Any other ranges having issues

[Spec]

So I work out mobile range once a week. For the last 6 months we have been having issues with Winclean ammo.

At least 1 round out of the box fails to fire. This is a particular problem with the M&P. On some boxes it can be as many as 4 rounds.

There is a solid hit on the primer but the round fails to go off. When I spoke with the guys at our main range they told me it may be the age of the ammo (I doubt it since most of this stuff is fresh) or the primers MAY have been outsourced (read made in China ).

I know the issue is so bad we are transitioning to a new manufacture for practice and duty ammo.

At least everyone in the range is getting practice with "tap, invert, rack" drills.

Anyone else having issues?

[REDHORSE]

Los Angeles Sheriffs are having a lot of misfires with Winclean ammo for practice range ammo.

They used to buy the practice range ammo every 6 months, misfires were a less common issue.

When they went to buying ammo once a year to save in costs, the number of misfires have increased... perhaps the ammo primers aging out vs. buying it in fresher smaller batches a couple times a year.

They're switching to a different mfg of range/practice ammo.

Winchester Winclean primers have a shorter shelf life.

[1911su16b870]

Yes, sometimes the Winclean 45ACP will give you a training opportunity with a primer that does not ignite the powder charge. Tap, Rack and Roll!

I think our issue is small pistol primers in a 45ACP case. I have not yet found one which fails to ignite on a second primer strike.

As all ammo, sometimes a case can get torn and that round placed in the box. As always, inspect each and every round as you load your magazines.

[SoCalDep]

I've seen it with other agencies' Winclean as well. Let's just say I'm happy to see the switch.

[Ron-Solo]

I had it happen during my HR218 quail at BC. Range staff said its some of the older winclean stuff from older stock. He said after 5 years or so the primers go south.

Had it happen with both 9mm and .38 Special.

[micro911]

LASD is now using CCI TMJ ammo for training, and they said they had no issues with it any more.

[emvampyre]

LASD is now using CCI TMJ ammo for training, and they said they had no issues with it any more.

Hope it makes it to CJ's mobile range next month. Got 4 tap-invert-racks Thursday night with some .45.

[Ron-Solo]

Well, my guess is the Department is going to use up all the WinClean ammo before mass disbursement of any new ammo.

Prior to 2008, we could buy the WinClean training ammo by the 500 round case for a very reasonable price. I bought a bunch over a period of a year when I had extra cash. Just about run thru my supply without any incidents of failure.

[j-shot]

Yes, sometimes the Winclean 45ACP will give you a training opportunity with a primer that does not ignite the powder charge. Tap, Rack and Roll!

I think our issue is small pistol primers in a 45ACP case. I have not yet found one which fails to ignite on a second primer strike.

As all ammo, sometimes a case can get torn and that round placed in the box. As always, inspect each and every round as you load your magazines.

Hope it makes it to CJ's mobile range next month. Got 4 tap-invert-racks Thursday night with some .45.

Wow police are carrying .45s now? I thought it was 9mm or 40sw?

[deadcoyote]

We use umc 165 grain for our range ammo, about 30k a year. Probably one in 200 has the primer in backwards. It's been this way for years.

[stormvet]

I had it happen during my HR218 quail at BC. Range staff said its some of the older winclean stuff from older stock. He said after 5 years or so the primers go south.

Had it happen with both 9mm and .38 Special.

Really makes me wonder about duty ammo, I know the quality is better but still.
We always qualified with our duty ammo, never any bad rounds with Speer Gold Dot.
On the same note, last Friday I shot some 357 rounds I reloaded way back in 1997. Not one bad round, I guess quality is not what it use to be.

[SoCalDep]

Really makes me wonder about duty ammo, I know the quality is better but still.
We always qualified with our duty ammo, never any bad rounds with Speer Gold Dot.
On the same note, last Friday I shot some 357 rounds I reloaded way back in 1997. Not one bad round, I guess quality is not what it use to be.

Generally duty ammo is good to go. We shoot old duty ammo all the time and use it when we suspect ammo (such as the aforementioned Winchester) to be causing malfunctions. I have personally seen a couple cracked cases, so I still recommend a visual inspection of all rounds you're loading into magazines.

I do really like the Federal HST and I'm glad it's now authorized. I still have Ranger-T in some backup mags but my primary stuff is all HST.

[Ron-Solo]

I wouldn't worry too much about the duty ammo. The ammo in question is the Wincherter "WinClean" which is designed to use in indoor ranges because it is. Total metal jacket and uses a "nontoxic" primer. It is these primers that are failing.

Wow police are carrying .45s now? I thought it was 9mm or 40sw?

LASD authorizes 9mm and .45 ACP for duty use and .38 Special for off duty and backup use. No .40S&W for LASD.

[micro911]

Well, my guess is the Department is going to use up all the WinClean ammo before mass disbursement of any new ammo.

Prior to 2008, we could buy the WinClean training ammo by the 500 round case for a very reasonable price. I bought a bunch over a period of a year when I had extra cash. Just about run thru my supply without any incidents of failure.

They told me that they also sent back 700,000 rounds of Winchester 9mm 124 grain FMJ white box ammo due to malfunction problem. They said they had zero issues when they switched to the TMJ ammo. I saw a pulled bullets, and the TMJ bullet looked like FMJ. It looks like it was a quality bullet.

[TrailerparkTrash]

I had it happen during my HR218 quail at BC. Range staff said its some of the older winclean stuff from older stock. He said after 5 years or so the primers go south.

Had it happen with both 9mm and .38 Special.

It's so bizarre that I still have some surplus .45ACP ammo that I inherited from my dad, who bought it in the 80's and it worked just fine back then. The ammo is stamped "50" on it for "1950."

Fast forward today and when I shot about 60 rounds from the batch months ago, it too all went BANG.

Evidently The old adage of "they don't make 'em like they used to," is so true.