Must prove Innocence

[HalveNaught]

Hello LEO's. First off, I want to thank you for your courage and service. I kno wyou have a very stressful job these days, and somebody has got to do it. Whicih leads me to my (hopefully respectful) question. Why does it seem these days that we, the civilians, are so often guilty until proven innocent?

Example- This past weekend I was syphoning gas out of my truck that is totalled and we are selling to a wrecker. The gas tank was filled the night before the accident, and we were trying to save some $$ in these hard times. So our my truck is parked on the street in front of my house behind our other car, and this is a Saturday afternoon.

A local cop rolls up and puts on his lights as he pulls in behind the truck. He gets out with his hand on his gun and asks me to step away from the vehicle. Now remember I am in the middle of a syphon, and you should know how hard those damn things are to get going. Well I did no tlike the idea of having to stop it and restart the process, so I said in a friendly way with a smile, "Hi, this is my vehicle and my house, do I have to stop, these are a pain to get going?" He then yells as he repeats himself, still hand on gun "Sir step away form the vehicle." So I comply. Hw asks for registration, license etc, so I take out the keys from my pocket and open the truck to get out the reg, as doing so I say, still with a smile on my face, "See, I even have the keys."

At this point, he gets on his cb thing and calls in backup!! I get the required documentation for him, prove everything, and his backup shows up. Now they have me sit on the curb and order me not to move, as the original LEO goes to verify my info, an the other two who came as backup watch over me.

Of course everything checked out and they eventually left. But I have to say I was very disappointed at the whole interaction. I felt like I was being disrespected, degraded and looked upon with disdain. I mean, I am a middle aged white guy living in a nice area. What did I do to deserve this kind of mistreatment? What ever happened to the cop on the corner helping kids cross the street, or the smiling cop giving directions, or teh saying guilty until proven innocent?

Sorry if any emotions came through in this, I really mean no disrespect, on the contrary, I have the utmost respect for you and all that you do, which has prompted my question. What happened to jade you guys? Is it because of all violence these days? Or is it a departmental thing that causes some to take different approaches?

Thanks for the clarity!

[Lancear15]

where do you live? Someone tried to syphon gas out of my truck so on the other side of the coin, how often do you see someone syphoning gas out of their own vehicle? I think he was right to thoroughly check you out.

[CSACANNONEER]

If you spilled any gas due to following the officer's orders, you should report the hazmat spill and make sure thee officer's superiors know that he was responsible for a hazmat spill. OTOH, what if someone was stealing your gas. You'ld be happy that the officer stopped, right? Not everyone is a social butterfly, he was doing his job and it inconvienced you. It sucks that some officers are like that though.

[sc_expg]

I think you should try to see it from the LEO's perspective. He is driving through the neighborhood and see's a person siphoning gas. I think it is reasonable to say that is not a normal occurrence and usually is indicative of people stealing gas. He steps out with his hand on his gun probably because he cant see both of your hands and you are possibly committing a crime (Just an officer safety thing). He asks you to step away from the vehicle and you do not comply and question him instead. You have to understand he has no idea who you are or what your intentions are and the only way he is going to find out that information is by verifying the information you give him. Being a middle aged white guy living in a nice neighborhood does not mean you are not committing a crime. Have you seen the video of the really old white guy carrying an oxygen tank that robs a bank?

Here a link

http://www.sandiego6.com/news/local/story/La-Jolla-bank-robber-oxygen-San-Diego/S4EDejG370OAGJvfUk1qlQ.cspx

[Jonathan Doe]

If I see anyone siphon gas out of any car, I will check out to make sure. You will be surprised what the "bad" guys say about that kind of stuffs. The cops don't know you, and they have to prevent crime.

[HalveNaught]

I guess I should clarify my intent behind questioning. I am not upset that he questioned me, after all, it can look suspicious. I am not upset that I had to prove ownership, that just makes sense. I am not upset that he put his hand to his sidearm, if I was a LEO I prolly would too. Heck, I am not even upset that I had to stop and it took another 5 minutes to get the siphon working again after he left.

What I am upset about is the way I was treated. The entire engagement left me with a bitter taste in my mouth. As I am a law abiding citizen, have never been arrested or to jail, and I have not been pulled over in a long time, I was very surprised and taken aback at the demeanor of this LEO toward me, my wife and son. We were all treated like criminals, with disrespect, and with indignation. Maybe it was just him, maybe he was having a bad day, but either way, I felt like criminal and even when they were leaving, I felt like I was doing something wrong, even though I wasn't.

My main motivation in posting this is to ask whatever happened to the cops of old, you know like you used to see on tv or in movies. Heck, I remember growing up (20 years ago or so) they were still the friendly civil servant always there to help you out. Those days seem to be gone. Why? What happened? Is it just because our society is more violent nowadays? I was just hoping to get some insight from the horses mouth, so to speak.

Thanks.

[Ron-Solo]

I guess I should clarify my intent behind questioning. I am not upset that he questioned me, after all, it can look suspicious. I am not upset that I had to prove ownership, that just makes sense. I am not upset that he put his hand to his sidearm, if I was a LEO I prolly would too. Heck, I am not even upset that I had to stop and it took another 5 minutes to get the siphon working again after he left.

What I am upset about is the way I was treated. The entire engagement left me with a bitter taste in my mouth.

Could that be the gasoline? JUST KIDDING!!!


As I am a law abiding citizen, have never been arrested or to jail, and I have not been pulled over in a long time, I was very surprised and taken aback at the demeanor of this LEO toward me, my wife and son. We were all treated like criminals, with disrespect, and with indignation. Maybe it was just him, maybe he was having a bad day, but either way, I felt like criminal and even when they were leaving, I felt like I was doing something wrong, even though I wasn't.

By your own statements you didn't comply with his instructions and instead, asked questions and showed him a set of keys. They could have been keys to anything. With the cost of gas these days, thefts are very high.

My main motivation in posting this is to ask whatever happened to the cops of old, you know like you used to see on tv or in movies.

John Wayne could jump off a running horse, take down the bad guy, and never lose his hat. The first thing you need to stop doing is to compare ANYTHING you see on TV or the movies as reality. On CHiPs they NEVER drew their guns and all cars in collisions either flipped over or burst into flames, or both.

Heck, I remember growing up (20 years ago or so) they were still the friendly civil servant always there to help you out. Those days seem to be gone. Why? What happened? Is it just because our society is more violent nowadays? I was just hoping to get some insight from the horses mouth, so to speak.

Thanks.

The friendly cops are still out there, we are spread thin and don't get time to slow down and say "Howdy" much anymore. Some of the stations on our department are running at lower staffing levels than we did 20 years ago, in areas where the population has doubled during that same time period.

[yzErnie]

What I am upset about is the way I was treated. We were all treated like criminals, with disrespect, and with indignation.

Please expand on you comments "treated like criminals, "with disrespect" and "with indignation".

Maybe I am looking to deeply into your comments. He did not pull out his gun and prone you out in the middle of the street did he? He allowed you to go into your own vehicle and retrieve the registration. He had you sit on the curb while he checked to make sure you are who you say you are and that the car is actually registered to you. Your story matches and you are then free to go on about your business. You were treated like a criminal (not a serious one tho) until he found out all was ok and he left.

I don't really see anything there that rises to the "disrepsect" or "indignation" as you stated.

Was something said to you that you did not put in your posts which made you feel uneasy? Were you handcuffed?

[mlatino]

If you spilled any gas due to following the officer's orders, you should report the hazmat spill and make sure thee officer's superiors know that he was responsible for a hazmat spill.

Seriously?

[HalveNaught]

Please expand on you comments "treated like criminals, "with disrespect" and "with indignation".

You were treated like a criminal (not a serious one tho) until he found out all was ok and he left.

I don't really see anything there that rises to the "disrepsect" or "indignation" as you stated.

Was something said to you that you did not put in your posts which made you feel uneasy? Were you handcuffed?

I guess this is a difficult thing to discuss on the net as it had a lot to do with feelings, feeling like I had done something wrong, feeling like I was being disrespected, feeling like he was being indignant.

You said it best right up there, and I guess that is really all my question is--I was treated like a criminal until I could prove my innocence. It was all in the officers disposition. I hat to say it, but he was being a real D$&K, for no apparent reason. The whole failure to comply took about as long as it takes to say "Really, you want me to stop just to get my registration right now? OK" and off I went. As I stated, I was congenial, cooperative, respectful and compliant (after said dialogue). Why can't the officer treat me the same way?

Look, I work with elementary age kids, and I can tell you what the scuttlebutt is with them, it's that the "popo" are all mean and are going to harass them and detain them any chance they get (my words, not theirs). Kids these days learn to avoid police, to run away--not to look to them for help or to ensure their safety. That's not the message I grew up thinking about my local police force. As stated earlier, when I was young police were always kind and helpful. There seems to be a lot of animosity building up on both sides these days. I was just looking for some insight.

Ron Solo- thanks, those comments made me laugh! :-)

[Brianguy]

Why isn't having the car keys enough? What's with the checking his life story?

[SJgunguy24]

Why isn't having the car keys enough? What's with the checking his life story?

Keys don't mean squat. I can get a key cut for just about any vehicle that doesn't have the electronic lock out. (key with a chip)

I defense of the cop, he has know idea who you are or what your doing. He has to come from a position of power to gain control. If you were a bad guy committing a crime and didn't flat out bolt at the sight of a cop, what is that guy capable of? It's a scary thought but some hardend criminals really don't care and to kill a cop who was slipping is a notch in their belt.

To the OP, dude i've been there and done that sooo many times it gets old. I got one for you. How about getting yanked out of bed from a dead sleep at gun point by the police. And when asking what was going on being yelled at and told to S.T.F.U.
Then being kept up half the night being told "we're getting into your gunsafe, you understand. You will open it." And why did this happen........... a welfare check on my mother.
I look at things from both sides, it's tough to do. It's worse trying to defend a LEO's actions because of the attitude you described earlier. When I was in my teens it was a cop who kept me inline. To this day i'll never be able to pay back what he gave me. I've also been on the other side of the law.

[yzErnie]

I guess this is a difficult thing to discuss on the net as it had a lot to do with feelings, feeling like I had done something wrong, feeling like I was being disrespected, feeling like he was being indignant.

You said it best right up there, and I guess that is really all my question is--I was treated like a criminal until I could prove my innocence. It was all in the officers disposition. I hat to say it, but he was being a real D$&K, for no apparent reason. The whole failure to comply took about as long as it takes to say "Really, you want me to stop just to get my registration right now? OK" and off I went. As I stated, I was congenial, cooperative, respectful and compliant (after said dialogue). Why can't the officer treat me the same way?

Look, I work with elementary age kids, and I can tell you what the scuttlebutt is with them, it's that the "popo" are all mean and are going to harass them and detain them any chance they get (my words, not theirs). Kids these days learn to avoid police, to run away--not to look to them for help or to ensure their safety. That's not the message I grew up thinking about my local police force. As stated earlier, when I was young police were always kind and helpful. There seems to be a lot of animosity building up on both sides these days. I was just looking for some insight.

Ron Solo- thanks, those comments made me laugh! :-)

I can understand your feeling as though you were treated wrongly. Let's put the shoe on the other foot for a second. Let's just say, for the sake of playing devils advocate, that is wasn't you taking the gasoline out of your gas tank. Would you have wanted the officer to roll up and see it happening, only to have the thief wave to the LEO and say 'it's ok officer, it is my car' and then have the officer drive off without taking any enforcement action? I know I wouldn't want that to happen if someone was stealing my stuff. The LEO has no control over how you feel about the contact. You say he was being a "D**K" but you don't say what he was doing to give you that "feeling".

As far as what the kids are saying these days, in todays society people have stooped so low that the have lost respect for their fellow man and not just the cops. Over the years I have watched first hand people disrespect not only strangers but for their own family as well. IMHO, the lack of respect for each other has been compounded by the "popo" holding people accountable for their foolish actions. Why accept the blame for their own actions when they can blame someone else...like the "popo?"

[surfNshoot]

After reading through this. Instead of the officer saying step away from the vehicle, why couldn't he just say how’s it going? I stopped because let’s face it this looks a little fishy and I want to make sure all is good. Any way you can cap that off for a minute while I make sure all is cool? I totally understand him with his hand on his gun but give the guy a chance. Even if he didn't stop right away the officer is still in control of the situation.

I was in England earlier this year and was amazed at how polite the police were there. I never see that anymore with officers now. I like the OP don’t understand why.

[Brianguy]

Keys don't mean squat. I can get a key cut for just about any vehicle that doesn't have the electronic lock out. (key with a chip)

I defense of the cop, he has know idea who you are or what your doing. He has to come from a position of power to gain control. If you were a bad guy committing a crime and didn't flat out bolt at the sight of a cop, what is that guy capable of? It's a scary thought but some hardend criminals really don't care and to kill a cop who was slipping is a notch in their belt.

To the OP, dude i've been there and done that sooo many times it gets old. I got one for you. How about getting yanked out of bed from a dead sleep at gun point by the police. And when asking what was going on being yelled at and told to S.T.F.U.
Then being kept up half the night being told "we're getting into your gunsafe, you understand. You will open it." And why did this happen........... a welfare check on my mother.
I look at things from both sides, it's tough to do. It's worse trying to defend a LEO's actions because of the attitude you described earlier. When I was in my teens it was a cop who kept me inline. To this day i'll never be able to pay back what he gave me. I've also been on the other side of the law.

What if he was doing a favor for a female friend. She gave him the keys and she also stepped out to the market for a while and forgot her cellphone. Are they going to detain him for hours until she returns?

If I was a thief and had keys for a car, I'd drive off with it and then steal the gas in a more secure area.