Lock Removal S&W Revolver

[bodger]

I have a Smith and Wesson Model 66-7 that has an internal lock. I want to remove it, and purchase a plug that is available for the Hillary hole that will be left behind once the lock is gone.
The lock can be replaced.

I have a gun safe, and follow all firearm safety procedures for storage and use.

Are there any legal ramifications to beware of is this is done? Especially if I were to eventually possibly sell the revolver without the lock?

I searched this forum, didn't find any threads relating to this.

[littlejake]

I don't really know. I doubt it matters as the ILS is not good enough to meet the recent federal lock requirement for transfer.

But, you never know about civil litigation if you later sell it without the ILS. (So, I would put it back in if you were to sell it.)

Doesn't the S&W ILS system result in a narrow hammer -- how do you make up for that in removing the ILS?

I recently bought a 637-2 with the ILS -- first S&W I've owned with the ILS (and I've owned 16 S&W's) -- I absolutely hate the way that ILS butchers the revolver... I'm likely to sell it; and never buy a S&W again.

[CEDaytonaRydr]

Are there any legal ramifications to beware of is this is done? Especially if I were to eventually possibly sell the revolver without the lock?

I searched this forum, didn't find any threads relating to this.

There could be.

If you shoot an intruder with the pistol, they may try to demonize you in court by telling the jury that you removed a safety feature. So, just have a good story ready if you do....

All joking aside, I've heard of people having a concern with the recoil actuating the lock. I don't know if that's plausible (I don't thing it is) but still, it might could happen...

[bodger]

There could be.

If you shoot an intruder with the pistol, they may try to demonize you in court by telling the jury that you removed a safety feature. So, just have a good story ready if you do....

All joking aside, I've heard of people having a concern with the recoil actuating the lock. I don't know if that's plausible (I don't thing it is) but still, it might could happen...

There's a video on YouTube that shows an S&W with an IL that is clearly causing the gun to malfunction whilst being dry-fired. You can see the "flag" come up and the firing pin not coming forward several times during the ten or so dry fires.

I just hate the idea of the IL, and how S&W caved into the Clintons and started that ridiculous feature.
I have to admit, I didn't even know about it until I had already bought the gun. Now, it hacks me off just to see it there. I was just curious, seeing as how this is CA, if removing the lock made me an instant felon or some such nonsense.

Don't know if the gun was rigged for the video or what. But supposedly, there have been documented instances where the IL malfunctioned. It's an ongoing debate over on the S&W forum.

[CEDaytonaRydr]

There's a video on YouTube that shows an S&W with an IL that is clearly causing the gun to malfunction whilst being dry-fired. You can see the "flag" come up and the firing pin not coming forward several times during the ten or so dry fires.

I just hate the idea of the IL, and how S&W caved into the Clintons and started that ridiculous feature.
I have to admit, I didn't even know about it until I had already bought the gun. Now, it hacks me off just to see it there. I was just curious, seeing as how this is CA, if removing the lock made me an instant felon or some such nonsense.

Don't know if the gun was rigged for the video or what. But supposedly, there have been documented instances where the IL malfunctioned. It's an ongoing debate over on the S&W forum.

That sounds like a good enough justification to me.

[nn3453]

I have shot thousands of rounds through post-lock guns without a problem. There were issues with some early post lock guns but they have since been resolved. But if it makes you feel better, go for it. If you ever sell it though, personally, I'd buy a factory original than a bubba'ed gun.

[bwiese]

Several comments, bodger:

1.) I think ills with the lock are only on early implementations. My 2005 625 w/lock is fine, and
I've decided not to remove it (mostly due to laziness, some due to appearance issues). I've
actually slept on this gun as my primary, too.

2.) If your 66-7 is a Rostered gun and it's still Rostered if & when you were to sell it in future
(and if the Roster is not killed off by then! ) then it will have to be returned to the shape in
which it was Rostered: to sell it back to a CA dealer; without restoring the modification, it could
be PPTd to another Californian, sold via consignment, or sold out of state.

3.) There's no legal repercussions for such a modified gun [unless a kid got hold of it, etc. - but
then you'd have other storage problems anyway.] Even if you used the gun to take out a perp,
the big question will revolve around the shoot being legit; if you say you shot the guy because
the removed lock caused a failure, you're going to jail for at least manslaughter: valid shoots need
to be intentional and to stop a valid threat to life/limb of you and/or yours.

4.) Don't "bubba" a nice S&W wheelgun.

[dfletcher]

I have a Smith and Wesson Model 66-7 that has an internal lock. I want to remove it, and purchase a plug that is available for the Hillary hole that will be left behind once the lock is gone.
The lock can be replaced.

I have a gun safe, and follow all firearm safety procedures for storage and use.

Are there any legal ramifications to beware of is this is done? Especially if I were to eventually possibly sell the revolver without the lock?

I searched this forum, didn't find any threads relating to this.

I don't like the lock. Bought a Smith 21 but just couldn't warm up to it. I used a leather punch to punch out a soft, grey magnetic plug (can't recall what it's called but it looked good and stayed put) and set it it into the lock. Covered it without removing the internals.

Regarding liability, that's an unending discussion much like the Browning mag disconnect safety one. I'm not an attorney but I chose to not disable it.

[bodger]

I've got the lockworks down pat on S&W revolvers. The hardest part is the hand spring, and I use a tension wire screwed to my workbench to get that spring set in properly. That's a re-assembly move where you definitely need three hands.
I've polished the rebound slides on an Arkie stone and the whole bit. Can't say I'm an expert, but I definitely have the skill level required to detail strip the lockworks, remove the lock and put everything back properly. Including replacing the lock if necessary at some point.
There's a member over at the S&W forum that uses a lathe to mill out a nice tight plug, stainless or blue, and it affixes with a tiny clip on the inside so it can be removed and the lock replaced.
Not too much Bubba involved if done properly. No worries, no lock, no Hillary Hole.

http://smith-wessonforum.com/accessories-misc-sale-trade/112992-replace-lock-plug.html

[littlejake]

S&W isn't what it was... They were bought by the Safe-T-Hammer Corp circa 2000 who has the patent on the ILS system.

No one wants the ILS system, but they put it in anyway.

IMO, S&W hasn't been the premier revolver source since they stopped using "pinned" barrels in the early 1980's.

[loather]

bodger, that looks pretty sweet! If I ever end up with a post-lock S&W, I'll probably end up doing something like that to it.

However, if I do buy another revolver, it'll likely be one of the older .357s or a .44 magnum (the infamous model 29... and before you ask, yes, I *do* feel lucky). That being the case, it'll probably be devoid of such locking mechanism anyways.

[SgtDinosaur]

This is part of the reason I bought a couple of used S&W revolvers last year - no locks. However I bought my 340PD new in 2005 and it has the lock. I can't really tell that the lock is doing anything bad, except I don't like the way it looks. I have no idea where the key is, either.

[bodger]

This is part of the reason I bought a couple of used S&W revolvers last year - no locks. However I bought my 340PD new in 2005 and it has the lock. I can't really tell that the lock is doing anything bad, except I don't like the way it looks. I have no idea where the key is, either.

bodger, that looks pretty sweet! If I ever end up with a post-lock S&W, I'll probably end up doing something like that to it.

However, if I do buy another revolver, it'll likely be one of the older .357s or a .44 magnum (the infamous model 29... and before you ask, yes, I *do* feel lucky). That being the case, it'll probably be devoid of such locking mechanism anyways.

I had not bought a S&W revolver in quite a while when I bought this Model 66-7. I had no idea there was an internal lock and was pretty pissed when I realized that I had purchased a handgun with a ridiculous feature like that.

I just don't like the idea of it and the fact that it is there, nor the look of it.
From what I can gather, and as Bill pointed out as well, concerns about the internal lock causing a malfunction are pretty well unfounded at this point. At least on the newer guns.
Nevertheless, since there don't seem to be any legal ramifications, I'm happy to have pulled my lock and plugged it. I'll be purchasing pre-lock Smiths or other brand wheel guns in the future though.

The upside is, I learned how to effectively detail strip and re-assemble the lockworks on a Smith revolver. Something I would probably not have taken the time to learn otherwise.

I could have done without the part where I had to scour the floor around the work area with a magnet to find the damn tiny springs that flew all over the place when I did the first dis-assembly though.

[bodger]

Nice. Bullseye Smith really nailed it.

That's a great looking revolver you've got there.

[shooting4life]

Take it out. Nothin to worry about.