LEO Searching a Person

[doc8404]

I have a mentally handicapped brother who lives in a condo in Lancaster that my parents own. I am active duty military stationed only a couple hours away so on the weekends i drive down and help them out. I am also a state certified EMT-P running EMS missions from fort irwin into san bernadido and LA coutny. I had just left the pharmacy with my brothers medication and arrived at his house to find to sherrifs searching him. They had him pressed up against his front door emptying his pockets. He was already in cuffs and they were on my parents property. Now i have no idea what brought on the search or why the officers stopped but i was very confused. I walked up to them announcing that i was there not to suprise them and asked why they were searching him, had him cuffed and doing on our property. They told me that he was a drug dealer and pointed to thier "evidence" which was his pill organizer he had brought into the front yard with him so i could see he needed help organizing his medications. i explained why he had the pills and that he had the mental capacity of a 5 year old and the next thing i knew i was in cuffs as well with my brothers medication being bagged as evidence. At this point i told them since they were on my family's property i needed see a warrent. To make a long story a little shorter we were both released and informed that they had recieved a call that my brother was a drug dealer and they were conducting a search. They appolgized for the inconvience but i am still confused. Is it legal to search someone on thier own property without a warrent or is the front yard and driveway area a fair game for searches? I just want to be able to avoid the situation again if i go and help my brother with his meds and he wants to sit on the front porch. I can see how it would look like a drug deal with the bright colors of anti psycotic pills and want to be able to keep my brother from that kind of experience.
thanks for reading and i have no hard feelings towards the officers they were doing thier best to do thier jobs and i have no idea what my brother may have said or done before i arrived.

Since the topic is any CA LEO searching and otherwise being in the public-facing part of property, I deleted the 'Los Angeles' part of the title.

// Librarian

[hitman13]

How to be able to search something / someone:

Search warrant
Probable cause
Incident to arrest (does not always apply: Az v. Gant)
Consent
Exigent circumstances

[Fjold]

IANAL,

But, if the police get a report of a drug dealer and see someone sitting on the porch with a bunch of pills out, they have probable cause to detain and search.

[rplusplus]

Contact a lawyer.

+1 this is now after... time to clean up and that will take a lawyer to avoid anything happening to you, your brother, or your mother since it is her property.

[doc8404]

I dont want to press charges on the officers, maybe just some education on how things are done, i just wanted to make sure that i wasnt wrong before i contacted thier supervisor and got things straightend out. Neither of them had "stripes" so they may have been new to the force or one was just supporting his partner and i just happened to be a bad play. Either way i think education rather than punishment may go a lot farther in th elong run.

[Falconis]

If the cops got a call about drug dealing and they pointed out your brother, while he is organizing pills in the front yard, that sounds like fair play and plain sight to me. They have every right to investigate.

Determining your brother's mental capacity isn't something anyone is going to know until they investigate.

Also physical handicap and a wheel chair doesn't mean a whole lot. Nothing says handicapped dope dealers can't hide weapons where they are sitting or anywhere on those wheelchairs. There are many documented cases and enough articulatable reasons to restrict movements in a case like this.

I wasn't there, nor do I know the other side of the story, but there may be the fact that no one did anything wrong.

[RickD427]

Doc,

First of all, thank you for your service to our country.

The is no requirement that LEO's have a warrant simply by reason of being on privately owned property. The state of case law concerning warrantless searches is extremely complex. IANAL, but I have been an LEO for more than 30 years and do this daily.

I concur with the previous posters that the circumstances would likely permit a limited personal search.

Please note that the LEO's responsibility is to investigate potential criminal activity. It's important to remember that not all suspicious activity is illegal, and that a common outcome of field investigations is to conclude that no illegal activity was taking place. It sounds like that was the outcome in your matter.

[Bodei]

Just curious how many of the responses to your question here are by LEOs. I assume you posted for feedback from LEOs. I have a feeling the persons recommending that you get a lawyer are 1) not LEOs 2) do not have your best interests in mind

[jdsons]

You may want to get your brother a medical alert braclet which explains his condition. May come in handy.

jdsons

[code33]

+1
This...

Just curious how many of the responses to your question here are by LEOs. I assume you posted for feedback from LEOs. I have a feeling the persons recommending that you get a lawyer are 1) not LEOs 2) do not have your best interests in mind

[Ron-Solo]

The medic alert bracelet is a good idea, along with getting to know the local deputies that patrol your area so they are aware of your brothers condition. Since this initial contact, the ones that responded should be more in tune with the situation.

The majority of the time, LE is on scene on many emergencies before fire and EMS because they are already in the field rather than responding from a station, after waking up. My agency did not respond to all medical aid calls, but anything that sounded life threatening gets a unit assigned. Unfortunately, too many people call for paramedics for non emergency illnesses because they have the false belief that they will be seen sooner in the ER or need a free ride to the hospital.

Depending on the info they received from the person who called and their initial observations when they got there, a warrant is not required, regardless of private property or not.

Thank you for your service!

[castgold]

Aside from the bracelet, can you attach the prescription information on the pill container so that it can be referenced quickly? At least it would have prescriber/dispensing pharmacy contact to verify.

[Bobby Ricigliano]

Sounds like a good search and a good faith misunderstanding. If you were detained and cuffed it was probably re 148 PC and those type of detentions usually happen only after repeated warnings not to interfere.

[Ron-Solo]

In the OP's situation, there are many scenarios where the described search is perfectly legal. As far as the OP's brother's diminished mental capacity, tht does not necessarily mean he is incapable of being involved in criminal activity, but maybe incapable of forming the "criminal intent" of being involved in criminal activity. Sadly, many mentally challenged invididuals are taken advantage of by criminals and conned into selling their legally obtained medications on he illicit market. They don't understand tht it is wrong, and the money involved can be very distracting.

[ean909]

doc8404. first off im not a lawyer. but this sounds fairly legal. but that depends on alot. first off if it was a call that prompted the search i believe that you can call and request it. im not sure about that though. there are many things that could have prompted a search. but the officers need probable cause to search someone or enter someones property or have extinuating circumstances, which in this case it sounds like there arnt any extenuating circumstances. if your brother was outside counting pills ya there is not much you can do. that could give the officer reason to approach search. or your brother could have consented to a search. but thats shakey ground. i dont know your brother personally so im not aware how readily apparent his handicap is. but being mentally handicapped would counstitute that he does not have the authorization nor the mental capacity to consent to a search. so if that is the case there needs to be something else that prompted the search or gave the officers probable cause. if your brother was acting very suspecious, or was asertive, or agressive, or retreated upon approach, that might give the officers probable cause to search. but thats also a little shakey. you need to find out what was done or what the reason was for a search. the officers could perform a pat down. but this can only be done if the officer has reaonable suspecion that the person being questioned is armed and dangerous or something else leading to believe that the officers safety might be in jeopardy. but a pat down is limited to the outer clothing only, they are not allowed to go into pockets and bag and things of that nature. but if they perform a pat down and feel a weapon or contraband they could legally go into ones pocket and retrieve that item and take the search further and more in depth. so if you really want to know more i would get a copy of the police report that would explain alot. hope this helps. if i made any mistakes someone please correct me.