Is religion just a bunch of lies...

[colossians323]

i definitely concur, i just think some people may appreciate non-abrahamaic religions other than the big 3

What big three, you have the jews who deny Christ, the Moslems who worship the moon god, and all together a different god of make believe, and The living God who is revealed in the old testament, and alive in the new covenant

[colossians323]

There are many churches with some truth and a few churches with a lot of truth. But when Christ organized his church there is only one true church- his The Chirch Of Jesus Christ and now OF Latter Day Saints. God promises to the humble seeker of truth- seek and ye shall find. I prayed in my youth if the Book of Mormon was true and the power of God came on me like being hit with a thousand volts of electricity. I testify the true church of Jesus Christ is on the earth right now. I have had Satan show up a few times and seen Jesus Christ- add to that thousands of spiritual experiences through my life. The true church of Jesus Christ is The Church Of Jesus Of Latter Day Saints. Faith precedes the miracle and most people did not believe Jesus was the Christ when he came. That's the test in this life- He who does the will of the Father shall KNOW- as I know. Jesus asked his disciples who am I ? Peter answered thou art the Christ. Jesus said blessed art thou for flesh and blood hath not shown you. Just because you have not seen doesn't mean it doesn't exist. I've seen, heard, felt.

The only problem with this, is mormons worship the brother of Lucifer, not the the Creator of all universes. The Creator of all universes is the living God who created Lucifer

[kygen]

No parallels you have been watching too much zeitgeist

Easter and Christmas have roots in pagan ideology. Jesus had nothing to do with eggs or fir trees. There are parallels between Christianity and previous religious thought.

[SWalt]

One of the first things that troubled me about Christianity in my teens was that the churches I went to (baptist, lutheran) held jews to be "God's chosen people". Iirc this is from biblical text. This struck me as very odd that a God that loved all his children would have a chosen group simply based on what they were born into. If thats not supremacist ideology , I don't know what is.

This really surprises me. You said you were raised Christian but never understood how or why the Jews were Gods Chosen? Did you ever read the Bible cover to cover? Or did you learn as it seems so many learn, a little 15-20 sermon on Sundays where they take a couple scriptures and then expound of what they say it means? You really need to understand God's entire plan to be able to see the who, what, and whys. How is fulfilling God's promise to Abraham supremacy?

[Not a Cook]

Easter and Christmas have roots in pagan ideology.

The modern celebrations definitely do, but that statement can be somewhat misleading without further elaboration. "Easter" is most definitely a pagan word, and MOST of the trappings of modern Easter celebrations are absolutely pagan in origin. However, many Christians intend to celebrate the resurrection of Christ when they're celebrating Easter.

Similarly, MOST of the trappings of modern Christmas have pagan origins and have nothing to do with Christ. However, many Christians intend to celebrate the birth of Christ when they're celebrating Christmas.

Jesus had nothing to do with eggs or fir trees.

Amen! Well... unless you consider that He created eggs and fir trees and everything else.

There are parallels between Christianity and previous religious thought.

There are more than just parallels; Christ came as the promised messiah (moshiach) that Israel had long awaited. In fact, much of humanity (beyond just Israel) had anticipated this Seed since the earliest times - in fact, the Hebrew of Genesis 3:15 and 4:1 even indicate that Eve expected this coming messiah to arrive all the way back to not long after the Fall. In other words, the coming of the messiah was anticipated from the earliest days of mankind and it is therefore reflected in much "previous religious thought".

[SWalt]

Easter and Christmas have roots in pagan ideology. Jesus had nothing to do with eggs or fir trees. There are parallels between Christianity and previous religious thought.

Why would you even bring up Christmas trees or eggs as a parallel if you admit it has 0 to do with Jesus? They are totally secular. Are you saying Christians worship trees and eggs? Heres a thought, perhaps Christians were multicultural and allow pagans to be included?

[kygen]

Why would you even bring up Christmas trees or eggs as a parallel if you admit it has 0 to do with Jesus? They are totally secular. Are you saying Christians worship trees and eggs? Heres a thought, perhaps Christians were multicultural and allow pagans to be included?

More like the conquering Roman Empire was kind enough to let their conquered subjects keep their old pagan rituals while combining it with Christian thought.

[kygen]

Why would you even bring up Christmas trees or eggs as a parallel if you admit it has 0 to do with Jesus? They are totally secular. Are you saying Christians worship trees and eggs? Heres a thought, perhaps Christians were multicultural and allow pagans to be included?

And I was making reference to Greco/Roman and Egyptian Theology, not just pagan beliefs. But it looks like there are some issues with those theories.

[colossians323]

Easter and Christmas have roots in pagan ideology. Jesus had nothing to do with eggs or fir trees. There are parallels between Christianity and previous religious thought.

Easter and Christmas were outreaches by Christians to convert the pagans. They took the pagan holidays and started celevbrating something different, pointing to God

[I Swan]

Many religions have some sort of syncretism. This is common with Catholicism in some areas and like with Voodoo and Santeria.

[Lex Talionis]

More like the conquering Roman Empire was kind enough to let their conquered subjects keep their old pagan rituals while combining it with Christian thought.

"Kindness" was NEVER a Roman motivation for anything. Rome required subservience to Rome politically and economically. "All roads led to Rome" so that all TAXES came back to Rome.

Permitting conquered people an ability to continue to worship their own gods was permitted only so far as it did not inspire insurrection against Rome.

[fiveover]

The story of Christianity is actually not original.

Case in point:

Horus - the sun god of Egypt was "good", born on Dec 25th, born of a virgin, his birth was accompanied by a star in the east, he was adored by 3 kings, he was a prodigal teacher at age 12, and baptized at age 30, he traveled with 12 disciples performing miracles, was betrayed, crucified, resurrected after 3 days.

Attis - the consort of cybele in greek mythology, born on Dec 25th, born of a virgin, crucified, placed in a tomb for 3 days, resurrected

Dionysus also of Greece turned water into wine, mithra of persia was known as the truth, the light of the world, had 12 disciples, among others.

The story of Moses also shares many attributes with ancient mythology.

Jesus was not born on Dec. 25

[SWalt]

More like the conquering Roman Empire was kind enough to let their conquered subjects keep their old pagan rituals while combining it with Christian thought.

And I was making reference to Greco/Roman and Egyptian Theology, not just pagan beliefs. But it looks like there are some issues with those theories.

Remember, the Roman Empire was around well before Christianity but not around longer than the Jews. A reason there was a "Roman Peace" was Rome allowed the conquered to keep their gods as long they paid homage to Caesar. They did this well before Christians were around. Christians had no power in Rome until Constantine and Christians "inherited" what ever Rome had done prior. On the other hand, the Apostles and those who followed after used reasoned and rational argument to convert people not force (yes, history can be a different story). So doesn't it "stand to reason" that allowing pagans to continue some aspects of their festivals be practiced is inline with Christian thought? Golden rule, "do unto others...." or "love your enemies..." after all.

BTW...."Easter" is the same time as the Passover because that is when Christ was crucified, in accordance to Gods law. It happens around the beginning of Spring, a time of "rebirth" but that isn't the reason for the Jewish Passover. Christmas is celebrated around the Winter Solstice because before accurate time keeping the Solstice would keep everyone celebrating at the same time of year. They can only guess what day Christ was born so come up with a day and say "This is the time to celebrate". Pagans also use the solstice for the same reason (or reasons), a common time marked by the movements of the sun. So why not use the solstice? No one looked at their Casio G Shock or a precise calendar for time and date back then and say "today is the day". Very old churches (and other structures) have a way to mark the solstices built into them because they measured time and seasons by them.

As far as ideas in common, people all over the world have basic notions of same things. Cultures that never had connection with others. Things like right, wrong, fairness, how things came to be, etc. An evolutionist would have their explanation but mine would be those are innate because God created humans that way. There are themes that will reoccur because they are innate and humans have the ability to use reason to come up with ideas and those ideas may have things in common. So when you point to Hammurabi or what ever "tradition" their will be similarities, these themes are placed by God in humans. Its ingrained in them, coming up with similar ideas isn't out of the realm of possibility, no they will be similar.

I just finished a book about the collapse of the late bronze age civilization and the reasons for the collapse. A flourishing "international" "cosmopolitan" civilization with trade and cultures intermingling 1000's of miles apart collapsed. Egypt, the Middle East (Hittites, Canaanites, etc), Crete, Greece, Troy, etc. It all collapsed around 1177 BC. Towns and cities burned down, others abandoned for apparent no reason and never occupied again, trade stopped, new cultures arrive and start a new period. "Experts" say "it was the Sea Peoples that caused it". Other "Experts" say "No, it was climate change". Still other Experts say "No, it was "internal rebellion" and other "Experts" "No, it was a large series of Earthquakes known to have occurred at that time". The "Experts" really do not know, the most "learned" among Academia studying this for 100+ yrs and more than likely they will never know. But yet you read scholars stating "this is what happened, it is fact". You can not depend on "Experts" for the actual truth. I'm glad this author acknowledge this basic fact and left the "reason why" up in the air, as a "not known what actually happened". Actual "History" is even worse today because of "Modernism", using todays ideals/notions to explain things of the past. A good example would be using "Individual Rights" to gauge the past when todays notion of Individual Rights has 0 to do with the past. Heck they say we are in a "Post, post Modernism" today in scholarship and Academia so they can make up **** and its "the truth". Take everything said by experts with a huge grain of salt. The truth of how things evolved might not be the "truth", just another Academic opinion.

[Lex Talionis]

As far as ideas in common, people all over the world have basic notions of same things. Cultures that never had connection with others. Things like right, wrong, fairness, how things came to be, etc. An evolutionist would have their explanation but mine would be those are innate because God created humans that way. There are themes that will reoccur because they are innate and humans have the ability to use reason to come up with ideas and those ideas may have things in common. So when you point to Hammurabi or what ever "tradition" their will be similarities, these themes are placed by God in humans. Its ingrained in them, coming up with similar ideas isn't out of the realm of possibility, no they will be similar.

This is true, anyone who makes the illogical assumptions that just because there are similar themes that it means the later religions had to copy the previous is completely ignoring how human reason developed. We could take "religion" out of the discussion for a moment and even without a codified law (like the code of Hammurabi) all human groups will in some way develop some means of social contract in order for that group to survive. Otherwise mankind would have been just millions of "lone wolves" with no social structure.... and therefore unable to survive.

A concept like "don't steal" does not need to be revealed by God or a 'god' in order to be reasoned by humans. Most people eventually figure out that if I steal from my neighbor, then he can do the same to me, and eventually all of my time, energy, and resources are consumed by defending my own food supply rather than being spent on finding more food.... not only for me, but also for the group. Therefore any common theme based on basic social contract rules are actually just universal themes to be expected by way of human reasoning and not just something Judaism or Christianity has copied.

But as you indicated, the ability for human reasoning is a creation of God imprinted in all of mankind from the beginning which in turn manifests in man as a moral agency, an ability to discern right from wrong and justice from injustice.

[Wordupmybrotha]

I look at religion as a crutch or a way to validate one's past actions by saying they are pure and should be forgiven for their past now that "they are saved."

Some people need religion as a tool to help them cope because they can't do it on their own. Thus, believing in "magic" helps them find peace.

So you never asked for help did you? Did everything on your own?

Be that as it may, people "using religion as a crutch" is irrelevant to the veracity of a particular religion.