. I still remember having to sign paperwork on paper, not typing on a laptop.
I can understand filing mistake for one or two. Solar Tactical also misfiled one of my rifles, but it is fine, I can always head over there to sort things out. However I cannot understand when it was more than a 3 year period along with more than a dozen "misfiled". I don't think those are honest mistakes.
Does an FFL need to turn in the log when they go out of business?

I am now waiting for the DoJ reply and see what will be done. But maybe one of you has gone through this?

[19K]

Yes, you may think that it is no big deal. It is a big deal if one day there was a mass shooting and one of the weapons is in your name, and you never did find out since you thought you sold your gun in a legal manner.

Yes, I have a FFL3, but I do not have records of selling my stuff before 2014. Do you know anyone who still keep meticulous records of buying and selling 11 years ago who do not have any FFL license?

Advice please. And if you are going to say "get yourself a lawyer", please, I know, I will do so if you finance me. I do not have $8k in the bank.

You’re going to spend more than 8k if seek legal advice from strangers on a public forum. Have you thought of asking your attorney if they know anyone who specializes in 2a law and can help you?

If the weapons come back registered to you and you legally sold them them, they will be registered to the new owner.

If the shop or YOU illegally sold them well, good luck. File a no longer in possession form with the DOJ.

Stop being cheap and contact an attorney.

[CheapBloke]

I filed the form to the DoJ, and they came back with a bunch of firearm that I sold through this gun store that is still in my name. Naturally I do not want to name the store, unless you already know. also I don't even know how I can find the manager and the employees. 8 years are a long time ago.
All my firearms using other FFLs are accounted for, except those I sold to that shop, or through them. I still remember having to sign paperwork on paper, not typing on a laptop.
I can understand filing mistake for one or two. Solar Tactical also misfiled one of my rifles, but it is fine, I can always head over there to sort things out. However I cannot understand when it was more than a 3 year period along with more than a dozen "misfiled". I don't think those are honest mistakes.
Does an FFL need to turn in the log when they go out of business?

I am now waiting for the DoJ reply and see what will be done. But maybe one of you has gone through this?

Dude, name the store. I don't get it, what is the reason to protect a defunct business. You know if you name the store, maybe someone might have a clue to who you might have or can look for.

Clueless.

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[operavoice]

Two weeks ago, I got a call from a Park Ranger asking if I had recently had a gun stolen or if I was missing one.
Turns out that an unsavory character who was banned from owning firearms had in his possession, a Davis .380 that I sold to an FFL at a gun show earlier this year.

Gun had never been taken out of my name.
This is why you keep your sales receipts, and maybe update your records.

[Tyke8319]

Who cares if it's still in your name. A simple explanation as to why you don't possess it any more is sufficient. If you followed the laws, let anyone prove otherwise. The firearms system is fraught with errors.

[CSACANNONEER]

Two weeks ago, I got a call from a Park Ranger asking if I had recently had a gun stolen or if I was missing one.
Turns out that an unsavory character who was banned from owning firearms had in his possession, a Davis .380 that I sold to an FFL at a gun show earlier this year.

Gun had never been taken out of my name.
This is why you keep your sales receipts, and maybe update your records.

OF course it wasn't "taken out of your name". It NEVER will be. CA's AFS retains the information in perpetuity. If you sold it to a FFL who later sold it to someone out of state, CA will NEVER know it because, there's no CA paperwork involved in such a series of sales. Even if there is paperwork that shows a new CA owner, it will ALWAYS still be linked to you in the CA AFS.

[OCArmory]

If you are concerned, I would do as previously stated and fill out a no longer in possession form. On it you will need to indicate the name and address of the store. The state might request more information but that is probably all you can do.

[Nardo1895]

I had a customer who had me ship a gun he sold on Gunbroker to the buyer's FFL. He sent in the "No Longer in Possession" form to DOJ. They rejected it and wanted proof of sale/transfer. I updated his invoice to include the dealer I shipped the firearm to and it was accepted by DOJ.

Apparently DOJ won't just take your word for it. Not sure what would have happened if he told DOJ to pound sand...

[Achelous]

I had a customer who had me ship a gun he sold on Gunbroker to the buyer's FFL. He sent in the "No Longer in Possession" form to DOJ. They rejected it and wanted proof of sale/transfer. I updated his invoice to include the dealer I shipped the firearm to and it was accepted by DOJ. Apparently DOJ won't just take your word for it. Not sure what would have happened if he told DOJ to pound sand...

Over the years I've submitted a number of "No Longer in Possession" form to DOJ. Until a few years ago, they were accepted pretty promptly, and I would receive an acknowledgement. Then something changed. DOJ rejected my submission and wanted proof. I had to provide them the receipt from the Dealer that was used to ship it out of state, and a bill-of-sale. Then they accepted it. I'm guessing something came to light and they stopped taking submissions at face value.

[CheapBloke]

Over the years I've submitted a number of "No Longer in Possession" form to DOJ. Until a few years ago, they were accepted pretty promptly, and I would receive an acknowledgement. Then something changed. DOJ rejected my submission and wanted proof. I had to provide them the receipt from the Dealer that was used to ship it out of state, and a bill-of-sale. Then they accepted it. I'm guessing something came to light and they stopped taking submissions at face value.

I think maybe people were pulling a "i lost it all in a boating accident." Lol.

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