Pop your hood

[MILLITIAof1]

This is why I love my 60's cars(no emissions), but the 20+ sound violations I have gotten kinda suck... Like the old sayin says, if its too loud your too old

[SVT-40]

sounds like destruction of property without a warrant

hmm i guess there is no more 4th amendment if they are allowed to enter your car to check for lights and signals and happen to find something else after smelling something

Not so. Remember the 4th amendment guards against UNREASONABLE searches and seizures. Not ALL searches or inspections. So if you don't want to be the possible subject of ANY search or inspection regarding a vehicle.....

Easy solution. Don't own one.

If you do though you must abide by the law and have your vehicle equipped per the vehicle code.

If you alter your vehicle so it is not in compliance with the law then you are inviting an inspection. If you have anything else in your car which could lead officer to believe there is contraband or illegal items there, It is you who are allowing the search by your actions.

In other words take responsibility for your actions, and what fines or issues come from these actions. Don't pass the blame to LEO's as "violating your 4th amendment rights"



There is no requirement to obtain a warrant, to as you said " destroy " property. If during a legal stop the subject you are checking impedes your legal efforts to inspect or search. You can use reasonable force to overcome or negate his resistance.

Or for officers safety.

As in you stop someone and they tell you they have needles in their pockets. You would not let them reach into their pocket, and you certainly would not reach in also. Using scissors to cut the pocket open is considered very reasonable.

Remember officers are only reacting to the behavior of the subjects they stop.

In the case of the hood pin locks. If the officer believed the driver was lying about the lock combination it could be reasonable to remove them (cut them) AFTER giving the driver ample opportunity to remove them themselves.

If the same car was stopped and the driver was a middle aged woman who told the officer the car was her sons car, then the officer could reasonably assume the woman would not have the combo, and thus would not have reason to cut the locks.

[Lyte-]

Basically this stuff got heated up when the "fast and furious" crowd got heated up and street racing started getting more organized and public with a gangsta look. Essentially you can be hassled for a "safety" check or "compliance" check for smog if they want to. It's legal for them to request it, and denial will get you impounded. Its "the game" and both sides play it.

It got so bad I heard of people just with GReddy stickers on stock camry's were getting heated up and inspected. I am sure it still goes on, but I have heard less of it lately, perhaps because I am not really in the street scene anymore. However they can infraction you for a cold air intake if they want to. Even I have heard of people getting a ticket when the CAI has a CARB sticker on it.
.

I recieved a smog ref ticket a couple years back in my honda.

I had all CARB legal items on my car with the appropriate numbers and information with me in the car.

I had to pay for the smog ref to inspect my car and I went to court, All charges were dismissed and I filed an complaint against the officer as I felt he only gave me the ticket because I was black. I suppied the officer with the appropriate paperwork at the time I was pulled over and he still choose to give me the ticket.

[Lyte-]

That's one of the many reasons ALL our units had a nice big pair of bolt cutters in each trunk. Never had to use them on hood locks though. But I imagine they would cut them like a hot knife through butter.

And if you looked under the hood and find no equipment violations what would be my recourse seeing that you just imobilized my car for no reason???

I was stopped once in my boyfriend car which had hood locks because of theives and I did not have the keys to the hood. I explained that to the officer and let him search my keys. He said he could cut the locks I then asked him how would I get home with out being able to secure the hood because he removed what was securing it, he opted not to cut the locks.

[Ron-Solo]

I recieved a smog ref ticket a couple years back in my honda.

I had all CARB legal items on my car with the appropriate numbers and information with me in the car.

I had to pay for the smog ref to inspect my car and I went to court, All charges were dismissed and I filed an complaint against the officer as I felt he only gave me the ticket because I was black. I suppied the officer with the appropriate paperwork at the time I was pulled over and he still choose to give me the ticket.

This forum is for non-law enforcement to ask questions, not relate their personal horror stories that are not appropriate for this forum. If you have a question, please ask it in a civil manner and we will be happy to try and give you accurate information related to your question. Please review the sticky on the rules for his forum. Thanks.

[Ron-Solo]

And if you looked under the hood and find no equipment violations what would be my recourse seeing that you just imobilized my car for no reason???

I was stopped once in my boyfriend car which had hood locks because of theives and I did not have the keys to the hood. I explained that to the officer and let him search my keys. He said he could cut the locks I then asked him how would I get home with out being able to secure the hood because he removed what was securing it, he opted not to cut the locks.

Lyte,

To answer your question, previous posts have indicated what they legally "could" do, not necessarily what they "would" do when faced with someone who refused to comply with a lawful request. Most officers try to apply common sense to the equation.

[Lyte-]

Okay officer

[Kestryll]

This forum is for non-law enforcement to ask questions, not relate their personal horror stories that are not appropriate for this forum. If you have a question, please ask it in a civil manner and we will be happy to try and give you accurate information related to your question. Please review the sticky on the rules for his forum. Thanks.

You're taking too narrow a view of the rules.
There is nothing wrong with her post, it is even in keeping with the topic of the thread given that it is a reply to a post addressing the issue.

[bohoki]

If the same car was stopped and the driver was a middle aged woman who told the officer the car was her sons car, then the officer could reasonably assume the woman would not have the combo, and thus would not have reason to cut the locks.

what? if the officer thinks their are illegal engine modifications and believes the person doesn't have the combo they wont cut it off but if they think they know the combination they will cut them off

is that what you just said?

wow

[Lyte-]

Lyte,

To answer your question, previous posts have indicated what they legally "could" do, not necessarily what they "would" do when faced with someone who refused to comply with a lawful request. Most officers try to apply common sense to the equation.

I understand that as the officer opted not to do so...

But there may be a time that an officer chooses to cut the hood locks and he will find nothing illegal under the hood.

What would be my recourse at that time as the car would be rendered in operateable as I would no longer be able to secure the hood

[Kestryll]

In the case of the hood pin locks. If the officer believed the driver was lying about the lock combination it could be reasonable to remove them (cut them) AFTER giving the driver ample opportunity to remove them themselves.

If the same car was stopped and the driver was a middle aged woman who told the officer the car was her sons car, then the officer could reasonably assume the woman would not have the combo, and thus would not have reason to cut the locks.

This sounds a bit dicey, so profiling by gender and age is cool but race is not?

While I understand officer discretion this sounds a bit too subjective to me.
Whether or not you destroy my property under color of authority depends on my age, gender and if you think I'm lying?

I suspect there is more to this then was initially typed.

[Ron-Solo]

I understand that as the officer opted not to do so...

But there may be a time that an officer chooses to cut the hood locks and he will find nothing illegal under the hood.

What would be my recourse at that time as the car would be rendered in operateable as I would no longer be able to secure the hood

I wish I could give you a hard and fast answer to that, but there really isn't one. If it were me, I'd assist in securing the hood so it was safe to drive. I always carry things like small lengths of wire, zip ties, etc in my patrol bag along with a few basic tools (screwdrives, pliers, crescent wrench, etc) that may come in handy during the shift for a variety of reasons. I've had to cut locks off gates during suspect searches and wanted to leave it somewhat secured when done. Not perfect solution, but it helps.

[Lyte-]

It does but he brings me to another question.

What if the officer who for example cut the locks and refuses to secure it and left??

I am not trying to be difficult just wondering.

[1911su16b870]

I do not believe an officer would be allowed to cut the hood locks of a pulled over vehicle with out a warrant.

But I could see the officer arresting the driver for PC148 for impeding a VC 2804/2806 inspection, which would result in the car being impounded until a warrant was issued...

[Ron-Solo]

It does but he brings me to another question.

What if the officer who for example cut the locks and refuses to secure it and left??

I am not trying to be difficult just wondering.

In my opinion, you would have a valid personnel complaint against the officer and could possibly file a civil claim to re-imburse you for the costs associated with getting your car operational. While you can file a claim, it doesn't mean you would automatically collect. There are a lot of variables that come into play.

To avoid such a situation, my personal recommendation is to make sure there is always a set of keys in the car, even if you really don't want them looking. If they have PC, and want to look bad enough, they can cut the locks. Also, should you develop mechanical problems on the road somewhere, you're going to need access for the auto club or whatever tow or friend comes to assist.

Ron