Fish and Game Code 2006

[jdawggy79]

To all LEO hunters,

Be careful when you are hunting with your rifle. Despite the fact that HR218 allows you to carry a concealed loaded weapon nationwide, it apparently does not allow you to carry a loaded rifle in your vehicle out in the middle of nowhere.

I had the pleasure of encountering a Fish and Game Lieutenant who promptly cited me for F&G 2006, even after I badged him and honestly told him that I did not think I was doing anything illegal, since I carry my handgun loaded all the time. Spirit of the law...not so much with this guy.

I'm fighting the charge and we'll see how it goes. Cops giving cops a misdemeanor cite for carrying a loaded weapon off-duty...go figure.

[erik_26]

Cops giving cops a misdemeanor cite for carrying a loaded weapon off-duty...go figure.

First, not a LEO.

Second, good to learn what you learned the hard way.

Third, if you were in his shoes, and made contact with a non-LEO regarding the same issue, would you have issued the misdemeanor?

I understand that LEOs give other LEOs breaks from time to time (not all the time and not every time). I am sure that LEOs do give non-LEOs breaks from time to time as well (maybe not as often).

But with all due respect, if you were breaking the law, the citation was deserved. As I am sure you are fully aware, LEOs are not exempt from laws and certainly not above them.

Had he issued you a verbal warning (regardless of anyone LEO status), that would have been sufficient in my book as well. He just choose to use a step above that. Which does suck regardless of who or what you are. Never feels good to get a swat on the butt.

[jdawggy79]

Erik, in regards to your question if I would issue a cite to a non LEO...the answer is "it depends." It depends on the totality of the circumstances and whether or not I thought the person would learn from the contact or not. The function of this law is to prevent people from hunting game from their vehicle, which was not my intention.

I was not asking for a break...I really thought I was authorized to carry a loaded gun with me off duty...and, in fact, my attorney thinks the same.

One thing is for sure, I would have never issued a cite of this nature to a fellow officer for this type of "violation." Cops are trained pros on handguns and rifles and are authorized to carry off duty under the federal LEOSA act. As an LEO, what if I had stumbled on a violent poacher who had just illegally taken game? As a state LEO, would DFG expect me to at least observe and report? I think so. I have the right to carry a weapon and a duty to defend myself and others. The game warden could have easily warned me and told me about the vague law and I would have gladly abided by the rules. This is a concept called "spirit of the law" that extends to the general public as well. It was painfully evident that I was a prized statistic for the officer, and not a brother in arms.

[tyrist]

I am fairly certain you have an affirmative defense. How did he even find the gun in the first place?

Are they making you ride the desk till the court case is over?

[center_x]

It seems like F&G codes supersede PC. LE can carry concealed off duty all the time, yet cannot if you are hunting during archery season....

I've typically found that most F&G are by the book, not spirit of the law....

[P5Ret]

Is it just me or does it seem like F&G has a whole bunch of lieutenant's? Nearly everyone I that I have ever encountered was a lieutenant, and yeah most of them have a black and white perspective on the law. Seems kind of CS of him to write that tag under the circumstances. Good luck in court, I'm sure I'm not the only one who is interested in the outcome.

[cowboykenny]

I worked with the F&G LT in charge of my area one night, guy was a total loose cannon. I think he thought he was like the lone ranger or something.

[ElvenSoul]

Just think what would have happened if you were not a LEO?

[thingreenline]

When you are driving in your patrol car while on duty do you have a round in the chamber of your duty rifle? I would guess not due to safety issues.... The point of HR218 was to allow LEO's to carry concealed in all 50 states. I am guessing you were contacted while hunting and your rifle was your means of take. So why should HR218 allow you to carry a long gun loaded (2006 states one in the chamber) in a vehicle to give you an advantage in taking game? Unsafe practice carrying a loaded long gun in a vehicle and of all people a Leo should know that....... Man up take care of your ticket chances are it will be dropped to an infraction or dropped in the interest of justice.

[FLIGHT762]

F&G code 2006 only exempts on duty L/E or Military or when actually going on/off duty, not when off duty. Seems when the legislators wrote F&G code 2006, they did not want to exempt off duty/retired L/E or off duty Military when engaged in hunting.

F&G code does allow you to have cartridges in the firearm's magazine, just not in the chamber when in a vehicle. This differs from the penal code when you're in areas where it's not allowed to discharge a Firearm. Just from a safety standpoint, it does make sense for long guns.

Where this gets enforced to silliness is when I've read several instances on California hunting forums in which a hunter has a firearm outside of the vehicle,leaning up against a trailer or vehicle and gets cited by F&G for a violation of F&G code 2006.

Since the O/P brought up HR218/ LEOSA, I would have to assume he is not a California LEO. It will be interesting to see what the Judge's take is on this, but the way F&G code 2006 is written, it doesn't exempt off duty L/E Military.


It seems when actually engaged in hunting, we all have to obey F&G rules, which sometimes conflicts with other California or Federal law.

O/P, let us know what the outcome of this is.

[fullrearview]

I worked with the F&G LT in charge of my area one night, guy was a total loose cannon. I think he thought he was like the lone ranger or something.

Well Kenny, they kind of are... 200 some odd wardens for the whole state!!! Up here HE is always getting into stuff. Fun stuff! I love it when he works our area.

BTW, saw your captain last weekend at the graduation... Way to cherry pick that recruit huh!

[jdawggy79]

When you are driving in your patrol car while on duty do you have a round in the chamber of your duty rifle? I would guess not due to safety issues.... The point of HR218 was to allow LEO's to carry concealed in all 50 states. I am guessing you were contacted while hunting and your rifle was your means of take. So why should HR218 allow you to carry a long gun loaded (2006 states one in the chamber) in a vehicle to give you an advantage in taking game? Unsafe practice carrying a loaded long gun in a vehicle and of all people a Leo should know that....... Man up take care of your ticket chances are it will be dropped to an infraction or dropped in the interest of justice.

You are right, we do not carry our rifles or shotguns loaded in the patrol cars. However, there have been many times when I have taken the long gun out and racked one in the chamber, primarily when responding to a "hot call." I am sure DFG contacts quite a few heavily armed right wing nuts and "sovereign citizens" during hunting season. With this in mind, in my case, I wasn't carrying for an "advantage" to take game, I was carrying the rifle loaded because I carry my handgun loaded all the time and this was my primary off-duty weapon at the time. I did not have my off-duty handgun with me. How is a loaded long gun any more dangerous than a loaded handgun? Show me the statistics - AD's happen with handguns as well.

Anyhow, with regards to the "man up" part of your comment, I was already doing that and planning on showing up for court. With comments like yours and a username like, "thingreenline," (AKA Game Warden POA) I can only presume you are DFG as well. I don't knock you guys for what you do, in fact, I have profound respect for what DFG does with regards to protecting California's natural resources. However, I do think that professional courtesy is in order when dealing with a law-abiding off-duty LEO who is honestly trying to play by the myriad hunting rules of California.

[jdawggy79]

I am fairly certain you have an affirmative defense. How did he even find the gun in the first place?

Are they making you ride the desk till the court case is over?

Fortunately, no desk duty. My supervisor chuckled when I notified him because he thought the cite was CS as well.

[CSACANNONEER]

LEOs bashing LEOs. Who would have thought it could happen on calguns?

[jbolton]

I love how u think because u r a leo exempts u from the law.