A FELLOW LEO NEEDS SUGGESTIONS...Red Dot or Laser for work?

[mkingwin]

To: Fellow LEOs out there using any optics or laser sights on their rifle. And of course to those reading with any insight are welcome.

For real world scenarios, would I need a red dot type optics for my rifle or is a laser of Green or Red beam practical?

Completing rifle school and ready to deploy it next to me soon, just want to get some feedback from those using.

I'm not SWAT btw, just your normal patrol brother.

[Ron-Solo]

LASD uses EoTech 512 sights on their patrol rifles. Make sure you get something sturdy. Lasers on rifles, in my opinion, take a far distant 2nd place to a good sight with quick acquisition capabilities. In bright sunlight, a laser will be useless. And one that will hold its accuracy at rifle distances is also very expensive.

[Grumpyoldretiredcop]

In bright sunlight, a laser will be useless.

Especially this. I tested handgun lasers for my agency and found them to be useless in anything but heavy overcast at ranges farther than 3 yards or so, let alone rifle ranges.

[biochembruin]

Red dot. Hands down, for the above reasons and several other reliability reasons as well.

[mkingwin]

Thanks for the insight so far. Going to change up the topic to get more feedback, hope it works.

But thank you for all those who replied and read so far.

Just want to get a stronger feel on practical use.

[vintagearms]

For practical use, I would look at the Aimpoint PRO and the EOtech XPS. As others have stated, lasers offer no real use in daylight.

[oddjob]

Red dot for the same reasons stated. Back up irons too.

[Ron-Solo]

I used to have a Crimson Trace laser on my Beretta 92f when they were first authorized by LASD. I found my accuracy decreased and I was focusing too much on that little red dot and not watching other things that are important in those critical situations.

For my personal rifle, I have an EoTech 517 ( identical to the 512, but the control buttons are on the side) and I really like it. It doesn't distract from your field of vision, and allows you to see the big picture. Some like the Aimpoint, which is also a good quality optic. I just couldn't justify the extra $300 for the Aimpoint. I've used them on some Department special weapons (MP5, MP5K, and HK416) and liked them very much, but I didn't have to pay for them.

[mkingwin]

Perfect replies, this was what I was aiming for.

Thanks to all those who read and those who replied. Its just down to which brand and model, but I'm not starting a war on that.

Only reason why I asked was I didn't want to go with a handle in front of my rifle for more weight, but it had a combo light and laser with a easy grip action and was a decent price.

Thanks for the insight, now back to optics and a good light.

[oddjob]

My old M-4 had a Surefire pressure switch mounted on the forearm. My H&K 53 and MP-5 had a similar system. It was one of the smaller lights. Some of my partners had a huge spotlight type setup that looked like a phaser from a starship! It was too heavy for me.

Make sure you look at the different reticles for the different systems. What I didn't care for with the Holo Sight was the reticle was too "busy". There was a larger circle, then lines then a dot (I think). My agency was kind enough to get me a simple dot. Test some out before you cough up your money. My experience has been simple is better (as a rule).

Its been my experience that for close up stuff (7yds and less) there is nothing faster than iron sights. Red dots are good for mid to long range stuff. I still shoot 3 gun with a red dot and an Acog.

Good luck!!

[Notorious]

Optics like EOTech or Trijicon are invaluable in CQB, as witnessed by the military who usually won't let technology distill down to the infantry level and would have insisted on open sights.

Lasers? Not so much on a rifle.

[calibrator]

SWFA 1-4X24 with the illuminated "Donut" reticle. True 1 X for both eyes open CQB, and a Mil Dot at 4X for distance. Great for low-light urban use on an AR platform. YMMV

[fullrearview]

I would suggest getting an aimpoint or eotech, but I HIGHLY recommend getting magnification as well. I recently attended a rifle instructor course and magnification is a must. I discovered a lot of deficiencies in our gear, and patrol will be switching over to eotechs in the near future. magnification as budgets allow...

We currently have these sights on our rifles.

http://www.red-dot-scopes.com/trijicon-1x24mm-reflex-sight-6-5-moa-dot.html

I was pleased with them until we started shooting at about 100 yards. I hit my intended target every time, but I was shooting at an 8 inch or larger steel plate. My rifle is very capable of sub MOA at 100 yards (Although the jury is out on my ability).

It's a GREAT sight if your rifle is for entry only. No batteries and super tough, but with a 6.5 MOA dot, it's not great for distance at all. As I'm sure you know, 6.5 MOA at 100 yards means my round can land anywhere in a 6.5 inch circle. That leaves way to much margin for error, even at 25 yards, let alone 100.

I recommend these.

http://www.eotech-inc.com/products/magnifiers/hhs2

Battery life is not as good as the Aimpoints, but the magnification is smooth and quick.

[1911su16b870]

The red dot sights are great for support side transitions and obtaining rapid sight picture with your "support eye".

I've had to put a little bit of work into getting that "support eye" to quickly find that front sight through the 0-2 aperture on my AR15 irons.

[mixicus]

I currently run an EOTech. However, I will be switching over to an Aimpoint product in the near future, specifically the PRO. The reason for the switch is primarily the battery life. You turn it on and leave it on for several years without replacing the battery. This cuts out time needed to bring the rifle into the fight compared to the EOTech. I've got to work with the Aimpoints and my EOTech side-by-side quite a bit in the last 6 months. Using a shot timer, I haven't notice any slower first shot, shot-to-shot or target transitioning with the Aimpoint.

As for magnification, take a look at your area and assignment and the likely hood of needing/benefit of a magnifier or a Trijicon ACOG. Then make your decision about it. If you are leaning towards a fixed magnification product, make sure to evaluated it at closer distances such as car stop, back yard and room clearing. You may find the narrow field of view under these situations less than comfortable.