Self sponcered academy, or degree ?

[jrivera408]

I have a question for the officers here on CGN. I have been applying to departments in the SF Bay area with little luck. As we all know due to budget cuts and the economy, jobs are few and far between. I understand it may take months or years until the hiring picks up. I've thought deep within and have decided to ride things out. During this low time I would like to know if a self sponcered academy, criminal justice degree, or other schooling during this time, which would be more benificial. I also understand that any amount of schooling/training will look better on paper versus someone with little to no education. Thanks in advance for any information.

[Cpl. Haas]

This is just my personal advice...

Forget wasting your money on a self-sponsored academy right now. There are so few job spots open currently that departments often have hundreds of applicants competing for 1 or 2 slots... many of them with degrees, military preference, POST certs, or are even recently laid-off LEOs from other departments. A friend of mine put herself through the Napa Academy about 3 years ago, has applied to numerous departments up and down the state, and still wasn't hired... she made it to the final chief's interview with 5; 4 hired recently laid-off LEOs, and Santa Barbara passed on her just because she wasn't local and they felt she would leave the department withing 10 years... they can literally be that choosy right now will all the applicants they have to consider!

So now she's looking at her POST cert expiring and having to do it all over again. With our current economic state, it's realistically going to be several years before agencies start getting back into the state of hiring they used to be in.

The best thing you can do for yourself right now is go to school and aim to obtain at least a bachelor's degree, if not higher. A POST cert will only benefit you if you're going to get a job in CA within 3.5 years of attending the academy... and some of the departments currently hiring won't even care about your cert and will put you through their own academy anyway.

Alternatively, a BA/BS degree never expires, and will benefit you in any job and any state you choose to work. And the time it will take you to obtain a degree will also give the economy time to continue recovering (hopefully), so the LEO job market will hopefully be better once you're out... then you'll be a more desirable candidate holding a 4-year degree.

And if the LEO job market still sucks when you finish school? You can look into private-sector jobs... or LEO jobs in other states... or fed LEO jobs... or kill more time by going into the military where a 4-year degree will qualify you to apply for OCS or bring you in at a higher enlisted rank (Army starts you at an E-4 rank with a bachelor's degree).

[Dirtbiker]

Degree all the way.

[cacop]

How old are you? While there are no limits on hiring ages for the mot part that does affect you will live your life.

Generically speaking I always tell people certain things will get you a bump over somebody with none of these things.

1. College level classes, especially English. If you take no other classes at your local JC than English you will show a lot more smarts than the average recruit with a HS diploma only. Or even someone who takes a few CJ classes. Report writing is one of the top, if not top reasons why people fail out of the academy and FTO. One of our recruits made it through the academy but would freeze up on the streets because he was afraid to do anything because he would have to write a report about it. Writing has got to come relatively easy for you. Sure you can struggle a little with a couple of words or sentences per page in a report but any more than that and you are goingt o fall behind fast.

2. Military experience, especially where you have had a promotion or two in a relatively short period of time. There are some guys out of the military that flat out suck at police work. A lot of them weren't all that good at being a soldier/marine/airman/sailor. The ones who could have had 20+ year careers in the military do well in police work.

3. Any work experience where you have a large amount of responsibility and you have to follow complex policies. Flipping burgers or lugging sacks of cement around a contruction sit might be okay for awhile but by the time you get into your 20s you need to be running the show for the owner at the local burger joint or you are directing traffic so to speak at a construction site. You don't have to be THE Boss, you just have to be someone THE Boss can count on to get the job done without supervision or maybe even you are the supervision for the guys who have trouble pulling it together.

So without knowning your specifics I would genreically advise you to get one of more of the above things accomplished BEFORE you try putting yourself through an academy. We have hired people in their 30s and 40s in th elast 10 years or so. The reason why was when they were in their early 20s back in the late 80s early 90s the baby boomers were hanging onto all the LE jobs and competition was pretty tight. They didn't get hired after a couple of tries and went into other career areas. Then like now they could have put themselves through an academy and gotten hired. The key thing to remember too was they also eventually picked up the experience listed above.

I think in this day and age you need to present an agency with the best package you can. Education is never going to be a minus in any career path, especially if it involves business or finance. A lot of our managers have that and need it. Military experience is good too. Our best cops tend to have it, managers not so much. Good job histories is where it is almost universal with our people.

Also keep in mind my agency has been trying to hire academy grads and laterals for the last 2 years non stop. You have got to really stand out. The more you have from those three catagories listed above the better off you will be.

[jrivera408]

Thanks you guys for the awesome insight. At the moment I only have a 2yr degree, as well as a current career in the aerospace field. Im 28, and have recently looked into serving in the A/F but their age cut off for active is 27. Also for personal as well as family reasons, this did not seem like the best choice at the moment. Basically I know that for the next few years a job in law enforcement will be difficult to come by. This is why I am trying to do things that will open doors in the future.

[veeklog]

Finish your degree. I was a self-sponsored back in 1994, and things were as bleak then as they are now. I took the advice of a background investigator who told me to go back to college and finish my bachelor's degree. A year after I finished my BS, I had a job with the Feds. Finish your degree and you will be more marketable.

[cacop]

Now that I know you have a 2 yr already go for the 4 year. If you can get it in something like business/econ or some sort of engineering/computer science. First of all things in LE are become more comupterized and crooks are too. Second if you go the business route if you ever promote you will be ble to understand and handle budgets. Third even if you don't get into LE for a long time or maybe never you will have a solid career.

You might also want to consider going reserve if you are going to school. I went to a reserve academy when I was in college. Granted back then all you needed was module A and B but it is still something to consider. It depends on if you can manage school, work, and reserve all at the same time or some combination of the three.

[NineteenElev3n]

FYI: I recently graduated as a self-sponsored/unaffiliated academy graduate and I have a Master's Degree, a Bachelor's Degree, and multiple Associate's Degrees, 10+ years of work experience (still thankfully employed), and I still have not have been hired at an agency nor have I had an interview yet. The LEO market is tough to get into right now. Since I am not a lateral with a Basic POST Certificate, I have to rely on job postings that advertise as an "Academy Graduate". I have multiple applications that are out right now and I am in the waiting game.

[eltee]

Consider signing on as a RESERVE officer. It's good for you to see what real cop work is like and it is good for a prospective employer to see that you've made your bones. You can join up as a lower level reserve w/ minimal training but if you like it and have the time, drive and finances you might go through the academy to get your "Basic Academy" certification and then you would be eligible to work as a Level One Reserve Officer. Depending upon the department, as a Level 1 you can do most / all the duties of a regular member.

If, at the lower reserve level, you decide you like it, or don't like you, you can proceed accordingly. SOMETIMES reservists have an advantage in getting a job. Where I live, many of the new hires come from the reserve ranks.

Lots of good info in this thread. LE is a tough gig to get into these days. Even before the economy bust, getting hired was tough. Good luck!

[mixicus]

It's going to be a few years before any across the board significant hiring is going to take place. Finish a 4 year degree in a field that is of interest to you and you could make a living with. Then reassess the LE job market. At that point, you should have a few paths to choose from including 1) getting hired in LE, 2) self-sponsor if it looks like hiring is going to pick-up in a 2-3 year window, 3) professional employment outside LE 4) advanced degree. Several of those could be combined and/or sprinkled with a reserve LE role.

If LE is where you want to be, don't give up. Keep working at it and making yourself a better candidate.

[jrivera408]

A big thank you to all who have responded!

[BoJackUSMC]

College degree all the way and make sure you study something that is very marketable in LEO field. I believe degree like accounting, computer information, finance, economic, and pre-law will make you stand out even more.

I am in the hiring process with local Sheriff Department and I only have two associate degree for now. In fact, I am attending CSULB right now in
order to get my BS degree on Finance or International Marketing. I also have military background and fluent in Korean, but I am not even sure that is enough.
I am pretty sure there are other applicants out there with better education and work experience than me. Especially today's marketing, times are hard right now.

[Che762x39]

I have a question for the officers here on CGN.

I would like to know if a self sponcered academy, criminal justice degree, or

I am retired after 25 years on the job.

My first question why would you want to be a cop?

Second have you taken an aptitude test that shows law enforcement as your career path?

Why I asked is that I was an FTO for 7 years and I had several trainees that had no skill as a cop. Maybe they could do 35 pullups or was an academic wonderkid but not a cop.

How you know you are not meant to be a plumber or a librarian?

[Che762x39]

Thanks you guys for the awesome insight. At the moment I only have a 2yr degree, as well as a current career in the aerospace field. Im 28, and have recently looked into serving in the A/F but their age cut off for active is 27. Also for personal as well as family reasons, this did not seem like the best choice at the moment. Basically I know that for the next few years a job in law enforcement will be difficult to come by. This is why I am trying to do things that will open doors in the future.

Join the Army they will take you at 41 years old. The Air Force is very picky and their law enforcement career path is a glorified security guard but you will qualified to be a fed when you discharge.

[fmxmyway]

I am retired after 25 years on the job.

My first question why would you want to be a cop?

Second have you taken an aptitude test that shows law enforcement as your career path?

Why I asked is that I was an FTO for 7 years and I had several trainees that had no skill as a cop. Maybe they could do 35 pullups or was an academic wonderkid but not a cop.

How you know you are not meant to be a plumber or a librarian?

All good cops were born as good cops. It came innately with birth. Straight out of there mothers vagina with gun and billy club in hand. All dedicated and motivated people that desire to become cops, need not apply. lol