Stunguns and Tasers; possession is legal, BUT...

[Window_Seat]

In the CA law, it's legal to own, but it's not legal to use it, even if I'm defending myself, or can I? I can understand that the Legislature doesn't want us having taser parties where we all tase each other (bro), but I could not find anything in the law that exempts a person from prosecution who is using one for true self defense.

or use a stun gun, subject to the following
requirements:
(a) No person convicted of a felony or any crime involving an
assault under the laws of the United States, of the State of
California, or any other state, government, or country or convicted
of misuse of a stun gun under Section 244.5, shall purchase, possess,
or use stun guns.
(b) No person who is addicted to any narcotic drug shall purchase,
possess, or use a stun gun.
(c) No person shall sell or furnish any stun gun to a minor unless
the minor is at least 16 years of age and has the written consent of
his or her parent or legal guardian.
Violation of this subdivision shall be a public offense punishable
by a fifty dollar ($50) fine for the first offense. Any subsequent
violation of this subdivision is a misdemeanor.
(d) No minor shall possess any stun gun unless the minor is at
least 16 years of age and has the written consent of his or her
parent or legal guardian.

except a less lethal weapon, as defined in Section 12601, used or
intended to be used as either an offensive or defensive weapon that
is capable of temporarily immobilizing a person by the infliction of
an electrical charge.
(b) Every person who commits an assault upon the person of another
with a stun gun or less lethal weapon, as defined in Section 12601,
shall be punished by imprisonment in a county jail for a term not
exceeding one year, or by imprisonment in the state prison for 16
months, two, or three years.
(c) Every person who commits an assault upon the person of a peace
officer or firefighter with a stun gun or less lethal weapon, as
defined in Section 12601, who knows or reasonably should know that
the person is a peace officer or firefighter engaged in the
performance of his or her duties, when the peace officer or
firefighter is engaged in the performance of his or her duties, shall
be punished by imprisonment in the county jail for a term not
exceeding one year, or by imprisonment in the state prison for two,
three, or four years.
(d) This section shall not be construed to preclude or in any way
limit the applicability of Section 245 in any criminal prosecution.

12601. (a) "Less lethal weapon" means any device that is designed
to or that has been converted to expel or propel less lethal
ammunition by any action, mechanism, or process for the purpose of
incapacitating, immobilizing, or stunning a human being through the
infliction of any less than lethal impairment of physical condition,
function, or senses, including physical pain or discomfort. It is not
necessary that a weapon leave any lasting or permanent
incapacitation, discomfort, pain, or other injury or disability in
order to qualify as a less lethal weapon.
(b) Less lethal weapon includes the frame or receiver of any
weapon described in subdivision (a), but does not include any of the
following unless the part or weapon has been converted as described
in subdivision (a):
(1) Pistol, revolver, or firearm as defined in Section 12001.
(2) Machinegun as defined in Section 12200.
(3) Rifle or shotgun using fixed ammunition consisting of standard
primer and powder and not capable of being concealed upon the
person.
(4) Pistols, rifles, and shotguns that are firearms having a
barrel less than 0.18 inches in diameter and that are designed to
expel a projectile by any mechanical means or by compressed air or
gas.
(5) When used as designed or intended by the manufacturer, any
weapon commonly regarded as a toy gun, and that as such is incapable
of inflicting any impairment of physical condition, function, or
senses.
(6) A destructive device as defined in Section 12301.
(7) A tear gas weapon as defined in Section 12402.
(8) A bow or crossbow designed to shoot arrows.
(9) A device commonly known as a slingshot.
(10) A device designed for the firing of stud cartridges,
explosive rivets, or similar industrial ammunition.
(11) A device designed for signaling, illumination, or safety.
(12) An assault weapon as defined in Section 12276 or 12276.1.
(c) "Less lethal ammunition" means any ammunition that (1) is
designed to be used in any less lethal weapon or any other kind of
weapon (including, but not limited to, firearms, pistols, revolvers,
shotguns, rifles, and spring, compressed air, and compressed gas
weapons) and (2) when used in the less lethal weapon or other weapon
is designed to immobilize or incapacitate or stun a human being
through the infliction of any less than lethal impairment of physical
condition, function, or senses, including physical pain or
discomfort.

except a less lethal weapon, as defined in Section 12601

[Librarian]

But in all cases the crime specified is

Every person who commits an assault upon the person of another

Self-defense is not an assault.

[Jack L]

I have two of them. I use the highest power I can buy (1 million to 4 million volts). One is 10" long so I can use it on pit bulls as well. Keep it held against an assassin for 4 -5 seconds and watch them melt to the ground doing the funky chicken.

http://www.hughessecuritysolutions.com/Stun_Guns_Stun_Master_4_5_Million_Volt_Baton_p/1stsm-minibaton.htm

[leelaw]

Keep it held against an assassin for 4 -5 seconds and watch them melt to the ground doing the funky chicken.

I hope you're quoting a movie or something. Either that, or you don't really have any practical experience with stun guns or Tasers, other than... the movies.

[Vipersx911]

I own the M-26c, upon buying it I verified the use and legalities with the Escondido Police Department via phone. They told me that since it is the version that fires the cartridges I must use a cartridge that only has the 15 foot accepted self defense distance versions. They also stated that since it is not defined as a firearm there is no concealed permit required for it. To reafirm the sections that you quoted, assault with a taser or stun gun is a crime. However using one for self defense in case of a forcible felony or other malicious misdemeanor is perfectly acceptable under California Law. The posession, carry, and use of one is considered lawful as long as it is used in a defensive manner. To use either of these types of technology in an offensive manner is considered assault as defined in the PC listed above.

Note: Some cities do have restrictions on use or carry for tasers or stun guns. Always check with your local law enforcement agency before carrying one of these on your person.

[Jack L]

I hope you're quoting a movie or something. Either that, or you don't really have any practical experience with stun guns or Tasers, other than... the movies.

Come on over and let me place this againts your head. A stun gun is not a taser buy any means but it gets the point across.

[Connor P Price]

Come on over and let me place this againts your head. A stun gun is not a taser buy any means but it gets the point across.

I think his point is that the electric impulse causes ones muscles to become completely rigid. There would be nothing resembling a "funky chicken" because the muscles tense up and the person simply falls to the ground.

[Cokebottle]

I hope you're quoting a movie or something. Either that, or you don't really have any practical experience with stun guns or Tasers, other than... the movies.

+1

Back in college, my buddy's GF bought a stun gun because she didn't have to get a permit and take a class for it like she did with mace (this was before OC spray was available).

Buddy told her she made a mistake. She refused to believe him.
We set up a "test" for her... He told her "Rich will go after you, use that stun gun as directed and we'll see what happens"

I moved in, she nailed me square in the chest.
I knocked it out of her hand.
My buddy said "Had he actually been attacking you, you just REALLY pissed him off"

She said "Oh, the batteries must be dead" and she popped my buddy in the thigh... his leg folded.

An actual taser? I have no desire to mess with one, but stun guns?
Toys that make a lot of money for MLM people.

[leelaw]

I think his point is that the electric impulse causes ones muscles to become completely rigid. There would be nothing resembling a "funky chicken" because the muscles tense up and the person simply falls to the ground.

No, the point is that I think his complete knowledge of electronic control devices is based off the movies.

[leelaw]

Come on over and let me place this againts your head. A stun gun is not a taser buy any means but it gets the point across.

Do you always expect your "assassins" to hold still for "4 -5 seconds?"

A stun gun causes localized pain, not a debilitating effect. Try it sometime.

[Jack L]

I own the M-26c, upon buying it I verified the use and legalities with the Escondido Police Department via phone. They told me that since it is the version that fires the cartridges I must use a cartridge that only has the 15 foot accepted self defense distance versions. They also stated that since it is not defined as a firearm there is no concealed permit required for it. To reafirm the sections that you quoted, assault with a taser or stun gun is a crime. However using one for self defense in case of a forcible felony or other malicious misdemeanor is perfectly acceptable under California Law. The posession, carry, and use of one is considered lawful as long as it is used in a defensive manner. To use either of these types of technology in an offensive manner is considered assault as defined in the PC listed above.

Right on. My CCW classes suggested owning a quality taser. They cost as much as a quality handgun.

During my career I watched a lot of bad guys get sprayed by SO and found out at close range under controlled conditions it worked pretty good, not 100%. If a bad guy is really non compliant, you need the taser or industrial size cans of spray like the COs have. Last week my dog was attacked by a pit bull. I already knew from experience, those small containers of spray do not cut it at all as the pit bull is to focused on the attack. I needed a stun gun. A cattle prod is good too because it's longer. I found out that if I was not going to shoot the dog, I need to neutralize it fast and a high quality stun gun, cattle prod or the bear spray does that well but you have to get right in the conflict. If the dog starts to bite you, you can shoot it ( I have a CCW). In this case it was $400 vet bills and I went up to the owner and he was shaking in his shoes thinking he was next. I told him I was going to the vet and I'd be back with the bill. He agreed as he owns a house next to my mother and could not very well disappear easy. My wife works at the command center and there seems to be a number of dog attack calls on dogs as well as humans these days.

see attachments. regardless of what the product info says, if you can hold the stun gun againts a head, that is a zapper. If the shirt is off, the heart area, and the groin is good too. Best to go for skin, not clothes.

[Connor P Price]

No, the point is that I think his complete knowledge of electronic control devices is based off the movies.

Fair enough.

Tasers work great. Stun guns make great fun for prodding your friends in the hamstring with at parties.

[Vipersx911]

Right on. My CCW classes suggested owning a quality taser. They cost as much as a quality handgun.

During my career I watched a lot of bad guys get sprayed by SO and found out at close range under controlled conditions it worked pretty good, not 100%. If a bad guy is really non compliant, you need the taser or industrial size cans of spray like the COs have. Last week my dog was attacked by a pit bull. I already knew from experience, those small containers of spray do not cut it at all as the pit bull is to focused on the attack. I needed a stun gun. A cattle prod is good too because it's longer. I found out that if I was not going to shoot the dog, I need to neutralize it fast and a high quality stun gun, cattle prod or the bear spray does that well but you have to get right in the conflict. If the dog starts to bite you, you can shoot it ( I have a CCW). In this case it was $400 vet bills and I went up to the owner and he was shaking in his shoes thinking he was next. I told him I was going to the vet and I'd be back with the bill. He agreed as he owns a house next to my mother and could not very well disappear easy. My wife works at the command center and there seems to be a number of dog attack calls on dogs as well as humans these days.

They do run around $499 for the M-26c or $999 for the X-26c. They have 50,000 volts and the amperage although I dont know it off hand is not designed to be for pain compliance. How a taser works is that its frequency of operation immobilize the Central Nervous Systems impulses and seizes the individual up. They do hurt like H*** however they are extremely effective even for the most tough individuals as they are not pain compliance. I would recommend one to anyone who is interested in a less than lethal means of defending themselves. Also something that people dont realize is that without the cartrdge they can be used as a stungun, which will have the same debilitating effect.

[Jack L]

Fair enough.

Tasers work great. Stun guns make great fun for prodding your friends in the hamstring with at parties.

Try their eye sockets or their groin (if their clothes are off). If the shirt is off keep it on their heart area until battery goes out. Give us an update on how long they laughed.

[Connor P Price]

Try their eye sockets or their groin (if their clothes are off). If the shirt is off keep it on their heart area until battery goes out. Give us an update on how long they laughed.

It would appear your only experience with hand to hand combat comes from the movies as well.

Think about how the arms are positioned on the human body, then consider how easy it would for an attacker to deflect your arms as your tried to press a stun gun to any of those targets. As far as holding it on their heart area until the battery goes out, unless the person is asleep on their back when you start, its just flat out not going to happen.

The only way you would be able to accomplish either of those scenarios is if you were able to significantly overpower your attacker. Something to the effect of you being a well muscled 6'4" 240lb male and your attacker being a relatively small female. Be honest with yourself, criminals don't prey on people that can overpower them, so that's not going to happen.