Handgun registration in CA.

[ap3572001]

Talked about it with few friends at work the other day. Got into a friendly argument . LOL

Simple question : Do we have handgun registration in Ca? Yes or NO?

[pluke the 2]

Yes

[NIKSD]

Yes. For guns you purchase. NO for guns you already have.
And it is the same for long guns as well.

[ap3572001]

Yes. For guns you purchase. NO for guns you already have.
And it is the same for long guns as well.

For the guns I buy now but not guns I already have?

[pluke the 2]

For the guns I buy now but not guns I already have?

for the guns you buy now they need to be registered. for the guns you already have that ARE NOT REGISTERED, assuming youre not a new ca resident, you do not need to register. it's an optional registration if you have any unregistered pre 90's or whenever the law passed

[nick]

CA has handgun registration for the handguns you buy or transfer, not for the ones you make. It had no handgun registration for PPTs (since there was no requirement for them to go through a dealer) until 1991, for personal firearms importer (when someone moved to the state) until 1997 or 1998. So yes, there's registration at the time of sale or transfer, but many people can legally have unregistered handguns.

[pluke the 2]

see this thread and see quiet's reply, 2nd post on the thread.

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/archive/index.php/t-389496.html

Quiet

Currently, handgun registration is not mandatory in CA.
Except for intra-familial gifts and new residents and C&R FFLs importing in C&R handguns they acquired while out-of-state.
Also, when a handgun DROS is done, the handgun is registered to the buyer.

AFAIK...
1924 = CA DROS went into effect. Dealers mailed in paperwork. Also, one day waiting period for handgun sales.
1991 = All private party firearm transfers needed to be done through a CA FFL dealer.
1993 = Intra-familial handgun gifts needed to be reported to CA DOJ BOF.
1993 = New residents had to register their handguns with CA DOJ BOF.


So, you can say "handgun registration" in CA began in 1924. When dealers were required to report handgun sales to CA DOJ.
However, rumor is nothing prior to 1980 has ever been entered into AFS due to logistical & monetary reasons

[ap3572001]

CA has handgun registration for the handguns you buy or transfer, not for the ones you make. It had no handgun registration for PPTs (since there was no requirement for them to go through a dealer) until 1991, for personal firearms importer (when someone moved to the state) until 1997 or 1998. So yes, there's registration at the time of sale or transfer, but many people can legally have unregistered handguns.

Got into it with a couple of friends last night. Most of them are younger than I am LOL (THEY DID NOT OWN GUNS IN 1980's)

Here is how I explained it . Tell me if this is correct.

It is against the CA law to buy/sell/transfer a gun without going through an FFL (PPT)

It is not aginst the Ca law to own/possess a handgun that is not in Your name.

Correct?

[NIKSD]

Got into it with a couple of friends last night. Most of them are younger than I am LOL (THEY DID NOT OWN GUNS IN 1980's)

Here is how I explained it . Tell me if this is correct.

It is against the CA law to buy/sell/transfer a gun without going through an FFL (PPT)

It is not aginst the Ca law to own/possess a handgun that is not in Your name.

Correct?

1. Yes, FFL required.
2. If the gun is registered to somebody else- After 30 days gun in your position must be transferred to your name /FFL required/.

[pluke the 2]

if you get a gun from your father as a gift you don't neeed to go thru an ffl though. so it's only private party transactions

[NIKSD]

if you get a gun from your father as a gift you don't neeed to go thru an ffl though. so it's only private party transactions

Wait! Don't you need to register the firearm even if it is a gift from father?
See the form bellow

http://oag.ca.gov/sites/all/files/agweb/pdfs/firearms/forms/oplaw.pdf?

[lorax3]

Simple question : Do we have handgun registration in Ca? Yes or NO?

No.

California does not have firearm registration.

California does however have the AFS database which is a transactional database and includes various firearm transactions like the dealer's record of sales and other sales or transfers that are required to be entered into the database.

Below are answers from the testimony of Assistant Bureau Chief Buford at Bureau of Firearms (CA DOJ). This is from Silvester v. Harris. This guy isn't just a bureaucrat, read the complete testimony and you will see he is an expert on the functionality of AFS as he helped design it.

Q: Does the AFS have records on every gun in circulation in California?
A. No, it does not.

Q. What kind of firearms records does it have?

A. The bulk of the firearms records that are in AFS are related to dealer's records of sales, and that's exactly what it is. It's a dealer records of sales. It's not a registration. It's simply a record of a sale that was made at a particular date and time. And so that pretty much -- that's the other part of the information in AFS has to do with assault weapons registrations that were mandated back in 1989 and continued through -- I think through 2001 where certain guns were identified as assault weapons under California statute had to be registered by residents of California.
..
Q. Is there any limit in time for long gun records, like the records only go back for a certain amount of time?
A. With the exception of assault weapon registration, long gun records, the department only began retaining long gun records effective January 1st of 2014.
Q. I have the same question for handguns. How far back does the handgun records go?
A. I've seen the handgun records in AFS that go back to, like, the early 1900's.
Q. Is there complete -- are there complete handgun records going back that far?
A. They're not necessarily complete. They were records that were taken in at that particular time.
Q. So if you have a DROS record from the early 1900s, does that tell you who has the gun today?
A. No, those people are probably long passed away.
Q. If you have a DROS record at any time, does it tell you that that same person has the gun today?
A. No, not necessarily.
..
Q. All right. So for public safety reasons, it's possible for other agencies to access your AFS system to determine if somebody at least in your system, on your records is shown to have purchased a firearm and had not transferred it.
A. AFS, again, it's a leads database. So it doesn't mean just because it says that, there's a firearm in that house. It doesn't mean there's an actual firearm in the house. We don't have a registration process in California. It's a lead, so it's possible. It alerts the officer to be a little bit more cautious potentially, because potentially, there could be a firearm there.
Q. You said that earlier in your testimony, too. You're saying that California doesn't have a registration system.
A. Right.
Q. But, in fact, since 1991, at least for handguns, the State of California has kept records for every transaction; correct?
A. There are transaction records, yes. But when people die, or when they leave the State, when they sell the firearm out of state, there is no requirement for them to notice the department that they're no longer in possession. That firearm can leave the state, can come back into the state in various ways. So there is no real registration. If there is real registration, you'd have to reregister your gun every so many years and say you're still in possession of that gun, or let us know when you're no longer in possession of that firearm. We don't have that. So we're not really tracking it. All we know is what we believe was the last possessor of that firearm. That's what's in AFS. It's a leads database. It's not an absolute database.

[Librarian]

1. Yes, FFL required.
2. If the gun is registered to somebody else- After 30 days gun in your position must be transferred to your name /FFL required/.

2a - a gun registered to NO ONE is legal to own, possess and use:
- some guns have not been transferred since 1990;
- some guns are long guns last transferred before 2014;
- some guns were moved into CA before 1998.

And, there is the illegal market, size unknown, where proper transfer procedures have not been followed; such guns are not problematic based on 'registration' or lack of same.

[Librarian]

if you get a gun from your father as a gift you don't neeed to go thru an ffl though. so it's only private party transactions

Wait! Don't you need to register the firearm even if it is a gift from father?
See the form bellow

http://oag.ca.gov/sites/all/files/ag...rms/oplaw.pdf?

Yes; intrafamilial transfers require the form, long guns and handguns.

[Aldemar]

No.

California does not have firearm registration.

California does however have the AFS database which is a transactional database and includes various firearm transactions including dealer's record of sales and other sales or transfers that are required to be entered into the database.

Below are answers from the testimony of Assistant Bureau Chief Buford at Bureau of Firearms (CA DOJ). This is from Silvester v. Harris. This guy isn't just a bureaucrat, read the complete testimony and you will see he is an expert on the functionality of AFS as he helped design it.

Lorax, I respect your knowledge and opinions, but this is just semantics. You can call it whatever you want but if a governmental agency knows you have a particular piece of property, as far as I am concerned, then it's De facto registration. I don't care if it's a firearm, vehicle, or piece or furniture. The only reasons they need to follow property ownership is either for taxation or eventual confiscation.

Short of an outright ban on firearms, I can envision a time in the future where firearms are taxed like vehicles are now. If they don't know you have it, they can't tax or confiscate it.