Question regarding 'detained' firearm

[castelle]

Guys - first off, thanks to all of you who posted replies on my other posts - you guys are great! lots of good advice, opinions and thoughts.

A new 'question' has now been born.

I moved out of my old place and my former 'friend/landlord' retained my Glock 22 as he was under the impression I owed him back rent (not true but besides the point so far as you guys are concerned)

He's refusing to give up the weapon and has even hinted and suggested that he's sold it (doubt ful as I don't think he can). Furthermore I think he's in the process of moving - not sure if its out of state but it might be.

But here's my question - the gun is simple property, much like a cell phone or a laptop and if it were a device like this I would be advised by LEO to go to court and sue for the return of my property. In this instance as its a firearm, does the law see things differently? is it handled in a different manner?

For those that would ask have I filed a police report - the answer is, not yet but if I get no satisfaction I will. Also, the person who has the firearm lives directly across from a school (if that has any bearing) and has been arrested at least three times in California for misdemeanor DUI (not felony)

Thoughts, comments, concerns or advice?
Cheers

[ckim34]

It sounds like a civil matter. Contact a lawyer and go from there. If you are the registered owner of the gun he can not sell it.

BTW how did he get possession of the firearm in the first place?

[shellyzsweet]

He can't sell it. Take him to court. Before you do that...file a police report and tell him you will be doing so.

The firearm was taken from you unlawfully....now I"M NOT A LAWYER, but it sounds like a case can be made for your weapon being stolen, and thus it is considered a stolen firearm and might become a criminal matter....I'd suggest reminding him of this prior to filing the police report and see if that motivates him to give it back.

But ONCE AGAIN I'M NOT A LAWYER!

[castelle]

He got possession of the weapon from its locked case while it was stored in my car in his garage and he had access to the keys (I was on a business trip) The whole thing pisses me off as I'm sure he will try to make life difficult and he has wayyy more money to throw at dragging this out than I do. He's also on some thin ice as hes not a US citizen (legal alien though) and has managed to spend 30 days in jail for his mulitple dui's.

[TRICKSTER]

If he did not have permission to enter you vehicle or remove anything from it, he has committed a Felony. How you want to handle it is up to you.

484. (a) Every person who shall feloniously steal, take, carry,
lead, or drive away the personal property of another, or who shall
fraudulently appropriate property which has been entrusted to him or
her, or who shall knowingly and designedly, by any false or
fraudulent representation or pretense, defraud any other person of
money, labor or real or personal property, or who causes or procures
others to report falsely of his or her wealth or mercantile character
and by thus imposing upon any person, obtains credit and thereby
fraudulently gets or obtains possession of money, or property or
obtains the labor or service of another, is guilty of theft.


486. Theft is divided into two degrees, the first of which is
termed grand theft; the second, petty theft.



487. Grand theft is theft committed in any of the following cases:
(a) When the money, labor, or real or personal property taken is
of a value exceeding four hundred dollars ($400) except as provided
in subdivision (b).
(b) Notwithstanding subdivision (a), grand theft is committed in
any of the following cases:
(1) (A) When domestic fowls, avocados, olives, citrus or deciduous
fruits, other fruits, vegetables, nuts, artichokes, or other farm
crops are taken of a value exceeding two hundred fifty dollars
($250).
(B) For the purposes of establishing that the value of avocados or
citrus fruit under this paragraph exceeds two hundred fifty dollars
($250), that value may be shown by the presentation of credible
evidence which establishes that on the day of the theft avocados or
citrus fruit of the same variety and weight exceeded two hundred
fifty dollars ($250) in wholesale value.
(2) When fish, shellfish, mollusks, crustaceans, kelp, algae, or
other aquacultural products are taken from a commercial or research
operation which is producing that product, of a value exceeding two
hundred fifty dollars ($250).
(3) Where the money, labor, or real or personal property is taken
by a servant, agent, or employee from his or her principal or
employer and aggregates nine hundred fifty dollars ($950) or more in
any 12 consecutive month period.
(c) When the property is taken from the person of another.
(d) When the property taken is any of the following:
(1) An automobile, horse, mare, gelding, any bovine animal, any
caprine animal, mule, jack, jenny, sheep, lamb, hog, sow, boar, gilt,
barrow, or pig.
(2) A firearm.
(e) This section shall become operative on January 1, 1997.

[yzErnie]

1. Have you asked him for the gun to be returned to you?

2. If he says he is holding it as collateral for an alleged debt owed, do you have any way to disprove his claim?

3. Contact the LEA for that jurisdiction and ask them to do a Keep The Peace while you go to "pick up" the gun. Explain to the officer the circumstances and he may accompany you to the location and simply be there to ensure things remain calm or he may make a determination that a crime is being committed by the "friend/landlord" and take an appropriate law enforcement action. If he took it from your locked car and locked gun case there may have been a crime committed.

I am anti "contact an attorney" until you have exhausted all possible means of solving this issue short of that.

[BigDogatPlay]

To extend a bit on the above.....

1) If there is a debt involved, settle it. If no debt involved, then have something in hand to prove that there is no debt... canceled checks, cash receipts, anything.

2) Ask, in writing, for your property to be returned. Document everything and every contact.

3) If there was no crime committed, but your property is still not in your possession, then trot yourself down to the courthouse, file a small claims action against him and pay to have him served. Once the action is filed, he can move out of the state, FTA the court date and you can get a judgment against him. Then you hire a collector to make his life miserable.

[SReagle]

I am not an LEO, but was His garage at his home or did you mean the garage where you rent, if it was at the home you were renting and you did not get the police coming to your door with an vacate notice to remove you from the rental home " the landlord / Owner must by calif. law give you 24 hours notice before they enter any rental and a brief explanation as to why they are going to be there, if not I would think that's breaking and entering.
However if said garage is at the landlords home he can enter his own garage anytime he wants, I do not know about getting into a car that dose not belong to him in his own garage. GL.

[ponderosa]

Not LEO...

Sounds like theft to me, and possession of stolen property. How'd the guy get the keys to gun case? Sorry, but sounds like a lesson there too. I'd call the cops on him myself, if he had my pistol, without my okay, that is theft.

[tyrist]

How much time has passed?

[choprzrul]

I sure wouldn't give him any notice of what you are about to do. It sounds like you have had the "give me back my Glock" conversation already. Giving him notice will give him time to make the evidence disappear and he will say that you lost it and he has never seen it. Instead, call him and tell him you want to get the matter settled and you will meet him at his residence. This will tell you whether or not he is still in possession of your property.

I like the idea of asking for an officer to go with you to his residence. Maybe a printout of the relevant PC might aid the officer in determining whether or not a crime has been committed. The way I see this, he stole your firearm and I have no mercy when it comes to theft of a firearm. When you think about it, he is denying you of your civil rights to keep and bear arms. Hit him hard and fast and don't look back.

[DEPUTYBILL]

If I missed this info,I am sorry,but I think another key issue is if the gun is registered to you. If it is not,you are going to have some problems proving ownership.

[castelle]

Hi guys - thanks for taking the time to respond. The weapon was stored in a locked box at the home he owns (which I rented) and my car was in the garage at the time. It was common practise to leave my car keys at the residence when I went on a trip and the gun case key was also on the main keys for the vehicle.

Yes, I've already had the 'give me back my property' conversation to the point where I felt - he has my gun - I don't have anything and left. In so far as any debt that exists its all in his head.....I honestly truely don't owe the guy anything but even if I did, I don't think he should be in posession of a firearm especially my FIREARM. Oh, did I mention that theres a really nice laser light combo on the weapon as well - thats about $300 worth!

I'm kinda at a loss as to what to do - court is an option but I think he would likely just not show up!

I'm thinking of giving him one last chance to freely return the weapon to me then I'm reporting it stolen. I think if I understand the definition of theft its to temporariliy or permanently deprive someone of thier property and he's certainly guilty of that!

Any other questions or comments from you guys???

And by the way - thanks again for all your responses - this forum is fantastic! sucks I only found it recently.

[Cowboy T]

OMG, he took your gun?? The way California is about guns generally, that guy's facing serious jail time. I'd so be calling the cops and reporting a stolen gun and who did it. Don't "try to be nice" about this one, not in this case. HE HAS STOLEN YOUR GUN.

[retired]

Also, think about this; if he does something stupid with the gun (commit a crime for example) and the police obtain it, guess who they will be contacting.

You have tried the low key way and it didn't work. Call your local agency and file a theft report.