Juggernaut Immediately Cease Selling and Distributing Unlawful Assault Weapons

[bwiese]

IVC,

Even if the grip/lower setup in question prevented most users' hands
(including the hand of the mfgr and the gun's owner) from 'grasping
below the line and firing' - it does not prevent ALL hands.

You would want to preclude even Andre the Giant's irradiated hormone-
doused spawn from grasping 'below the line' yet still having enough finger reach to touch if not pull the trigger. This setup from Juggernaut - as
well as the Juggernaut orig 'very angled grip' - do not.

But the webbed grips from Solar Tactical etc - as well as the classic
MonsterMan grip - do preclude this.

I do worry about Kydex 'grip wraps' that are not strong enough to
withstand 'thumb pressure fold back' - my personal opinion is any
grip wrap 'tail area' should extend far enough back as well as containing
maybe even another 'stiffener' layer.

That's been the core of the discussion since the beginning.

Because of how the law is worded, and this one isn't convoluted in any way, they had the burden of coming up with a design preventing the use of the gun with the thumb wrapped around the pistol grip. That's the bare common-sense minimum, but isn't sufficient in this case - even with the fin, the DOJ could go after them since all the "webbing" discussion is part of the regulation, not part of the statute. The statute calls for "...pistol grip that protrudes conspicuously..." to be an evil feature, so the whole "webbing game" is not a guarantee for compliance with the law if the AG makes a case it's a pistol grip.

[sbo80]

For those that already bought them, since the problem at issue is really the lower, which purported to allow for use of a regular pistol grip - I would think anyone that bought one, would still be able to switch to a typical featureless grip, or even go fixed mag, and not have any problem. The little nub in the trigger area becomes irrelevant (and annoying, in the way, etc.) but it would not be an AW anymore. Though technically, purchasing an AW is against the PC, it becomes difficult to "prove" what configuration the rifle was in at the time of purchase (barring self-incrimination like posted pictures on facebook etc.) if when DOJ shows up the rifle is currently compliant. Nothing on the DROS or 4473 specifically lists how a rifle is not an AW, it just assumes it isn't.

[jcwatchdog]

For those that already bought them, since the problem at issue is really the lower, which purported to allow for use of a regular pistol grip - I would think anyone that bought one, would still be able to switch to a typical featureless grip, or even go fixed mag, and not have any problem. The little nub in the trigger area becomes irrelevant (and annoying, in the way, etc.) but it would not be an AW anymore. Though technically, purchasing an AW is against the PC, it becomes difficult to "prove" what configuration the rifle was in at the time of purchase (barring self-incrimination like posted pictures on facebook etc.) if when DOJ shows up the rifle is currently compliant. Nothing on the DROS or 4473 specifically lists how a rifle is not an AW, it just assumes it isn't.

[jcwatchdog]

IVC,

Even if the grip/lower setup in question prevented most users' hands
(including the hand of the mfgr and the gun's owner) from 'grasping
below the line and firing' - it does not prevent ALL hands.

You would want to preclude even Andre the Giant's irradiated hormone-
doused spawn from grasping 'below the line' yet still having enough finger reach to touch if not pull the trigger. This setup from Juggernaut - as
well as the Juggernaut orig 'very angled grip' - do not.

But the webbed grips from Solar Tactical etc - as well as the classic
MonsterMan grip - do preclude this.

I do worry about Kydex 'grip wraps' that are not strong enough to
withstand 'thumb pressure fold back' - my personal opinion is any
grip wrap 'tail area' should extend far enough back as well as containing
maybe even another 'stiffener' layer.

[Experimentalist]

Seconded. Good to see you back Bill.

... However, I recall some back & forth with lawyers on the famous "Milpitas lowers" 15 yrs ago there were issues about first criminalizing regulatory interpretation for the regulated body (FFL).

I won one of those lowers in a raffle. Kinda cool to have a rifle (or part of one) that once was confiscated property, and a symbol of what good people - working intelligently - can do against arbitrary governance.

Not even if Mr. T gave me one for free. The A-Team mini-14 side-folders would be impossible to own in CA anyway.

Not so. I've a Ruger Min-14 side folder. No bullet button. Of course it was registered as an assault weapon back in 2001.

[sbo80]

...someone who already bought one, and now is stuck with it and doesn't want it confiscated or be charged as an AW...

[jcwatchdog]

...someone who already bought one, and now is stuck with it and doesn't want it confiscated or be charged as an AW...