Complete LW-15 lower without bb installed, illegal as is?

[aklover_91]

What about possesing a lower w/o BB and a rifle with a BB?

Or is it a constructive possesion ?

If You own a Mini 14 and its somewhere in the house. With a scope and a 5 -10 round magazine.
And them You have a little case with a factory folding stock and 6 (30 round magazines)

Is that ok?

So far as I know the AWB doesn't have a provision for constructive possession.

Parts is parts and all that.

ETA: Not to imply that it couldn't cause problems for someone, the real world being what it is.

[bwiese]

My local shop told me the they have paperwork from doj stating that unless the lower has a rim fire upper attached they can not sell a complete lower without a bb. This is the same shop that is telling people they can not drop the magazine from their bb rifles while at the range to load they are telling people that they must load from the top

If you can get their copy of their DOJ letter saying that, we really want a copy please!!

[b18rexracer]

Re the post from eldonvieira: I have also been told that I cannot remove the magazine while the gun is assembled (such as to reload) that I must remove the takedown pin and load from the top. Removing the magazine even with a tool while the gun is assembled makes it an illegal AW.


Back to the original topic: I sent an email request (in addition to the voice message I left) in to CA DoJ BoF to see if I can get a written "official" response from them regarding my issue. I'll keep you all posted.

[bwiese]

Re the post from eldonvieira: I have also been told that I cannot remove the magazine while the gun is assembled (such as to reload) that I must remove the takedown pin and load from the top. Removing the magazine even with a tool while the gun is assembled makes it an illegal AW.

All BS. The whole purpose of the BulletButton and other maglock designs is to allow LEGAL magazine changes without triggering 'detachable magazine' status and derivative illegal AW status. The BB maglocks would have no value at all if they allowed AW
status even for a microsecond. [aside from using an over-10rd "hicap" magazine].

In no case does a properly operating BulletButton maglock ever allow the gun to become an AW as long as used with a 10rd or less magazine:

• a freestanding mag is neither detachable, fixed or otherwise: its status is only determined by its relation
  to the gun it's in;
  .
• lack of constructive possession means the gun must be regarded 'as it stands' at time of examination,
  without consideration for any prospective parts additions, removals or changes;
  .
• a BB maglock'd OLL with a 10rd magazine in place isn't an AW since,as the gun stands, it doesn't have
  the 'capacity to accept a detachable magazine': the magwell is full, and the mag would require a tool to
  remove, precluding it being considered a detachable magazine per formal regulatory definition. There
  are no considerations that can be factored in about prospects of tweaking the mag catch, or "what the
  gun could be", etc.
  .
• a BB maglock'd OLL with an empty magwell isn't an AW since, as it stands, the gun doesn't have the
  'capacity to accept a detachable magazine': the moment the mag is affixed to the gun it requires a
  tool to remove it, making it fall out of the 'detachable magazine' category.

Back to the original topic: I sent an email request (in addition to the voice message I left) in to CA DoJ BoF to see if I can get a written "official" response from them regarding my issue. I'll keep you all posted.

DOJ won't tell you crap. ASK IN WRITING, do not phone, do not accept a return phone call or a clerk will spin some BS. But that's moot anyway...

The actual official response is actually DOJ's response in the FEDERAL Richards (+ Haynie, etc.) v. Harris case where they stated (under oath etc.) that a BulletButton device does not allow an off-list rifle to become an AW.

[VaderSpade]

Bastiani Arms owners are mostly clueless, they do have one good employee, but they keep him on a short leash.
I brought in a home built (from an 80% lower) and was ask if I had the serial number approved by the DOJ. When I told him I didn't even need a serial number I was run out of the shop!

The shops name is Bastiani Arms in Redding, Ca. While the physical shop itself is fairly new the owner and some of his staff are well known and have worked at Jones Fort which is a long established gun shop.

In the past when I have needed something shipped to an FFL I would call ahead of time. However in this case Bastiani Arms was listed on Riflegears website has being on file with them. That lead me to believe they had done business together previously and that this shouldn't be a problem.

[b18rexracer]

Good news and bad news:

Good news: I got a phone call back from DoJ

Bad news: 1st it was a phone call not a
written response and 2nd I was unavailable to take the call so my buddy that happened to be over at the time (and knew the situation) talked to the lady and can't remember the lady's name! (Doh!!!)

He was told by (Melissa? Michelle?) that a complete lower must have an installed BB AND magazine to avoid being an illegal AW!

This is crazy when the BoF is giving out this info. (I know I was warned by an earlier poster)

I'm going to push for something written from them, futile as it might be. If I do manage to get it I'll post it. This is rediculous. This is moving from me being annoyed at my situation to a crusade!

[curtisfong]

Give it up unless you can get something in writing.