Soft sided lockable "sack" legal for transport in CA?

[barbasol]

Knowing I need to transport a handgun in a locked container while in a vehicle, any thoughts on this lockable "sack" or bag. Obviously the firearm would not be loaded. In this case, a revolver with ammo not in the bag but a semi with loaded mags not inserted should be fine too, correct? What do you think about the fact that you could grip and pull the trigger of saig bag, knowing that the firearm could not be loaded?

Link to sack below

https://www.amazon.com/Master-Lock-Lockout-XX-Large-Diameter/dp/B007NAGF40/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1466745016&sr=8-1&keywords=Lockable+sack

[Librarian]

So, the law on transport says

16850.
As used in this part, “locked container” means a secure container that is fully enclosed and locked by a padlock, keylock, combination lock, or similar locking device. The term “locked container” does not include the utility or glove compartment of a motor vehicle.

and, as we often see, there is no guidance - none at all - on what 'secure' might mean in this section.

This might technically meet the definition.

But

What do you think about the fact that you could grip and pull the trigger of saig bag, knowing that the firearm could not be loaded?

suggests to me that I, personally, would pick something else.

[BKinzey]

I'd guess it would be legal but I have no idea why you'd want to use that.

I'm also certain you could load most semis in that bag.

[P5Ret]

Why not just use something that is actually going to provide some protection for your gun, from getting bounced around in the car? Proper tool for the job type of thing.

I'd be willing to bet that this is not as secure as it seem in the picture. It is designed to go over electrical connections, and have the conduit or cable sticking out the top of the bag. The cinch locking strap will not securely close the entire bag, and you may be able to get your hand in despite it being locked.

[Jeepergeo]

OP....I see where you are going with this and can appreciate the reasons...BUT, the lack of definition of what "secure" means suggests it may be a risky approach.

I will stick with my Pelican case or purpose made soft cases with locks.

[billofrights]

L.A. Policegear typically sells on their site a pistol bag with slots for 5 magazines and a zippered compartment for the pistol, with lockable zippers on the outside, for $10. Why spend twice that for just a big sack?

http://www.lapolicegear.com/moc-diplomat-pistol-case.html

Not associate with them, but I've bought several of these and they're great.

[Chewy65]

I don't recall the penal code section, but Librarian knows it, that makes possession of a camouflaging firearm container illegal. It isn't clear what one is, but some think a container that permits the firing of the gun while encased would be one. Try PC 12020 (a) (1).

[Subotai]

I don't recall the penal code section, but Librarian knows it, that makes a gun case illegal if it disguises a gun, by which I mean it hides the fact that a gun is inside but allows it to be fired.

Bingo. If the weapon can be manipulated into firing.

[Quiet]

I don't recall the penal code section, but Librarian knows it, that makes a gun case illegal if it disguises a gun, by which I mean it hides the fact that a gun is inside but allows it to be fired.

It's the "camouflaging firearm container" [PC 16320] laws. [PC 24310]



Penal Code 16320
(a) As used in this part, "camouflaging firearm container" means a container that meets all of the following criteria:
(1) It is designed and intended to enclose a firearm.
(2) It is designed and intended to allow the firing of the enclosed firearm by external controls while the firearm is in the container.
(3) It is not readily recognizable as containing a firearm.
(b) "Camouflaging firearm container" does not include any camouflaging covering used while engaged in lawful hunting or while going to or returning from a lawful hunting expedition.

Penal Code 24310
Except as provided in Chapter 1 (commencing with Section 17700) of Division 2 of Title 2, any person in this state who manufactures or causes to be manufactured, imports into the state, keeps for sale, or offers or exposes for sale, or who gives, lends, or possesses any camouflaging firearm container is punishable by imprisonment in a county jail not exceeding one year or imprisonment pursuant to subdivision (h) of Section 1170.

[Chewy65]

It is questionable whether or not the locked sack was designed to enclose a firearm. More importantly is the question of whether it was designed and intended to allow the firing of the enclosed firearm by external controls while the firearm is in the container.

I doubt that pulling the trigger by pushing the sack material against the trigger involves an "external control" but I would rather neither risk being charged with violating 24310 as the use of such a sack does seem to violate the spirit of that code section.

[edgerly779]

Quiet missed #2 part. Container is not designed to allow firing of firearm while in container.

[P5Ret]

It is questionable whether or not the locked sack was designed to enclose a firearm. More importantly is the question of whether it was designed and intended to allow the firing of the enclosed firearm by external controls while the firearm is in the container.

I doubt that pulling the trigger by pushing the sack material against the trigger involves an "external control" but I would rather neither risk being charged with violating 24310 as the use of such a sack does seem to violate the spirit of that code section.

That's a stretch since it doesn't meet 2 of the 3 criteria outlined in the code section. If it was "spirit of the law" type of thinking that went into this section, I don't think it would have been written so specifically with 3 criteria that have to be met to trigger a violation.

[glockman19]

I use Allen Locking soft cases to transport my handguns. you can NOT shoot the firearm within the case and the lock is on the zipper.

It meets all of the regulatory requirements.

[barbasol]

Thanks all for the replies. I should have expanded to say that my main purpose with this is to carry the firearm between my car and workplace/home and while in car. The case would be inside a messenger back as I work in a professional environment. I currently use a Travelon shoulder bag that is semi soft sided and has lockable zippers but I'm thinking of getting something larger than can also hold a laptop and notebook. I was looking at the lightest lockable option and I liked this was "mold able" and could fit in crevices in my bag. I think I'll stay away from this option because of the potential for manipulation. I had just ran across it on amazon

[Jimi Jah]

Take it down to the Cal DOJ in Excremento and get an opinion? Then take it to the Federal building and let the ATF have a go at it?

You also want to bring your lawyer along.