Sales Tax advice

[condor]

I just read the sticky on California state sales tax. Confusing to say the least. Here's what I need to know, and I am an FFL3/COE. Can an out of state auction house send a C&R firearm directly to an FFL3, and is Sales Tax due the BOE?? If so, how is it collected? When filing the Acquisition?? Or.. can a C&R even be sent directly to an FFL3 any longer if it comes from a business?? I just started the paperwork on a non-C&R and was charged the DROS and the sales tax by the FFL1. It was surprising, but I understand under the new CA Regs that it's going to be SOP. But the question is how will the new Regs affect C&R's, shipping, and Sales Tax??

[Den60]

If this is for you you are supposed to self report and pay the sales tax where the delivery was taken or where the firearm will be kept (whichever is higher). If you are a resaler then you charge the sales tax to your customer at the point of sale.

[condor]

I understand the C&R self reporting to the CA DOJ, but currently there isn't a place on the form to include a sales tax. Not sure about online?? The firearm would be a not for resale item. Not looking to go into the biz.... I suppose I could pay it at the end of the year when I report yearly sale tax for my real biz and enter it under personal purchases??

Now... have the new regs put a halt to C&R shipments to an FFL3 from an out of state FFL1 that would be considered a business?? Or would a purchase from an out of state auction house be considered an infrequent purchase and be exempt from the new regs??

[kemasa]

My understanding is that all C&R firearms have to go through a CA FFL now. It used to be just C&R handguns, but with the change to the requirement that long guns have the serial number submitted that it also applies to C&R long guns, but that is something that you should confirm.

You can pay the CA sales tax on your income tax return. The CA DOJ does not collect sales tax.

[six seven tango]

My understanding is that all C&R firearms have to go through a CA FFL now. It used to be just C&R handguns, but with the change to the requirement that long guns have the serial number submitted that it also applies to C&R long guns, but that is something that you should confirm.

Correct, if the buyer does not have an FFL03/COE. If the buyer has an 03/COE, then C&R long guns can still be shipped to the address on the 03 (buyers doorstep). The buyer still has to register with Form BOF 961 or BOF 4100a, depending on where/how purchased.

[kemasa]

You might want to check on whether C&R long guns can be sent directly still, as I said before.

[condor]

The CA DOJ does not collect sales tax.

Very true, but the BOE does.... Actually it's been a law for just about forever on anything purchased out of state the onus is on the buyer to pay the sales tax, but nobody ever did.... Now it looks like they've figured out another way to screw California gun buyers...

Correct, if the buyer does not have an FFL03/COE. If the buyer has an 03/COE, then C&R long guns can still be shipped to the address on the 03 (buyers doorstep). The buyer still has to register with Form BOF 961 or BOF 4100a, depending on where/how purchased.

You might want to check on whether C&R long guns can be sent directly still, as I said before.

See this is what I need to have a definitive answer on. Because if everything coming into CA needs to go thru an FFL01, my C&R out of state buying habits are going to come to a roaring halt.....

[kemasa]

See this is what I need to have a definitive answer on. Because if everything coming into CA needs to go thru an FFL01, my C&R out of state buying habits are going to come to a roaring halt.....

As I recall, when I asked the CA DOJ, they said that all needed to go through a CA FFL, but it was not in writing and I don't know what they based it on.

[condor]

As I recall, when I asked the CA DOJ, they said that all needed to go through a CA FFL, but it was not in writing and I don't know what they based it on.

Did they differentiate between FFL01 and FFL03?? Or did they just say FFL?? And how long ago did you call the CADOJ?? A lot of this mess became effective as of 7/01. I'm hoping that someone a lot smarter than myself can add some incite. I tried to read the sticky's and figured it would take a legal mind to figure it out. I went cross-eyed...

[kemasa]

CA firearms dealer, not just a FFL. I don't remember when exactly I called.

[condor]

CA firearms dealer, not just a FFL. I don't remember when exactly I called.

Since I was responding to your post, and this whole thread is about the new CA Regs, I would have thought that you knew that.. But to clarify. CA FFL01, CA FFL03.

[nedro]

Al Capone's advice to us all, "Pay your damned taxes!"

[six seven tango]

Condor,

CA PC 27545 is where the requirement for all firearms transactions to go thru a dealer is.

27545. Where neither party to the transaction holds a dealer's
license issued pursuant to Sections 26700 to 26915, inclusive, the
parties to the transaction shall complete the sale, loan, or transfer
of that firearm through a licensed firearms dealer pursuant to
Chapter 5 (commencing with Section 28050).

CA PC 27966 is where an 03/COE is specifically exempted from 27545 as long as it's a C&R long gun.

27966. Commencing January 1, 2014, if all of the following
requirements are satisfied, Section 27545 shall not apply to the
sale, loan, or transfer of a firearm:
(a) The sale, loan, or transfer is infrequent, as defined in
Section 16730.
(b) The firearm is not a handgun.
(c) The firearm is a curio or relic, as defined in Section 478.11
of Title 27 of the Code of Federal Regulations, or its successor.
(d) The person receiving the firearm has a current certificate of
eligibility issued pursuant to Section 26710.
(e) The person receiving the firearm is licensed as a collector
pursuant to Chapter 44 of Title 18 of the United States Code and the
regulations issued thereto.
(f) Within 30 days of taking possession of the firearm, the person
to whom it is transferred shall forward by prepaid mail, or deliver
in person to the Department of Justice, a report that includes
information concerning the individual taking possession of the
firearm, how title was obtained and from whom, and a description of
the firearm in question. The report forms that individuals complete
pursuant to this section shall be provided to them by the department.

[kemasa]

CA PC 27545 appears to be the CA PPT section.

You might want to look at 27585, which limits collectors to acquiring the firearm outside of CA (27565).

In looking at the CA PC, it appears that ALL C&R firearms have to be shipped to a CA firearms dealer or personally picked up from out of state.

27585. (a) Commencing January 1, 2015, a resident of this state
shall not import into this state, bring into this state, or transport
into this state, any firearm that he or she purchased or otherwise
obtained on or after January 1, 2015, from outside of this state
unless he or she first has that firearm delivered to a dealer in this
state for delivery to that resident pursuant to the procedures set
forth in Section 27540 and Article 1 (commencing with Section 26700)
and Article 2 (commencing with Section 26800) of Chapter 2.
(b) Subdivision (a) does not apply to or affect any of the
following:
(1) A licensed collector who is subject to and complies with
Section 27565.
...

27565. (a) This section applies in the following circumstances:
(1) A person is licensed as a collector pursuant to Chapter 44
(commencing with Section 921) of Title 18 of the United States Code
and the regulations issued pursuant thereto.
(2) The licensed premises of that person are within this state.
(3) The licensed collector acquires, outside of this state, a
handgun, and commencing January 1, 2014, any firearm.
(4) The licensed collector takes actual possession of that firearm
outside of this state pursuant to the provisions of subsection (j)
of Section 923 of Title 18 of the United States Code, as amended by
Public Law 104-208, and transports the firearm into this state.
(5) The firearm is a curio or relic, as defined in Section 478.11
of Title 27 of the Code of Federal Regulations.
(b) Within five days of transporting a firearm into this state
under the circumstances described in subdivision (a), the licensed
collector shall report the acquisition of that firearm to the
department in a format prescribed by the department.

[six seven tango]

I am only subject to Section 27585 if I acquire the firearm while I'm out of state. Since a firearm delivered to my door is considered an in state acquisition, I am still exempt under Section 27966.

Trickster posted a good breakdown of how this all works out here