Disassembled. Hicap magazines

[mdhaas]

Am I allowed legally to possess all the parts for a 30 round magazine if the floor plate, spring & follower are removed from the body? In effect, have all the parts together in a bag, but disassembled? The idea is to assemble when outside of California & then disassemble when returning.

[foothillman]

no
need to move...https://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/...play.php?f=349

Sticky: 🚩LAW: FAQ - read before posting a new question

Magazines: modification, parts, transfer
Transfer of large-capacity magazines in California is permitted only when the receiver is exempt from the large-capacity magazine law - principally Law Enforcement Officers.

It is no longer legal to disassemble a large-capacity magazine into parts, and transfer the 'kit' of parts.

In short, as of 2014 the law appears to forbid

buying parts kits
selling or offering to sell parts kits
importing parts kits, including moving to California
transferring parts kits


It remains legal to modify a large-capacity magazine to 10 rounds or fewer. The requirement is 'permanent' modification, but there is no clear guidance on the minimum acceptable change that becomes 'permanent'.
Last edited by Librarian; 03-05-2014 at 3:45 PM..

[bruss01]

This requires some clarification.

Since 2014 it has been illegal to purchase lcm's as a "kit" that contains all the parts of a magazine that, once assembled, will comprise a magazine holding 11 or more rounds.

So foothillman's response is correct in this regard.

There is no prohibition on replacement parts for magazines that were legally obtained,

In fact, if you own a 12 round magazine that you obtained legally during Freedom Week, there is no legal reason you cannot obtain 3 replacement mag bodies from vendor A, 3 floorplates from vendor B, 3 followers from vendor C and 3 springs from vendor D.

Two things you CANNOT do within legal limits:

1 - you cannot obtain them in "kit" form, bundled together.
2 - you cannot assemble those discreet parts into functional magazines holding 11 or more rounds, except during some legal "window of opportunity" such as Freedom Week, unless you are repairing a legally obtained lcm.

Someone may ask about how a violation of either of those would be prosecuted. In the first case a bill of sale listing the "kit" and date of sale may be sufficient evidence upon which to prosecute. The second case would pose a taller challenge for prosecution, as the prosecutor would need to be able to prove when/where the parts were obtained and under what circumstances they came to be assembled.

Numerous of us obtained mag kits and blocked magazines while they were legal, and assembled/unblocked them during Freedom Week once that opportunity finally materialized. This is 100% legal under CA law. A prosecutor would likely be facing an insurmountable obstacle trying to "prove" a given magazine was obtained or assembled illegally, given that if a lcm magazine legally obtained during FW had the mag body damaged, it is perfectly legal to obtain a new replacement mag body to repair a legally obtained lcm.

If you happen to have your magazine replacement parts which you legally obtained all in the same ziplock bag in your home... there is nothing explicitly prohibiting that in CA law, at least to my knowledge.

The question about entering the state with a full compliment of "parts" is less clear. If you obtained the LCM legally, then it is legal for you to obtain and possess replacement parts to repair those lcm's. Whether it is expressly legal to cross the state line while in possession of that full set of parts, even if legally obtained inside CA, is likely something that would need to be worked out in the courts. It is probably safer to mail yourself the mag body separately if one wants to be certain to avoid potential problems when re-entering CA. Just another inconvenience that our state legislators have heaped upon law-abiding CA gun owner's heads.

One should also bear in mind that even though possession of legally obtained lcm's is legal, they are considered a "nuisance" and subject to confiscation on sight. Additionally, one cannot count on CHP to be conversant in the finer nuances of the byzantine maze that CA gun law has become. The cost and inconvenience of mailing one's self the mag bodies on return trips is inconsequential compared to the cost and inconvenience of a legal battle if the authorities don't see things your way. Maybe keeping at least one 10-or-under mag for errands out of the state is a reasonable compromise between convenience and safety?

In closing, I am not a lawyer, specifically I an not YOUR lawyer, the foregoing does NOT constitute legal advice, any similarities to actual legal advice are purely coincidental and should be disregarded with extreme prejudice.

[AlmostHeaven]

This requires some clarification.

Since 2014 it has been illegal to purchase lcm's as a "kit" that contains all the parts of a magazine that, once assembled, will comprise a magazine holding 11 or more rounds.

So foothillman's response is correct in this regard.

There is no prohibition on replacement parts for magazines that were legally obtained,

In fact, if you own a 12 round magazine that you obtained legally during Freedom Week, there is no legal reason you cannot obtain 3 replacement mag bodies from vendor A, 3 floorplates from vendor B, 3 followers from vendor C and 3 springs from vendor D.

Two things you CANNOT do within legal limits:

1 - you cannot obtain them in "kit" form, bundled together.
2 - you cannot assemble those discrete parts into functional magazines holding 11 or more rounds, except during some legal "window of opportunity" such as Freedom Week, unless you are repairing a legally obtained lcm.

Someone may ask about how a violation of either of those would be prosecuted. In the first case a bill of sale listing the "kit" and date of sale may be sufficient evidence upon which to prosecute. The second case would pose a taller challenge for prosecution, as the prosecutor would need to be able to prove when/where the parts were obtained and under what circumstances they came to be assembled.

Numerous of us obtained mag kits and blocked magazines while they were legal, and assembled/unblocked them during Freedom Week once that opportunity finally materialized. This is 100% legal under CA law. A prosecutor would likely be facing an insurmountable obstacle trying to "prove" a given magazine was obtained or assembled illegally, given that if a lcm magazine legally obtained during FW had the mag body damaged, it is perfectly legal to obtain a new replacement mag body to repair a legally obtained lcm.

If you happen to have your magazine replacement parts which you legally obtained all in the same ziplock bag in your home... there is nothing explicitly prohibiting that in CA law, at least to my knowledge.

The question about entering the state with a full compliment of "parts" is less clear. If you obtained the LCM legally, then it is legal for you to obtain and possess replacement parts to repair those lcm's. Whether it is expressly legal to cross the state line while in possession of that full set of parts, even if legally obtained inside CA, is likely something that would need to be worked out in the courts. It is probably safer to mail yourself the mag body separately if one wants to be certain to avoid potential problems when re-entering CA. Just another inconvenience that our state legislators have heaped upon law-abiding CA gun owner's heads.

One should also bear in mind that even though possession of legally obtained lcm's is legal, they are considered a "nuisance" and subject to confiscation on sight. Additionally, one cannot count on CHP to be conversant in the finer nuances of the byzantine maze that CA gun law has become. The cost and inconvenience of mailing one's self the mag bodies on return trips is inconsequential compared to the cost and inconvenience of a legal battle if the authorities don't see things your way. Maybe keeping at least one 10-or-under mag for errands out of the state is a reasonable compromise between convenience and safety?

In closing, I am not a lawyer, specifically I an not YOUR lawyer, the foregoing does NOT constitute legal advice, any similarities to actual legal advice are purely coincidental and should be disregarded with extreme prejudice.

I tried thinking of anything to add but could not. The original poster should carefully read the above passage twice.

[Quiet]

Am I allowed legally to possess all the parts for a 30 round magazine if the floor plate, spring & follower are removed from the body? In effect, have all the parts together in a bag, but disassembled? The idea is to assemble when outside of California & then disassemble when returning.

If you legally possessed those parts in CA, then you can still legally possess them in CA.

Starting 01-01-2014; it is illegal to make, import, advertise for sale, or transfer "large capacity magazine conversion kits" in CA. [PC 32311(a)]

Which means once you take those parts outside of CA, it is illegal to bring them back to CA.

While outside of CA, you can use those parts to make a permanently altered 10 round magazine [PC 16740(a)] and legally bring that permanently altered 10 round magazine to CA.




Penal Code 32311
(a) Except as provided in Article 2 (commencing with Section 32400) of this chapter and in Chapter 1 (commencing with Section 17700) of Division 2 of Title 2, commencing January 1, 2014, any person in this state who knowingly manufactures or causes to be manufactured, imports into the state, keeps for sale, or offers or exposes for sale, or who gives, lends, buys, or receives any large capacity magazine conversion kit is punishable by a fine of not more than one thousand dollars ($1,000) or imprisonment in a county jail not to exceed six months, or by both that fine and imprisonment. This section does not apply to a fully assembled large-capacity magazine, which is governed by Section 32310.
(b) For purposes of this section, a "large capacity magazine conversion kit" is a device or combination of parts of a fully functioning large-capacity magazine, including, but not limited to, the body, spring, follower, and floor plate or end plate, capable of converting an ammunition feeding device into a large-capacity magazine.

Penal Code 32310
(a) Except as provided in Article 2 (commencing with Section 32400) of this chapter and in Chapter 1 (commencing with Section 17700) of Division 2 of Title 2, any person in this state who manufactures or causes to be manufactured, imports into the state, keeps for sale, or offers or exposes for sale, or who gives, lends, buys, or receives any large-capacity magazine is punishable by imprisonment in a county jail not exceeding one year or imprisonment pursuant to subdivision (h) of Section 1170.
(b) For purposes of this section, "manufacturing" includes both fabricating a magazine and assembling a magazine from a combination of parts, including, but not limited to, the body, spring, follower, and floor plate or end plate, to be a fully functioning large-capacity magazine.

Penal Code 16740
As used in this part, "large-capacity magazine" means any ammunition feeding device with the capacity to accept more than 10 rounds, but shall not be construed to include any of the following:
(a) A feeding device that has been permanently altered so that it cannot accommodate more than 10 rounds.