can either spouse ppt if married?

[kemasa]

I'm curious to which document is signed which states I am in the legal owner of the firearm when selling it (during a PPT)?

What is the only form that you have to sign under penalty of perjury?

The DROS. It lists that you are the seller. Perhaps you want to play word games and claim that while you are the seller, that you are not the actual owner, which then means that it was illegally transferred to you and yourself dig a deeper hole.

[NiteQwill]

What is the only form that you have to sign under penalty of perjury?

The DROS. It lists that you are the seller. Perhaps you want to play word games and claim that while you are the seller, that you are not the actual owner, which then means that it was illegally transferred to you and yourself dig a deeper hole.

Last I checked: seller =/ owner, and vice versa. The DROS asks if the "above information is correct," not any less or any more.

Kemasa, I am not being facetious. This is strictly a discussion.

Sent from my phone, excuse the errors.

[kemasa]

How did you legally get the firearm into your hand in order to be a seller if you are not the owner? If you are selling it for the owner, then there needs to be documentation to confirm that. If a buddy loans you a firearm, you can't go and sell it.

You can't be the seller unless you are legally allowed to do that (POA, for example) and you have to have the firearm legally, which is another issue.

[CSACANNONEER]

If there is no paper trail, then that makes it easier. The problem is when there is a paper trail and the names don't match up. It would not be hard for the CA DOJ to flag a PPT where there is a name in the AFS and that name does not match the seller. They could then come out and ask how the person got the firearm. So far, they don't seem to be doing that, but will that change? It some respects it does not matter since there are laws regarding transfers and it is a matter of whether you know you are violating the law.

Well, for newer purchases that is true but, for older purchases not so much. I know that I have firearms that the state has record of me buying in the 1980s. If I sold those legally at a garage sale prior to 1991, I am still the last owner of record but no longer the legal owner. When the legal owner goes to transfer it to someone else, the state wouldn't have a problem with the names not matching. Of course, even after 1991, there were legal ways to transfer handguns to family members without going through a FFL or sending in a form. So, even if the state has a paper trail on a firearm, it doesn't mean that the last owner of record has any legal claim to the firearm.

[lorax3]

For purposes of discussion be sure to indicate wether you mean the current legal owner or last registered owner when you use the word owner. I think that is causing some confusion above.

The rules you need to follow are:

1) It is not illegal to sell a firearm if you are not the last registered owner.

2) It is generally illegal to transfer ownership of a firearm without using an FFL in CA.

3) It is illegal to sell something you do not own.

Note: While the statement in #1 is true, the fact you are not the last registered owner in the AFS could be used as evidence to show a violation of #2 or #3. Wether or not this evidence would be useful would depend on several factors, but you can imagine a scenario in which not being the last registered owner in the AFS would cut against you in court.