FFL - PPT purchase for personal collection

[gw74r]

Is there any reason why an FFL cannot purchase an off-roster handgun from a PP, and do a PPT to themselves for their personal collection, at a location other than their licensed premises?

[gw74r]

Kemasa, thanks for the response. You said......"but don't be surprised if that FFL does not get that" I'm not sure I understand and not sure I made myself clear.......I am the FFL and It would be me traveling to a seller's location to buy his off-roster handgun for my personal collection. I would use my laptop to DROS the PPT at his location. Anything prohibiting me doing that? I guess much like the way I envision a sale being done at a gun show although I've never sold at a gunshow.

[kemasa]

Kemasa, thanks for the response. You said......"but don't be surprised if that FFL does not get that" I'm not sure I understand and not sure I made myself clear.......I am the FFL and It would be me traveling to a seller's location to buy his off-roster handgun for my personal collection. I would use my laptop to DROS the PPT at his location. Anything prohibiting me doing that? I guess much like the way I envision a sale being done at a gun show although I've never sold at a gunshow.

You can not do business at other locations, with the exception of gun shows and the like.

I think I mis-read your original question. I thought that you were saying going to another FFL and do the transfer there.

[CSACANNONEER]

You can not do business at other locations, with the exception of gun shows and the like.

I think I mis-read your original question. I thought that you were saying going to another FFL and do the transfer there.

Kemesa, I am in no way doubting your knowledge on this subject. I respect and value your knowledge, input and opinions. I'm just trying to get a few things clear in my own head.

Can a FFL go to USPS, Fed Ex or UPS and pick up a firearm and complete the transfer at their location of record? If so, can they go to someone's home and pick up a firearm to complete the transfer at their location of record? Do the buyer and seller both have to visit that location to do PPT paperwork? Or, could the paperwork be filled out elsewhere and processed at the FFL's location of record? We know that a seller can send paperwork to a FFL for a non PPT. We know that there is no legal requirement for buyer and seller to both be present at the same time when conducting a PPT. While I'm trying to look up the applicable laws, I'm having difficulty figuring out just what "doing business" at other locations actually means. I've known FFLs who will receive firearms at outside (non gun show) locations for repair, smithing or sale.

[kemasa]

Can a FFL go to USPS, Fed Ex or UPS and pick up a firearm and complete the transfer at their location of record?

Yes.

If so, can they go to someone's home and pick up a firearm to complete the transfer at their location of record?

Yes. You can receive firearms elsewhere, but you can't do the transfer paperwork elsewhere, other than gun shows, etc.

Do the buyer and seller both have to visit that location to do PPT paperwork?

Yes, if it is CA PPT.

Or, could the paperwork be filled out elsewhere and processed at the FFL's location of record?

No.

We know that a seller can send paperwork to a FFL for a non PPT.

Huh? No, the seller can not send "paperwork" with respect to the transfer. They can send paperwork like a receipt and such. I am not sure of what paperwork you are talking about.

We know that there is no legal requirement for buyer and seller to both be present at the same time when conducting a PPT.

Correct. The seller can fill out a DROS worksheet.

While I'm trying to look up the applicable laws, I'm having difficulty figuring out just what "doing business" at other locations actually means.

Doing the transfer, such as the 4473 and/or the DROS.

I've known FFLs who will receive firearms at outside (non gun show) locations for repair, smithing or sale.

Yes, that is acceptable and that is not a transfer, other than the FFL acquiring a firearm. Gunsmithing is a bit different, but remember the firearm is not being transferred from one person to another in terms of ownership.

[CSACANNONEER]

Yes.



Yes. You can receive firearms elsewhere, but you can't do the transfer paperwork elsewhere, other than gun shows, etc.



Yes, if it is CA PPT.



No.



Huh? No, the seller can not send "paperwork" with respect to the transfer. They can send paperwork like a receipt and such. I am not sure of what paperwork you are talking about.



Correct. The seller can fill out a DROS worksheet.



Doing the transfer, such as the 4473 and/or the DROS.



Yes, that is acceptable and that is not a transfer, other than the FFL acquiring a firearm. Gunsmithing is a bit different, but remember the firearm is not being transferred from one person to another in terms of ownership.

Thanks. By paperwork, I meant a receipt, copy of ID and any other information that the receiving FFL needs or wants.

Can you cite anything that says the DROS information is required to be filled out on site instead of just processed on site? I know what is the commonly accepted way but, I'm just trying to think a little outside the box. If the DROS transaction is processed on site by and the receiving party takes possession on could the seller have filled out consignment paperwork off site and sent it or handed it to the FFL off site to be processed at the
FFL's location? I know of a few FFLs who will pick up firearms, up to large collections, to sell on consignment. Are there two types of "consignment"? One being from dealers inventory and the other being considered a PPT?

[kemasa]

There are state and Federal laws regarding where business can be conducted. It can be looked up.

Consignment is a bit different since it is not being transferred at that point in time. There are requirements for taking a firearm in for consignment (paperwork, signed forms, etc.), but I don't know the details. Consignments can be transferred as a PPT, which is done when the handgun is not on the certified list, but as far as I know it is really all the same.

There is also the issue of what it illegal, but often can be gotten away with. How do they prove what and where you did something? But the reality is that it should not matter what you can get away with, and instead the laws should be followed.