Legalities of owning 80% Lower AR 15's?

[smcrea]

d) Build them into AR's first and before the serial numbered lowers

Thanks for the solid answer..

But now can I ask for the reasoning BEHIND the answer?

So to continue the discussion:

I think that we all agree that as the CA law stands IT IS LEGAL to have an un numbered lower that you machined yourself from an 80%. BTW I have video and pictures of me doing it safely stored away)

However:

The law is one thing. Getting hassle from the cops and ATF is another.

I see a lot of off duty cops working at the ranges that I go to. Maybe even ATF, FBI types hang out.

So a) what would be a typical comment from law enforcement if they saw that my AR did not have a serial number. b) What would be the best response be to that question.

Legal or not Legal the cops are still able to lock you up for 24 hours on suspicion of 'something' and they could make your life pretty unpleasant.

Spending the night in the lockup is one thing but explaining to my wife the next day is a total other thing. 2A apart my wife would order me to get rid of my guns if that happened!

So what's the nicey nicey diplomatic way to address an ******* law enforcement guy who wants to be a dick about your un-serial numbered lower?

Thanks!

[SJ-Chris]

Only way 80% is illegal. If you are a prohibited person.

Assuming the "80% lower" you are referring to is not considered a firearm by the ATF (aka: a paperweight), then I believe even prohibited persons could own it. I'm NOT saying I think it is a good idea....just saying that as far as I know, there is no law prohibiting anyone from owning a paperweight.

[Librarian]

I'm new to the CalGuns forums so excuse me if I'm inept. I have a question that I haven't seen expressed yet. If one builds (finishes) an 80% lower and builds an AR around it, what happens when you die? Can that 80% lower-based rifle be passed through inheritance to a close family member, i.e. a daughter? I know it can't be sold/transferred w/o serial number/FFL but what about at one's BIG END?

With the law as it is today, one can inherit such a rifle with no problems (presuming not a 'prohibited person').

[smcrea]

I was talking to an FFL friend who was saying that with regards to 80% that they fall within the long gun registration law which took effect on 1/1/14

The registration law mandates that all guns made or transferred after 1/1/14 must be serialized and registered with the DOJ. This includes 80%

[Mutenri]

In the event that 808 passes, are old completed receivers grandfathered?

[arrowshooter]

In the event that 808 passes, are old completed receivers grandfathered?

No grandfathering written at this time.

[edgerly779]

smcrea who is your ffl friend I don't want to make the mistake of asking him anything. More fud.

[Librarian]

In the event that 808 passes, are old completed receivers grandfathered?

No grandfathering written at this time.

In fact, the latest amendments are the opposite of 'grandfathering' - the bill now demands registration of guns built before the bill might become law.

(c) By July 1, 2016, any person who, as of January 1, 2016, owns a firearm that does not bear a serial number assigned to it pursuant to either Section 23910 or pursuant to Chapter 44 (commencing with Section 921) of Title 18 of the United States Code and the regulations issued pursuant thereto, shall do all of the following:
(1) Apply to the Department of Justice for a unique serial number or other mark of identification pursuant to Section 29182.

[CessnaDriver]

In fact, the latest amendments are the opposite of 'grandfathering' - the bill now demands registration of guns built before the bill might become law.

Felony or misdemeanor? or do we know yet?

[LBDamned]

at the risk of getting the "use search" response... I'm gonna ask...

what is the process of serializing an 80% lower now (prior to possible 808)?... I understand the depth of engraving, but does the number have to be "issued"? or can it be an arbitrary number (that I determine)?

As to the manufacture name, location, etc... since it's an 80% I understand it's not needed... but would it be necessary if it had a serial number?

Sorry if these questions are common sense to some - but I'm in the process of a build and am thinking a few things out ahead of time...

[Lone_Gunman]

In fact, the latest amendments are the opposite of 'grandfathering' - the bill now demands registration of guns built before the bill might become law.

Well, that's gonna get confusing, if someone had the manufacturer name, city, state, model name, and serial number of their choosing engraved on the 80% before they milled it out.

(c) By July 1, 2016, any person who, as of January 1, 2016, owns a firearm that does not bear a serial number assigned to it pursuant to either Section 23910 or pursuant to Chapter 44 (commencing with Section 921) of Title 18 of the United States Code and the regulations issued pursuant thereto, shall do all of the following:
(1) Apply to the Department of Justice for a unique serial number or other mark of identification pursuant to Section 29182.

Edit: oh boy, what about people who vol reged pistols built w/80%'s?

[six seven tango]

at the risk of getting the "use search" response... I'm gonna ask...

what is the process of serializing an 80% lower now (prior to possible 808)?... I understand the depth of engraving, but does the number have to be "issued"? or can it be an arbitrary number (that I determine)?

As to the manufacture name, location, etc... since it's an 80% I understand it's not needed... but would it be necessary if it had a serial number?

Sorry if these questions are common sense to some - but I'm in the process of a build and am thinking a few things out ahead of time...

Search is your friend...





sorry...couldn't resist.




No, the number does not have to be issued. It only has to be unique to the "manufacturer", which would be you in this case. Some people use their birthdate, with a -01 or something after it, others just pull random numbers/letters out of the air. (or other dark places)

AFAIK, the only time the manufacturer name, etc. is needed is if you are going to sell/transfer it.

[LBDamned]

Search is your friend...





sorry...couldn't resist.




No, the number does not have to be issued. It only has to be unique to the "manufacturer", which would be you in this case. Some people use their birthdate, with a -01 or something after it, others just pull random numbers/letters out of the air. (or other dark places)

AFAIK, the only time the manufacturer name, etc. is needed is if you are going to sell/transfer it.

perfect, thank you... and yes, I guess I deserved the search jab

[Ross]

There is nothing illegal about owning guns built from 80% receivers - never has been.
There is nothing illegal about owning finished 80% receivers that are yet to be built - never has been.

You cannot sell the guns unless you give them serial numbers and a city of manufacture.

The optimum word which should be added to both of these sentences is "yet."

With this eff'ed up state and the liberal controlled state legislature, never be surprised.

Those same politicians just passed a law requiring an impossible theory to be required (micro-stamping) for sale of semi-auto pistols.

[bwiese]

While having an unserialized homebuild is legal, it's more problems than it's worth.

Etch "Joe Williams #001/San Jose CA" on the sideplate and call it a day.

Your traffic stops will have less drama.