CA: Off-Roster FFL - Interesting Question

[tomtopeek]

I'm new in learning the laws of buying a gun in CA (spoiler alert: they suck) but I do have a question if the expert people here can answer.

Question:

Are you able to purchase an off-roster handgun from a person in a different state, like Texas, IF that person has dual-state residency? Meaning that person is currently residing out of state but is still labeled as both a CA and TX resident.

I know that PPT is allowed if both are CA residents, but has anyone ever come across this option or scenario?

[9Cal_OC]

No.

And it would be a felony for that ‘dual resident’ to import an off-roster firearm from TX into CA without using a FFL, where the roster applies.

He can acquire off-roster firearms but would need to remain out of state.

[SkyHawk]

California has a special prize waiting for "dual-residents" who bring handguns acquired in other states into the state without shipping them to a FFL first (where the roster would apply to the transfer). It's called a felony. AKA, a good way to lose your 2A rights in every state forever.

PC 27585

https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/f...ctionNum=27585.

27585.
(a) Commencing January 1, 2015, a resident of this state shall not import into this state, bring into this state, or transport into this state, any firearm that the person purchased or otherwise obtained on or after January 1, 2015, from outside of this state unless the person first has that firearm delivered to a dealer in this state for delivery to that resident pursuant to the procedures set forth in Section 27540 and Article 1 (commencing with Section 26700) and Article 2 (commencing with Section 26800) of Chapter 2.

Conducting a PPT in such a scenario is just going to leave a nice paper trail of evidence for the DOJ.

Such a person cannot even enter CA for visit etc, with guns they acquired in the other state, unless they have also been transferred to them by a CA FFL. The crime is committed as soon as they cross border with a gun they got out of state. Dual residents have to be extra careful about the guns they bring into CA - they have more burden than would a person visiting from out of state who is not a dual resident.

[Quiet]

The CA DROS system will not allow a CA resident to import a non-exempt off-Roster handgun into CA.

Which means a dual resident of CA can only legally bring on-Roster handguns and exempt (C&R, OTP, SAE, SSE2) handguns into CA through a CA FFL dealer and all of their non-exempt off-Roster handguns must remain in the other State in which they reside in.

[Garv]

Just in case you were looking for something specifically, do you have any parents or children that live out of state?
That could be an option.

[RickD427]

In addition to all of the above postings, also please keep in mind that the term "Dual Resident" is very often misused, and is differently used under federal law, and in California law.

Under the Federal law:

Except for the singular case of an active duty military member living in one state and commuting daily to duty in another state, there is no such thing as a "Dual Resident." A person can only be a resident of only one state at a time. The Code of Federal Regulations in defining a person's state of residency makes it possible for a person to frequently and quickly change their state of residence (refer to 27CFR478.11 and the four examples cited therein).

The federal definition is quite significant because its generally a federal felony for private persons, of different state residencies, to transfer a handgun.

Under California state law:

A person can easily be a "Dual Resident" of two or more states if they maintain their permanent home in California with an intent to return, and establish residency in another state(s) while absent.

As previous posters have correctly pointed out, Penal Code sections 27585 and 27590 make it a felony for such a "Dual Resident" to personally bring into California a handgun that they acquired outside of California.

[ChickenLips]

I was told I can register an out of state (off Roster) firearm through the CFARS "New Resident Report of Firearm Ownership" form...? I was going to consider this until reading this thread. I do have dual state residency and would like to register a couple firearms from out of CA (off Roster) to add to my CCW permit here. It sounds like this is not possible without an FFL or, can someone explain the process if there is one?

[RickD427]

I was told I can register an out of state (off Roster) firearm through the CFARS "New Resident Report of Firearm Ownership" form...? I was going to consider this until reading this thread. I do have dual state residency and would like to register a couple firearms from out of CA (off Roster) to add to my CCW permit here. It sounds like this is not possible without an FFL or, can someone explain the process if there is one?

Who told you such a thing? and what was their basis of belief that it was true?

If you move into California, you can (in fact you're required to, unless active duty military) register such weapons using the "New Resident" form and paying a $19 fee (regardless of the number of weapons on the form). It's a pretty painless process. Please see Penal Code section 27560 for the details.

But that form doesn't work if you're already a resident. If you're a California resident and you personally bring in a handgun that you acquired while out of state, you've committed a felony. And completing the "New Resident" form would only serve a evidence that you did so. This situation is governed by Penal Code section 27585 (and section 27590 for the criminal penalty). In your case you have to ship the weapon to a California FFL and they have to transfer it to you in California, and the weapon must be on the roster, or you must be roster exempt.