Intrafamilial Transfer FUD???

[4DSJW]

I thought that I had the Out-of-State Intrafamilial Transfer issues all sorted out (thanks to CGN)... until today. I stopped by a gun store in my area that opened a few months ago and, according to CGN threads, is run by friendly and knowledgeable folks. We talked about gun prices, PPT's, and transfers.

When he asked about the transfers I told him that my dad lives in Nevada, would like to gift me some of his firearms, and those are the transfers I would be doing. His comment was that I did NOT need to transfer the firearms through him or any FFL, IF I went to Nevada to receive them face-to-face or if my dad brought them to me in CA and gave them to me face-to-face. I asked if this included handguns and he said it applies to handguns and long-guns. Regardless of the type of firearm he said all I needed to do was fill out the Intrafamilial Transfer/Operation of Law form from the CADOJ website and send it in with the correct fee.

This is contrary to what I thought was correct; that any firearm changing ownership and crossing State lines HAD to be done through an FFL by Federal law. Am I wrong or is the shop owner incorrect??? The only way I understand an FFL to be unnecessary is when the previous owner has passed and the firearms are left to a new owner, in the same or a different State does not matter.

Thank you for your help!!!

[boxbro]

I am not a lawyer but I believe it's against federal law for residents from different states, family or not, to transfer firearms without going through an FFL.

[MasterYong]

I am not a lawyer but I believe it's against federal law for residents from different states, family or not, to transfer firearms without going through an FFL.

I second you assertion.

May not apply to really old guns (C&Rs?). Note sure.

[Gryff]

http://www.nraila.org/federalfirearms.htm#Sec.%20922

Title I : State Firearms Control Assistance
Chapter 44. Firearms

(Title18, U.S. Code, Sections 921-929)

Sec. 922. Unlawful acts

(a) It shall be unlawful:

(3) for any person, other than a licensed importer, licensed manufacturer, licensed dealer, or licensed collector to transport into or receive in the State where he resides (or if the person is a corporation or other business entity, the State where it maintains a place of business) any firearm purchased or otherwise obtained by such person outside that State, except that this paragraph (A) shall not preclude any person who lawfully acquires a firearm by bequest or intestate succession in a State other than his State of residence from transporting the firearm into or receiving it in that State, if it is lawful for such person to purchase or possess such firearm in that State, (B) shall not apply to the transportation or receipt of a firearm obtained in conformity with subsection (b)(3) of this section, and (C) shall not apply to the transportation of any firearm acquired in any State prior to the effective date of this chapter;

It appears that it is legal to inherit across state lines without an FFL involved, but not transfer while the parent is living. My opinion is definitely not authoritative, though.

[jtmkinsd]

There is no Federal exemption for intrafamilial transfers...so, you going and getting them and bringing them back is a Fed no-no. Dad bringing them here with the intent of giving them to you without an FFL is a Fed no-no. California allows Non-FFL transfers among certain family members, all of whom live within California. SO, Dad can drive them here, but you would both have to go to an FFL, you would fill out paper, wait ten days, and pick up the guns.

This all assumes the firearms are not assault weapons by definition or name.

[Librarian]

When he asked about the transfers I told him that my dad lives in Nevada, would like to gift me some of his firearms, and those are the transfers I would be doing. His comment was that I did NOT need to transfer the firearms through him or any FFL, IF I went to Nevada to receive them face-to-face or if my dad brought them to me in CA and gave them to me face-to-face. I asked if this included handguns and he said it applies to handguns and long-guns. Regardless of the type of firearm he said all I needed to do was fill out the Intrafamilial Transfer/Operation of Law form from the CADOJ website and send it in with the correct fee.

Seems like they recently called CA-DOJ; they seem always to forget Federal law on interstate transfers.

Your initial, educated belief is correct.

(And on another note, "FUD" has a connotation of deliberate misinformation - merely being wrong is not creating Fear, Uncertainty and Doubt.)

[4DSJW]

Question Answered

Thank you to everyone who posted! I believe my question has been answered and I'm glad to know that all my prior research and understanding is correct.

Librarian, you are correct... I don't think the incorrect information was deliberate for any nefarious purpose, just incorrect. LOL, maybe we need a new acronym.

Thanks to all!

[CaliforniaLiberal]

California Gun Law is a dark and tangled thicket and is a great challenge for many FFLs to navigate. Adding to this is the incorrect and contradictory information and advice that FFLs get from the CA DOJ and the BATF. Even different BATF inspectors can give contradictory information.

I advocate having compassion for the FFLs and when possible to gently educate them.

How about IGLI, Incorrect Gun Law Information for a new acronym?

[ke6guj]

(And on another note, "FUD" has a connotation of deliberate misinformation - merely being wrong is not creating Fear, Uncertainty and Doubt.)

the meaning of FUD has migrated in the eyes of many as "F#$'ed-Up Disinformation"

[Cokebottle]

I second you assertion.

May not apply to really old guns (C&Rs?). Note sure.

It does not apply to C&R guns only if the recipient is a C&R holder.
An FFL must be involved in ALL interstate transfers. In the case of a C&R, the 03FFL is sufficient.

But the gun shop is wrong, however, it is not appropriate to refer to is as "FUD".

"FUD" is when gun shops, the DOJ, or whoever, "make up" laws that are more strict than the actual laws. Generally, you are safe (but overly burdening yourself) by following FUD.

In this case, the gun shop is instructing the customer to violate both Federal and California law.