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Princeton University Professor Advocates Broad "Peace of the Community" Legal Theory

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  • AlmostHeaven
    Veteran Member
    • Apr 2023
    • 3808

    Princeton University Professor Advocates Broad "Peace of the Community" Legal Theory

    Princeton University Professor in the History of American Law and Liberty Laura Edwards has crafted one of the most far-reaching constitutional law theories yet, arguing that peace of the community takes precedence over individual rights regarding the owning, carrying, and usage of guns.



    The devolution of authority to local jurisdictions was purposeful. The U.S. Constitution placed most matters involving the public order with states, which governed them through their police powers. States, in turn, left authority over many of these issues with local areas - counties, municipalities, and even more local jurisdictions, such as townships. In so doing, states affirmed longstanding practice, dating back to the colonial era, that allowed local authority over issues that were considered, by their very nature, to be local. The problems of cities were not those of rural areas. Places near the coast were different than those situated inland. The variety within states was endless, and people expected to address the issues facing their particular communities themselves.

    Those issues involved anything and everything relating to the health, safety, and welfare of the public. Included were: the regulation of markets, including their location and days and hours of operation; the maintenance of basic infrastructure, such as roads and bridges; health measures, such as quarantines to stop the spread of disease and the oversight of businesses with known health hazards, such as butchering; and the provision of welfare for the orphaned, aged, and infirm. But the power of local jurisdictions extended even further than this already incomplete list suggests because the maintenance of the public order involved an open-ended charge to tend to the "peace," which covered anything that undermined the collective wellbeing of the community.
    The peace of the community took precedence over individual rights. It was not that rights did not matter. Local officials upheld procedural rights. But the rights that now take center stage in our legal order - those in the federal and state bills of rights, for instance - remained subordinate to matters involving the peace. Even property rights had limited power. What people could do with their property depended on the implications for others and the public order more generally. In this area of law, authority came with obligations. When it was abused, local officials could and did intervene to uphold the community's interests.

    Offenses against the peace resulted in a significant loss of personal freedom. While the penalties depended on the nature of the charge, those convicted of general offenses against the peace generally had to post a peace bond or, if lacking funds, find others willing to do it. Bonds came with responsibility and risk: those entering into these agreements lost their money if the offender violated the peace in any way again. As such, bond holders acquired broad authority over the offender's life. In many states, offenders who could not provide a bond were sold off to the highest bidder and forced to work off their fines.

    Local officials assessed the threat level of specific peace-threatening behavior, based on what they knew of those involved. But weapons were, by definition, threatening to the public order. People with weapons were more dangerous than people without them. Brandishing or even just displaying weapons for no obvious reason was a threat. Bringing weapons to any kind of social interaction was a threat. The presence of weapons at an incident raised the seriousness of the offense when violence or even just threatening behavior was involved. Unknown people carrying weapons were most definitely threatening. At this time, weapons were more likely to be knives and clubs, which were more available and more reliable than guns. But the legal principles that regulated all threats to the public order could and did extend to guns, when they were present. In the legal logic of the peace, the right of any individual to own, carry, and use guns could never take priority over the peace of the community.
    This is so authoritarian and tyrannical as to totally depart from the boundaries of American ideals. Elite universities truly have become Marxist institutions. Someone such as Mark W. Smith of The Four Boxes Diner ought to make a video on this essay to bring awareness to what kind of ideas Ivy League professors now advocate.
    Last edited by AlmostHeaven; 07-26-2023, 11:00 AM. Reason: Fixed question mark character substitutions
    A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.

    The Second Amendment makes us citizens, not subjects. All other enumerated rights are meaningless without gun rights.
  • #2
    ritter
    Senior Member
    • May 2011
    • 805

    These folk need to remember that if this theory is true, it also applies to voting, free speech, freedom of religion, etc. This very theory is what supported racist laws. This very theory is what supported only property owning white men as true citizens with rights. This very theory would support any law, based entirely on fear.

    Comment

    • #3
      gumby
      Senior Member
      • Aug 2007
      • 2322

      Those that can, do. Those that can't, teach. If, you can't handle the real world, go into academia.

      Comment

      • #4
        Rickybillegas
        Senior Member
        • Nov 2022
        • 1527

        Here's the problem with her analysis in my opinion:

        I don't doubt she may be historically correct that all kinds of laws, local and at the state level were imposed in the interest of the 'public good" as interpreted by whomever. Her entire argument rests upon her knowledge of history. However, there were also horrible, racist and myriad unconstitutional laws imposed in various districts.

        None, or few of them were vetted under the constitution of the Untied States until they made it to the Supreme court if they did. They were tolerated until they met litigation and were either deemed constitutional or not by the local or state courts, or they reached the USSC. So is she saying just because they had these laws they were legitimate, even the racist and discriminatory laws like Jim Crow? We could have a 1,200 page book on the history of laws in the U.S. many of them good, many of them horrible. That they existed does not deem them legitimate.

        That's why we have a bill of rights and that's why we have a USSC to safeguard individual and collective rights against the kind of laws she's talking about.

        So, she says the constitution left most matters to the states and local authorities. Fine, true as far as it goes, but not to the bill of rights.
        Those supersede any supposed and transient 'public good'.
        The bill of rights is simply not subservient to the 'public good' upon which her
        entire thesis rest on.

        "The peace of the community took precedence over individual rights"
        So that makes them ok? I think not. Nice try.

        Comment

        • #5
          Dan_Eastvale
          Calguns Addict
          • Apr 2013
          • 9152

          That article is correct from a historical standpoint.

          Gun rights were governed by localities

          The wild west towns often banned carrying of guns in town. Dodge City, et al.

          Visitors had to turn them in to the Sherriff or Marshal

          Our past did not consider the violation of the 2A in several instances.

          Comment

          • #6
            Elgatodeacero
            Senior Member
            • Apr 2015
            • 1279

            Those wild west towns were in Territories, not states, and so they are not relevant to a Constitutional analysis.

            Comment

            • #7
              AlmostHeaven
              Veteran Member
              • Apr 2023
              • 3808

              I know the argument the professor has presented will go nowhere in court, but I am nonetheless surprised by how unbounded of a legal approach she has endorsed or at least legitimized.

              The "peace of the community" standard would quite literally allow local governments to exercise unlimited powers by reducing every constitutional right down to a sort of rational basis review.
              A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.

              The Second Amendment makes us citizens, not subjects. All other enumerated rights are meaningless without gun rights.

              Comment

              • #8
                Epaphroditus
                Veteran Member
                • Sep 2013
                • 4888

                Powers not enumerated are retained by the states and the people. This is the basic justification for police powers being local (also clearly shows there is no constitutional basis for any federal law enforcement).

                The ultimate police power lays in the hands of the militia. History and tradition from old England has a sheriff as a local police empowered official (but there is no constitutional basis for a sheriff) and typically when the sheriff needed additional manpower the local militia was formed into a posse.

                So long as the local sheriff is an elected position I support such a system.

                That the state has usurped the police power of the militia is a sad state of affairs that needs rectification.

                The "peace of the community" rests solidly on the shoulders of the people. When the people get too "uppity" for the comfort of the powered elite bad things happen but this is the abuse of power by the elites not a fault of the "uppity" people.
                CA firearms laws timeline BLM land maps

                Comment

                • #9
                  BobB35
                  Senior Member
                  • Nov 2008
                  • 782

                  Originally posted by Dan_Eastvale
                  That article is correct from a historical standpoint.

                  Gun rights were governed by localities

                  The wild west towns often banned carrying of guns in town. Dodge City, et al.

                  Visitors had to turn them in to the Sherriff or Marshal

                  Our past did not consider the violation of the 2A in several instances.
                  When those were passed on local ordinance there was very little challenging of laws based on the Bill of Rights. so none were. Just because in the past there were unconstitutional laws passed, doesn't mean they are right.

                  Look at the CCW map and all the states that had no right to carry pre 1986 Why do you think that flipped? IMO it had something to do with the SCOTUS ruling the police don't have to protect you (Warren v DC 1981) and people waking up and realizing they are on their own and wow this is a dangerous world. Something people knew back in the 1870s and 80s

                  I would say we have had more rulings on the 2A and what it is defined as in the last 20 years than we had in the previous 200. It didn't become an issue until the 70s when they started to try to ban and control everything.

                  Comment

                  • #10
                    Tarmy
                    CGN/CGSSA Contributor - Lifetime
                    CGN Contributor - Lifetime
                    • Feb 2016
                    • 3664

                    This clown needs to go find a nice communist or socialist country to live in. He can take his damn theory with him and see how it flies in a craphole without a Constitution.
                    Wilson Protector .45, Springer 9mm Loaded, Franchi Instinct SL .12ga. and some other cool stuff for the kiddos...

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                    • #11
                      nick
                      CGN/CGSSA Contributor
                      CGN Contributor
                      • Aug 2008
                      • 19143

                      "Professor in the History of American Law and Liberty"

                      I don't see how she could qualify for that position in a world that hasn't gone mad.
                      DiaHero Foundation - helping people manage diabetes. Sending diabetes supplies to Ukraine now, any help is appreciated.

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                      • #12
                        nick
                        CGN/CGSSA Contributor
                        CGN Contributor
                        • Aug 2008
                        • 19143

                        Originally posted by Dan_Eastvale
                        That article is correct from a historical standpoint.

                        Gun rights were governed by localities

                        The wild west towns often banned carrying of guns in town. Dodge City, et al.

                        Visitors had to turn them in to the Sherriff or Marshal

                        Our past did not consider the violation of the 2A in several instances.
                        Then we got the 14th Amendment.
                        DiaHero Foundation - helping people manage diabetes. Sending diabetes supplies to Ukraine now, any help is appreciated.

                        DDR AK furniture and Norinco M14 parts kit: https://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/....php?t=1756292
                        sigpic

                        Comment

                        • #13
                          Foothills
                          Senior Member
                          • Feb 2014
                          • 918

                          Yup

                          Originally posted by nick
                          Then we got the 14th Amendment.
                          This Prof sounds like they prefer the days of Cruikshank before the 2nd was incorporated via the 14th.
                          CRPA Member

                          Comment

                          • #14
                            AlmostHeaven
                            Veteran Member
                            • Apr 2023
                            • 3808

                            Originally posted by nick
                            "Professor in the History of American Law and Liberty"

                            I don't see how she could qualify for that position in a world that hasn't gone mad.
                            The irony certainly should make inquiring minds question the accuracy of any of the American history taught at modern higher education institutions.
                            A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.

                            The Second Amendment makes us citizens, not subjects. All other enumerated rights are meaningless without gun rights.

                            Comment

                            • #15
                              M76
                              Calguns Addict
                              • Apr 2014
                              • 5954

                              Pure sugar-coated totalitarianism

                              The left will gobble this up like a fat kid eats cake!
                              sigpic
                              Originally posted by dunndeal
                              Stop digging.
                              Originally posted by BrassCase
                              I only buy fireworks from Three Finger Willie over at One Eyed Jack's Fireworks.
                              iTrader

                              https://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/....php?t=1884858

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