BHPD guns issued question

[Surplus98]

I have a bhpd s&w 681 in .357 I was wondering if they were commonly used by Beverly Hills or if they ordered them more for a swat team or what? I know LAPD only issued 38 special and CHP too so the .357 made me wonder. They bought them in June 1984. Any knowledge would be appreciated a lot. Thank you very much.

[P5Ret]

Many agencies bought .357's back in the day, but they issued .38 Special ammo, usually in a +P, or +P+.

I can't speak to what BHPD issued, but if everyone was issued revolvers, it was more than likely the same one or same frame size. If nothing else cities and departments are cheap and do not want to buy multiple sizes of holsters and other assorted gear to go with the gun.

That is probably one of the biggest reasons Glock won over the LE market, they sold guns to some agencies at a loss, knowing they would make it up in the public market. Well that and some other sales techniques.

[Surplus98]

It just seems like most California Agencies were issued 38s like LAPD, Orange County, and CHP. I know outside CA lots used 357 magnum in the 70s and 80s. Just seemed less common in CA for some reason.

[tom2]

I started (NorCal) when revolvers were issued (early 80s). Mostly the SW model 19 which was .357 rated. Lots carried +p 38 ammo. CHP / San Francisco pd were issued (at the time) SW model 19 and 28s. The latter a heavy duty frame for .357. Can?t say for certain on their ammo issuance.

I recall the old salts (back then) say in the 60s to 70s. Most carried true .38 specials based off of the admin / detectives carrying .38 snubbies. At some point agencies started issuing colt trooper (.357 rated).

Toward the end of the revolver phase, Ruger had their security / speed six model out, competing with the SW 586/686 and Colt diamondback / Python.

Some agencies allowed .357 ammo but it was more difficult to pass range. I carried .357 ammo

Side note: Some agencies had their agency name or initials stamped on the frame of the revolvers. CHP, SFPD, Santa Rosa are some I recall. I believe Beverly Hills did also

It was awhile ago. I was a FNG and didn?t have the knowledge of the ?why? in purchase choice or the policy. Probably much like it?s been - ?we?ve always done it that way? or simply, that the price was right. Fun times

It just seems like most California Agencies were issued 38s like LAPD, Orange County, and CHP. I know outside CA lots used 357 magnum in the 70s and 80s. Just seemed less common in CA for some reason.

[P5Ret]

I think you're being too general.

I also don't think CHP issued guns in .38 only. CHP issued both N frames, and K frames. I've seen in person both a CHP marked model 28, and a model 66. SFPD issued a .41 mag for a short time in the early 70s, it didn't work out too well due to high ammo costs. Remember SF was a very different place then, nowhere near as f%&*ing nuts politically as it is now.

The small SF Bay Area agency I worked at issued a model 66 until 1998. Starting in 1988 a few auto loaders were approved, but we had to buy the gun and gear ourselves. The city didn't purchase and issue until 98 when we got USP 45's.

[Surplus98]

I started (NorCal) when revolvers were issued (early 80s). Mostly the SW model 19 which was .357 rated. Lots carried +p 38 ammo. CHP / San Francisco pd were issued (at the time) SW model 19 and 28s. The latter a heavy duty frame for .357. Can?t say for certain on their ammo issuance.

I recall the old salts (back then) say in the 60s to 70s. Most carried true .38 specials based off of the admin / detectives carrying .38 snubbies. At some point agencies started issuing colt trooper (.357 rated).

Toward the end of the revolver phase, Ruger had their security / speed six model out, competing with the SW 586/686 and Colt diamondback / Python.

Some agencies allowed .357 ammo but it was more difficult to pass range. I carried .357 ammo

Side note: Some agencies had their agency name or initials stamped on the frame of the revolvers. CHP, SFPD, Santa Rosa are some I recall. I believe Beverly Hills did also

It was awhile ago. I was a FNG and didn?t have the knowledge of the ?why? in purchase choice or the policy. Probably much like it?s been - ?we?ve always done it that way? or simply, that the price was right. Fun times

Yea Beverly Hills did (its how I figured out it was Beverly Hills and it came from California and was not allowed to be sold to California residents] then record request confirmed it for certain. I guess because I saw most California revolvers from 70s and 80s that were police issue in .38 I assumed they didn't issue it (though I thought lapd or chp didn't issue it because they thought it was too powerful but I might have mixed it up with a NY police department or read something that was incorrect. So most likely s&w 681 was the or a standard issue gun back in the 80s for BHPD? It was not a small order then?

[Surplus98]

Does anyone know how long they would have issued then? BHPD surplused 7 of them for 100 each in 2022 or 2023, but they wouldn't tell me how long they had this specific one for. That said, I assume it was not issued it's entire life and the city just kept them for a while before getting rid of them, does anyone know what year they would have stopped issuing them? Super longshot I'm sure to be honest.

[M1NM]

They would have bought them new. So figure it out from the date of the serial number. Should get you close. When I worked at a small PD in the late 60s you bought your own gun .357 from an approved list. You got a uniform allowance to buy everything else. They issued 357 (box of 50 to each) but trained with low power 38 wadcutters. They replaced the 357 ammo every year and they had you shoot the old stuff. You should have seen the scores drop by 50+% over the wadcutters.

[Surplus98]

They would have bought them new. So figure it out from the date of the serial number. Should get you close. When I worked at a small PD in the late 60s you bought your own gun .357 from an approved list. You got a uniform allowance to buy everything else. They issued 357 (box of 50 to each) but trained with low power 38 wadcutters. They replaced the 357 ammo every year and they had you shoot the old stuff. You should have seen the scores drop by 50+% over the wadcutters.

They bought it June 1984.

[pacrat]

I think you're being too general.

I also don't think CHP issued guns in .38 only. CHP issued both N frames, and K frames. I've seen in person both a CHP marked model 28, and a model 66. SFPD issued a .41 mag for a short time in the early 70s, it didn't work out too well due to high ammo costs. Remember SF was a very different place then, nowhere near as f%&*ing nuts politically as it is now.

The small SF Bay Area agency I worked at issued a model 66 until 1998. Starting in 1988 a few auto loaders were approved, but we had to buy the gun and gear ourselves. The city didn't purchase and issue until 98 when we got USP 45's.

^^^ PRETTY MUCH SPOT ON ^^^

CHP carried 38 spl revolvers, prior to 357 issuance in mid 1960s. They still carried the pistols, but ammo was issued in 38 spl +P 110 grn HP loads in early 1970s due to several highly publicized incidents of "over penetration" collateral damage [injuries] of the time.

Above info came to me from my attorney, friend, and Ret. CHP Lt. John Kielbasa. Sadly, now deceased.

Same time period, early 70s. LAPD personnel were not allowed to even carry 357 marked guns. Irregardless of the ammo carried. I bought several Md 19s, from guys I knew at the San Pedro station. Who were told to not carry them on duty.

[SDDAVE56]

My academy in 1981, we were issued S&W Mod. 10's. SDSO had S&W Mod. 66's

[Spaffo]

I was issued a used, 1968, S&W model 15 in the LAPD academy in Jan, 1981. They ran out of SS revolvers, so we got turned-in BS ones. Mine had an armory action job and still is smooth as silk.
LAPD allowed privately-purchased .357 S&W revolvers back in the 1960s?, but only allowed . 38 issued duty rounds. Due to officers carrying unauthorized rounds, the .357s were banned. I don't remember the year. We carried .38 +p duty ammo, but were often spot-checked to ensure no hot hand loads. Lol

[jmatt511]

BHPD issued S&W Model 66 in 4" barrels in 1980. Officers could elect to carry other firearms above a 38/9mm as long as they could qualify and provided the weapon, leather and duty/qualification ammo. That practice ended with Chief Snowden.

[jjdeneen918]

Long Beach carried 45 long colts back in the day.
Their range, just up to a few years ago, still stocked the 45LC ammo along with 9mm, 40, & 45.

[Spaffo]

In the early 80s, when booking an arrestee at the 13th floor of LA County General (LASO jail ward), I saw a giant Long Beach motor cop wearing a .45 long colt with a 8?" barrel. Cool as hell. Made my 6" barrel S&W .38 look like a cap gun.