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  • #76
    Liberty1
    Calguns Addict
    • Apr 2007
    • 5541

    The Reverend Ken Blanchard discusses freedom and the 2nd amendment


    False is the idea of utility that sacrifices a thousand real advantages for one imaginary or trifling inconvenience; that would take fire from men because it burns, and water because one may drown in it; that has no remedy for evils except destruction. The laws that forbid the carrying of arms are laws of such a nature. They disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes.
    -- Cesare Beccaria http://www.a-human-right.com/

    Comment

    • #77
      Liberty1
      Calguns Addict
      • Apr 2007
      • 5541

      The page you're trying to access could not be found or is no longer available.


      Pistol-Packing Picnic In Oakland County (Michigan)
      Picnic To Raise Awareness About Right To Carry Arms Without Permit

      POSTED: Sunday, August 2, 2009
      UPDATED: 7:32 am EDT August 2, 2009

      AP
      OXFORD TOWNSHIP, Mich. -- Organizers of a gathering in a Detroit suburb want picnickers to bring a dish to share and carry a handgun in plain view.

      The Sunday afternoon picnic at Seymour Lake Park in Oxford Township, about 30 miles north-northwest of Detroit, is to raise awareness of a Michigan law allowing registered gun owners to openly carry handguns without a special permit.

      Alcohol and shooting won't be allowed at the potluck.

      Members of Michigan Open Carry, said the gathering is a regular family picnic, the only difference is the people there will be armed.
      False is the idea of utility that sacrifices a thousand real advantages for one imaginary or trifling inconvenience; that would take fire from men because it burns, and water because one may drown in it; that has no remedy for evils except destruction. The laws that forbid the carrying of arms are laws of such a nature. They disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes.
      -- Cesare Beccaria http://www.a-human-right.com/

      Comment

      • #78
        Liberty1
        Calguns Addict
        • Apr 2007
        • 5541

        open carry radio launched:

        False is the idea of utility that sacrifices a thousand real advantages for one imaginary or trifling inconvenience; that would take fire from men because it burns, and water because one may drown in it; that has no remedy for evils except destruction. The laws that forbid the carrying of arms are laws of such a nature. They disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes.
        -- Cesare Beccaria http://www.a-human-right.com/

        Comment

        • #79
          Liberty1
          Calguns Addict
          • Apr 2007
          • 5541

          De Pere, Wisconsin repeals Open Carry Ban



          False is the idea of utility that sacrifices a thousand real advantages for one imaginary or trifling inconvenience; that would take fire from men because it burns, and water because one may drown in it; that has no remedy for evils except destruction. The laws that forbid the carrying of arms are laws of such a nature. They disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes.
          -- Cesare Beccaria http://www.a-human-right.com/

          Comment

          • #80
            Liberty1
            Calguns Addict
            • Apr 2007
            • 5541

            I’ve been critical of open carry sorts in the past. Not because I don’t think their cause is good but, rather, it does have some tactical disadvantages and some of the proponents seem a…


            SayUncle open carries (accidentally). He's lucky he was not in an anti-gun state like Texas or Florida!

            Open Carry

            I’ve been critical of open carry sorts in the past. Not because I don’t think their cause is good but, rather, it does have some tactical disadvantages and some of the proponents seem a bit too in your face about it. Anyway, I recently stopped to grab some milk at a convenience store in West Knoxville. I neglected to put my shirt over my Glock 30 and went in the store. I was carrying four gallons of milk when I realized my weapon was exposed. Then I went to Walmart a few weeks later and I apparently had reached up on the top shelf to get something and my shirt came up over the gun again. And I didn’t notice for a while. Saw it and covered it. But I’d been up and down several aisles. So, do doubt, I was made.

            And a funny thing happened: nothing. Not a single person in either crowded store freaked out or said anything. Not a word. Not even employees.

            Seems to be a trend.

            Posted in Guns on August 10th, 2009 by SayUncle
            False is the idea of utility that sacrifices a thousand real advantages for one imaginary or trifling inconvenience; that would take fire from men because it burns, and water because one may drown in it; that has no remedy for evils except destruction. The laws that forbid the carrying of arms are laws of such a nature. They disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes.
            -- Cesare Beccaria http://www.a-human-right.com/

            Comment

            • #81
              Liberty1
              Calguns Addict
              • Apr 2007
              • 5541

              One Stop Viewing for New Hampshire Obama Townhall Meeting Open Carry Videos



              and more




              Here is the MSNBC Chris Mathews interview with that NH open carry guy.



              Ron Paul praises Obama's Secret Service for their restraint toward Open Carry guy






              from the Ridley Report

              Which contains info on a police contact with the OCer which included a threat to arrest him for "trespass" if he didn't move from the public demonstration area to the private church property. The OCer also has a New Hampshire carry license which exempts him from the fed. GFSZ act.



              and police contact documented













              and one more for good measure; marching accordions:

              Last edited by Liberty1; 08-14-2009, 3:14 AM.
              False is the idea of utility that sacrifices a thousand real advantages for one imaginary or trifling inconvenience; that would take fire from men because it burns, and water because one may drown in it; that has no remedy for evils except destruction. The laws that forbid the carrying of arms are laws of such a nature. They disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes.
              -- Cesare Beccaria http://www.a-human-right.com/

              Comment

              • #82
                Liberty1
                Calguns Addict
                • Apr 2007
                • 5541

                Arizona Teen wearing Camo hiking with airsoft rifle arrested for "Disorderly Conduct"

                False is the idea of utility that sacrifices a thousand real advantages for one imaginary or trifling inconvenience; that would take fire from men because it burns, and water because one may drown in it; that has no remedy for evils except destruction. The laws that forbid the carrying of arms are laws of such a nature. They disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes.
                -- Cesare Beccaria http://www.a-human-right.com/

                Comment

                • #83
                  pullnshoot25
                  Banned
                  • Mar 2007
                  • 8068

                  He wasn't committing a crime so WTF? Seriously? That is just a bunch of bull crap.

                  Comment

                  • #84
                    Liberty1
                    Calguns Addict
                    • Apr 2007
                    • 5541

                    Originally posted by pullnshoot25
                    He wasn't committing a crime so WTF? Seriously? That is just a bunch of bull crap.
                    Many state's DC charges are so vague that they are reserved for the "We don't have any crime here and this guy made us do some work so lets charge DC" cases.

                    Thankfully Ca's DC statute, PC 647 et all, addresses specific activities (after "e" was found unconstitutional). There is also PC 415 which addressed noise and fighting.
                    False is the idea of utility that sacrifices a thousand real advantages for one imaginary or trifling inconvenience; that would take fire from men because it burns, and water because one may drown in it; that has no remedy for evils except destruction. The laws that forbid the carrying of arms are laws of such a nature. They disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes.
                    -- Cesare Beccaria http://www.a-human-right.com/

                    Comment

                    • #85
                      Liberty1
                      Calguns Addict
                      • Apr 2007
                      • 5541

                      William Costric discusses his reasons for OCing





                      Last edited by Liberty1; 09-14-2009, 4:52 PM.
                      False is the idea of utility that sacrifices a thousand real advantages for one imaginary or trifling inconvenience; that would take fire from men because it burns, and water because one may drown in it; that has no remedy for evils except destruction. The laws that forbid the carrying of arms are laws of such a nature. They disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes.
                      -- Cesare Beccaria http://www.a-human-right.com/

                      Comment

                      • #86
                        Liberty1
                        Calguns Addict
                        • Apr 2007
                        • 5541

                        Chris B. in AZ in his own words



                        False is the idea of utility that sacrifices a thousand real advantages for one imaginary or trifling inconvenience; that would take fire from men because it burns, and water because one may drown in it; that has no remedy for evils except destruction. The laws that forbid the carrying of arms are laws of such a nature. They disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes.
                        -- Cesare Beccaria http://www.a-human-right.com/

                        Comment

                        • #87
                          Liberty1
                          Calguns Addict
                          • Apr 2007
                          • 5541

                          WI OCer arrested for REMAINING SILENT on his own porch

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                          It's a Setup
                          September 11, 2:47 PM

                          Minneapolis Gun Rights Examiner

                          by John Pierce

                          I imagine that we all have seen a movie or television show where the bad guy is being led away in handcuffs while loudly proclaiming to anyone who will listen; “I was framed!” In most cases, this scene is presented to provide a sense of closure and slight comedic relief. We know the acts of the bad guy were his own and we recognize his pleas as what they are; a last desperate attempt to avoid responsibility for his actions.

                          In the real world, claims of being framed are far rarer. The more common defense often raised by attorneys is that their client was “entrapped.” As Wikipedia so aptly states, “Entrapment is the act of a law enforcement agent inducing a person to commit an offense which would be illegal and the person would otherwise have been unlikely to commit.” The important portion of that definition is “and the person would otherwise have been unlikely to commit.” It does a defendant no good to claim that they were entrapped if they had already taken steps toward accomplishing the illegal act before any inducement was offered.

                          But can law enforcement themselves be entrapped? That seems to be the extraordinary claim of the Racine, Wisconsin police department in the case of an open carrier who was arrested for obstructing justice after he apparently refused to identify himself when officers began questioning him for open carrying on the porch of his own home.

                          The facts are still emerging, but reports seem to agree that officers were in the neighborhood where Frank Rock lives on Wednesday night investigating the shooting of one or more raccoons. While in the neighborhood, officers noticed that Rock, sitting peacefully on his front porch, was openly wearing a holstered handgun, which is legal in Wisconsin, and began questioning him. When Rock refused to identify himself or answer their questions, officers arrested him, charging him under Wisconsin statute 946.41(1) which reads:

                          Whoever knowingly resists or obstructs an officer while such officer is doing any act in an official capacity and with lawful authority, is guilty of a Class A misdemeanor.

                          The issue then becomes a twofold inquiry. First we must ask whether the officers were acting under “lawful authority” when they questioned Rock about his legal activity on his own property and secondly, whether his refusal to answer their questions rises to the level of resistance or obstruction required by the statute.

                          Luckily, we have clear legislative and judicial guidance on both issues. On the first issue, the Supreme Court held in Terry v. Ohio that investigative stops are justified (and therefore lawful authority) only when the officer has reasonable and articulable suspicion that a crime is being or will be committed. In the December 2005 issue of Police Chiefs Magazine, this specific topic was covered by Massachusetts attorney John M. Collins in an article entitled “Responding to Gun Possession Reports.” In his article he makes two things very clear. First, he states that “Where simply carrying a handgun is not in itself illegal and does not constitute probable cause to arrest, it follows that carrying a handgun, in and of itself, does not furnish reasonable suspicion justifying a Terry stop.” He follows this by giving officers options on how to proceed in such an event, starting with seeking voluntary compliance by the citizen. However, he notes that “If the person … refuses to answer, and the officer does not otherwise have (legally sufficient) reasonable suspicion of criminal activity, the officer must allow the person to continue on his or her way.”

                          Uh Oh … It appears that the Racine Police Department has a problem already doesn’t it? But we should not consider this analysis dispositive. So let’s move on to the second issue of whether Rock’s refusal to answer the officer’s question was sufficient to constitute resistance or obstruction.

                          Under Wisconsin statute 968.24, which effectively codifies the United States Supreme Court ruling in Terry, an officer, “after having identified himself or herself as a law enforcement officer, may stop a person in a public place for a reasonable period of time when the officer reasonably suspects that such person is committing, is about to commit or has committed a crime, and may demand the name and address of the person and an explanation of the person’s conduct.”

                          However, this statute does not extend so far as to impose a penalty for failure to respond to such a demand. Such a penalty was the subject of a 2004 Supreme Court refinement of Terry in the case of Hiibel v Nevada and the penalty was held to be constitutional, however Hiibel is irrelevant in this case because Wisconsin has enacted no such penalty. In fact, in the July-August 2004 newsletter of the Wisconsin Chiefs of Police Association, this very topic was discussed and Wisconsin officers were cautioned to “Beware of misplaced reliance on Hiibel” because “a person may only be arrested for refusing to identify himself if some statute or ordinance makes it unlawful to so refuse under the circumstances” and Wisconsin has no such statute or ordinance.

                          As a matter of fact, the Wisconsin Supreme Court has ruled on this very issue in the case of Henes v. Morrissey and held that “No law allows officers to arrest for obstruction on a person’s refusal to give his or her name. Mere silence is insufficient to constitute obstruction.”As both an open carry advocate and a supporter of the very difficult job done by our nation’s law enforcement officers, I do not take pleasure in seeing such a lawsuit filed. It means that we have not yet accomplished our primary goal of educating both citizens and law enforcement about the legality of open carry so that law abiding citizens who choose to exercise their rights may do so without fear of these types of encounters.

                          However, I am not the one who spent 9 hours of his life bereft of liberty and being treated like a common criminal. If Mr. Rock decides to pursue such a course of action, I think he has a very compelling legal story to present to the court. And with the recent release of the memo by Wisconsin Attorney General Van Hollen noting that open carry is legal in Wisconsin, coupled with the clear notification in multiple law enforcement publications and Wisconsin Supreme Court rulings, it seems doubtful that the officers would pass the reasonableness test necessary to enjoy qualified immunity.

                          It is a sad state of affairs for all concerned. But what it does not appear to have been is a setup.
                          Last edited by Liberty1; 09-14-2009, 4:48 PM.
                          False is the idea of utility that sacrifices a thousand real advantages for one imaginary or trifling inconvenience; that would take fire from men because it burns, and water because one may drown in it; that has no remedy for evils except destruction. The laws that forbid the carrying of arms are laws of such a nature. They disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes.
                          -- Cesare Beccaria http://www.a-human-right.com/

                          Comment

                          • #88
                            Liberty1
                            Calguns Addict
                            • Apr 2007
                            • 5541

                            Federal court decision on open carry

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                            Wisconcin:

                            There was a Federal court decision in New Mexico dated September 8, 2009 (Matthew A St. John v. David McColley and six unknown officers of the Alamogordo Department of Public Safety - Case Number 08-0994 BB/LAM) which addresses the legal risks police face when approaching someone doing nothing illegal, and detaining them.

                            The court also found that merely being armed does not automatically make a person armed and dangerous, which would be necessary to justify a limited protective search (Terry stop) that justify officers disarming an individual. This is another huge training challenge.

                            The police believe they have qualified immunity however that Ignorance of the law is no excuse for me, so it is certainly no excuse for the police either.
                            Last edited by Liberty1; 09-18-2009, 10:19 AM.
                            False is the idea of utility that sacrifices a thousand real advantages for one imaginary or trifling inconvenience; that would take fire from men because it burns, and water because one may drown in it; that has no remedy for evils except destruction. The laws that forbid the carrying of arms are laws of such a nature. They disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes.
                            -- Cesare Beccaria http://www.a-human-right.com/

                            Comment

                            • #89
                              Liberty1
                              Calguns Addict
                              • Apr 2007
                              • 5541

                              SAF preparing Suit against the City of Seattle for violating State Preemption

                              Discover Stock Examiner, the AI-powered chatbot delivering instant, interactive stock charts, real-time financials, breaking news, stock screeners, and more—all in one seamless experience.


                              False is the idea of utility that sacrifices a thousand real advantages for one imaginary or trifling inconvenience; that would take fire from men because it burns, and water because one may drown in it; that has no remedy for evils except destruction. The laws that forbid the carrying of arms are laws of such a nature. They disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes.
                              -- Cesare Beccaria http://www.a-human-right.com/

                              Comment

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