Pistol? Rifle? What is it?

[nickbackouris]

I'm an LEO in So Cal, and thought of something last night at work. With all these folks buying AR pistols and single shot this and that's so they can get cool guns past the rules (which works for me) I got to thinking....

If I did a traffic stop or whatever and came across an AR pistol, or AK pistol, or some other cool single shot pistol they bought and "converted" that the person says they legally acquired at a gun store, how do I confirm what the person is telling me? How am I supposed to know it's a pistol and not a SBR? I think to Joe Average, looking at an AR pistol looks more like an SBR than a pistol.

I would run it, and if if comes back to a person, then as far as I'm concerned it's a pistol, and I think I'm satisfied. However, this is all based on the fact that rifles (typically) come back not stolen and with no registration record. Sound good? What happens when this new law kicks in and rifles get registered to people too? Then how do I know?

[MRBLUEDOT]

interesting point, i recently purchased a AR pistol. i thought the same thing. i am hoping that if i ever do get stopped while i have it with me that the officer will be able to run it and see that it is registered as a pistol and not a rifle.

[Sgt. J Beezy]

Pistols can not have stocks on them.
They are also under 26 inches.


If it comes back registered that is one thing but what of all these 80% lowers out there that have no registration or bill of sale...

[1911su16b870]

Pistols purchased through an FFL should come back in AFS. 80% builds = no data.

[nickbackouris]

interesting point, i recently purchased a AR pistol. i thought the same thing. i am hoping that if i ever do get stopped while i have it with me that the officer will be able to run it and see that it is registered as a pistol and not a rifle.

AFS doesn't say if it's a pistol or a rifle ( I don't think) but pistols come back registered to people, and rifles don't, which is how I would differentiate. However, when the new law kicks in and everything comes back with a record, I'm not sure how I'm going to make the distinction.

Pistols can not have stocks on them.
They are also under 26 inches.

No stock...good point. Under 26 inches....still a problem with SBR's

Pistols purchased through an FFL should come back in AFS. 80% builds = no data.

Exactly my point. Heads up to that 80% lower guy...be smart. It's a lot easier to take you to jail for your gun that to figure this all out on a traffic stop. Not all cops will put in the effort I will. Do 80%'s have serial numbers?

I'm going to ask my inquiry dispatcher tonight and see what she says. Update soon.

[Glamis]

I keep a photo copy of all my paper work in the hard cases. Not for all my guns just my AR and AK clones. When I get my AR-pistol out of Jail I will be doing the same thing. I here bad story's of LEO's not knowing what there looking at all the time.

In defenses of fair & good LEO's...... you have a hard job dealing with a lot of PC BS now.



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[Petro6golf]

I know of a department that arrested a guy for having an ar pistol with an acog on it. the officer was able to articulate the acog made it an sbr. the charge stuck and the da filed on it.

[pepsi2451]

I'm an LEO in So Cal, and thought of something last night at work. With all these folks buying AR pistols and single shot this and that's so they can get cool guns past the rules (which works for me) I got to thinking....

If I did a traffic stop or whatever and came across an AR pistol, or AK pistol, or some other cool single shot pistol they bought and "converted" that the person says they legally acquired at a gun store, how do I confirm what the person is telling me? How am I supposed to know it's a pistol and not a SBR? I think to Joe Average, looking at an AR pistol looks more like an SBR than a pistol.

I would run it, and if if comes back to a person, then as far as I'm concerned it's a pistol, and I think I'm satisfied. However, this is all based on the fact that rifles (typically) come back not stolen and with no registration record. Sound good? What happens when this new law kicks in and rifles get registered to people too? Then how do I know?

If its configured as a legal pistol, why would you care whether it is registered as a rifle or pistol or not at all? I know you can't legally make a rifle into a pistol but isn't that law kinda silly since you can get a pistol lower and build that same pistol legally? If it has a mag lock and no stock why not just give them the benefit of the doubt?

Do 80%'s have serial numbers?

Some people add them but I don't believe they are required.

I know of a department that arrested a guy for having an ar pistol with an acog on it. the officer was able to articulate the acog made it an sbr. the charge stuck and the da filed on it.

I would love to hear how he articulated that and how it turned out in the end.

ETA - I'm not a cop.

[DriftinG Z32]

AFS doesn't say if it's a pistol or a rifle ( I don't think) but pistols come back registered to people, and rifles don't, which is how I would differentiate. However, when the new law kicks in and everything comes back with a record, I'm not sure how I'm going to make the distinction.

AFS return hits will tell you the serial/make/model/type/caliber and other inforamtion... Specifically it says "TYP/ PI Pistol."

If its configured as a legal pistol, why would you care whether it is registered as a rifle or pistol or not at all? I know you can't legally make a rifle into a pistol but isn't that law kinda silly since you can get a pistol lower and build that same pistol legally? If it has a mag lock and no stock why not just give them the benefit of the doubt?

If the lower is registered as a rifle and is then configured as an AR Pistol, it essentially becomes an illegal SBR... I'm sure tons of LEO have been screwed for "benefit of the doubt." Why risk it, when you can just play it safe and go by the facts.

[pepsi2451]

If the lower is registered as a rifle and is then configured as an AR Pistol, it essentially becomes an illegal SBR... I'm sure tons of LEO have been screwed for "benefit of the doubt." Why risk it, when you can just play it safe and go by the facts.

Are you guys required to run every gun you come across? I'm just wondering cause I don't think I have ever had any of my firearms run.

[nickbackouris]

Unfortunatley, If I gave people "the benefit of the doubt" I would be a terrible cop. Just as I would be if I believed everything people told me.

Essentially, the "these aren't my pants" part of the job. Sorry bud, you're wearing them. No benefit of the doubt for you.

The ACOG thing is interesting. Magnification I suppose, but there is always the pig gun revolver with a 4x scope on it, too.

[nickbackouris]

And no, not required to run every gun I see. I usually do though since good people typically don't mind. It's all about attitude. Plus while I wait for the info to come back it gives me a chance to fondle someone else's guns and scope them out, ask questions, etc.

But on these, with the gray area and depending how it turns out meaning it could be a felony, I'm going to run all pistols in rifle caliber just to be safe.

[pepsi2451]

Unfortunatley, If I gave people "the benefit of the doubt" I would be a terrible cop. Just as I would be if I believed everything people told me.

I'm not saying believe everyone in any scenario. It just seems to me like you are going out of your way to enforce a ridiculous law.

And no, not required to run every gun I see. I usually do though since good people typically don't mind. It's all about attitude. Plus while I wait for the info to come back it gives me a chance to fondle someone else's guns and scope them out, ask questions, etc.

I like to think I'm a good person, I'm certainly not a bad person and I would mind if you wanted to run all my serial numbers. I would feel like I was being harassed for nothing more then exercising a constitutional right.

But on these, with the gray area and depending how it turns out meaning it could be a felony, I'm going to run all pistols in rifle caliber just to be safe.

I don't understand, you first said "With all these folks buying AR pistols and single shot this and that's so they can get cool guns past the rules (which works for me) I got to thinking...." If it "works for you" why are you going out of your way to charge people with felonies for owning these same guns?

[tanksoldier]

how do I confirm what the person is telling me?

Question: Why would you bother to try?

You don't have any evidence a crime was committed if the weapon is legal in it's current configuration, so what would you be investigating?

...or is every firearm you encounter suspect by default?

[nickbackouris]

Just because it appears legally configured, how it is registered could be a crime. I'm running it because that's my job.

It's frustrating when I come here to ask a question, with hopes of clarifying a gray area in my mind, and in turn making myself slightly more educated, and people bash the job. You think I like taking people's guns? When they come to turn them in after grandpa dies, I tell them to leave since the department will most likely destroy them.

I asked a question about ar and ak pistols in relation to the law. Some of you gave great info, and I appreciate it. For those that chose to express how they don't like cops and don't trust them, well I suppose there is a proper forum for that somewhere, but it's not here. People that express that attitude don't exactly motivate us to provide exemplary service, I makes us think we're wasting our time.

I promise you, if someone pulled over you family member, you would want it to be me. I do my job with respect for others because that's how I think it should be done. I don't sweat the small stuff. It's just a job, but I love it. Have a good attitude and I guarantee I will give you one back. Trust me, it's not an easy job. We're not perfect, and whoever has the penal, vehicle, welfare and institutions, and local muni codes memorized is a robot. Its impossible. Obviously we can train more, learn more, spend out own money in it, and I do when I can but I have to find the balance with taking my family to dinner, buying my wife something, or going fishing.

Remember, it's just a job. I tried to clarify something. Thanks for the help, I guess. Oh, btw its midnight and I'm working. My wife isn't to happy about it.

Be safe. Good shooting.