BODY ARMOR: The Good, The Bad, and the Ugly

[d-r]

Truth, I REALLY DISLIKE when I have to fax over documents to companies to "prove I am ok" to buy. I generically just politely say goodbye and move on to the next company.


Based on reading and what D-R has said I am leaning towards the following"

Soft "concealment" vest, brand undecided but most likely a Kevlar vest unless there is a compelling reason to do otherwise. I am thinking of this to wear if not daily, whenever a chest rig is not really appropriate

Plate Carrier with soft backers and the new maingun plates. D-R seems to think they are the best thing going, and I defer to his expertise. I will be purchasing the backers from d-r when the plates are finalized and I have picked the carrier. Picking a carrier is IMHO the worst part of this whole deal, becuase I have very limited experience with any of them and there are a lot of them out there. I am considering the Mayflower PC because I am pretty sure it will work with the Maingun Plates and it works with Haleys chest rig system without much adaptation or extra stuff involved. The drawback is its an expensive piece and a lot of money for something I may only use once or twice, and would be a very exorbitant expense to put in the closet as a "what if" thing. There are less expensive and of course surplus stuff out there but it is hard for me to take the time to do the research on these and have to rely on folks like D-R for recomendations.

VelSys LWPC or Mayflower APC. Can't go wrong with either, and both made in the USA.

And I agree. I am not interested in proving that I am "OK" to purchase. It is a simple matter to give my business to those companies that respect a man's word.

[mle]

These new steel III+ plates are interesting. Too bad they don't list the weight on the website. An alternative to these steel plates are the hybrid plates that stop 855 and 193. armour-wear has 4.5lb III+ hybrid plates (ceramic/kevlar). They are thicker (around 1") and the shooter's cut 10x12 barely does fit into my medium crye JPC designed for SAPI cut plates.

[97F1504RAD]

The Banshee Plate Carrier is a very reasonably priced and many have gone with it. Not sure of your size but if your an average sized person it should work for you.

[dwalker]

Any body armor company that requires purchasers to provide identifying documents (or worse yet, only sells to MIL/LEO) gets bumped down the list. A simple statement saying the purchaser is not a criminal, and will not export the armor should suffice. Requiring copies of birth certificates and driver's licenses is ludicrous. Registration leads to restriction. Armour Wear does not do this.

Truth, I REALLY DISLIKE when I have to fax over documents to companies to "prove I am ok" to buy. I generically just politely say goodbye and move on to the next company.


Based on reading and what D-R has said I am leaning towards the following"

Soft "concealment" vest, brand undecided but most likely a Kevlar vest unless there is a compelling reason to do otherwise. I am thinking of this to wear if not daily, whenever a chest rig is not really appropriate

Plate Carrier with soft backers and the new maingun plates. D-R seems to think they are the best thing going, and I defer to his expertise. I will be purchasing the backers from d-r when the plates are finalized and I have picked the carrier. Picking a carrier is IMHO the worst part of this whole deal, becuase I have very limited experience with any of them and there are a lot of them out there. I am considering the Mayflower PC because I am pretty sure it will work with the Maingun Plates and it works with Haleys chest rig system without much adaptation or extra stuff involved. The drawback is its an expensive piece and a lot of money for something I may only use once or twice, and would be a very exorbitant expense to put in the closet as a "what if" thing. There are less expensive and of course surplus stuff out there but it is hard for me to take the time to do the research on these and have to rely on folks like D-R for recomendations.

[97F1504RAD]

They only require u to prove you are a U.S. Citizen not a bad thing in my opinion and they sell to civilians.

[d-r]

Reasons?

Any body armor company that requires purchasers to provide identifying documents (or worse yet, only sells to MIL/LEO) gets bumped down the list. A simple statement saying the purchaser is not a criminal, and will not export the armor should suffice. Requiring copies of birth certificates and driver's licenses is ludicrous. Registration leads to restriction. Armour Wear does not do this.

[97F1504RAD]

Reasons?

[d-r]

I don't recall if this company has been posted before but they have some reasonably priced plates also. There was a coupon code of USAMADE that worked awhile back I think it was 20% off.

http://highcomsecurity.com/collections/plates

I would recommend Armour Wear's plates before I would recommend HiCom.

[97F1504RAD]

I don't recall if this company has been posted before but they have some reasonably priced plates also. There was a coupon code of USAMADE that worked awhile back I think it was 20% off.

http://highcomsecurity.com/collections/plates

[d-r]

It all comes down to attributes. The Armour Wear plates are bargain plates- they are only level IV, weigh 7.5 lbs. and are .75" thick.

The VelSys plates are level III and IV with a backer. They are .60" thick, and weigh a full 1.3 lbs. less.

Basically, they are better plates, well worth more than twice the price. I recommend ALL rifle plates be worn with backers, just for the extra margin of safety.

They are not a bad deal, but with the VelSys, you are paying more for the weight and thickness reduction.

An acquaintance posted this link :

https://armour-wear.com/shop/all/hard-plates/hard-plate-10-x-12-alum-level-4-stand-alone/

I can't seem to understand why my Velocity System P34 plates were nearly triple the price. The P34s are not standalone for any threat level (updated statement on the Velocity Systems website). Yet these inexpensive plates are standalone up to IV.

My question is : Is there a catch? I'm really skeptical about this.

The material stated is Alumina, which the P34s are also made of some type of ceramic ( possibly not Alumina though ). The manufacturer's claim they are NIJ lab certified but I'm still extremely skeptical at that price point.
Can you point out any reason why I shouldn't jump on this d-r?

[CrossedRifles]

An acquaintance posted this link :

https://armour-wear.com/shop/all/hard-plates/hard-plate-10-x-12-alum-level-4-stand-alone/

I can't seem to understand why my Velocity System P34 plates were nearly triple the price. The P34s are not standalone for any threat level (updated statement on the Velocity Systems website). Yet these inexpensive plates are standalone up to IV.

My question is : Is there a catch? I'm really skeptical about this.

The material stated is Alumina, which the P34s are also made of some type of ceramic ( possibly not Alumina though ). The manufacturer's claim they are NIJ lab certified but I'm still extremely skeptical at that price point.
Can you point out any reason why I shouldn't jump on this d-r?

[d-r]

What about ricochets? Since steel is harder and does not break down the bullet into pieces like ceramic what are the chances of backers or spall guards working? Also if coated steel plates where lighter/better at stopping high velocity rounds and where also lighter wouldn't the military and LEO be using them?

In order:

Richochets are unlikely unless the round is impacting at a high angle of incidence. Spall guards will not stop a richochet. Backers are irrelevant in this scenario.

The argument for steel being used by the military is not applicable. The military has different requirements for body armor, and can afford the logistical tail required to replace ceramic plates. What's best for the military is not always what's best. And many LEO agencies use steel plates. In fact, I would venture to say that LEOs are probably the biggest user of steel rifle plates.

[Steve_In_29]

What about ricochets? Since steel is harder and does not break down the bullet into pieces like ceramic what are the chances of backers or spall guards working? Also if coated steel plates where lighter/better at stopping high velocity rounds and where also lighter wouldn't the military and LEO be using them?

Steel must definitely does break bullets into pieces as it operates on shattering them. Hence the REQUIREMENT for spall-guards.

Until fairly recently these types of steels didn't exist and the ceramic composites were the most effective/lightest way to go.

[Munny$hot]

What about ricochets? Since steel is harder and does not break down the bullet into pieces like ceramic what are the chances of backers or spall guards working? Also if coated steel plates where lighter/better at stopping high velocity rounds and where also lighter wouldn't the military and LEO be using them?

[d-r]

Well the plates from Maingun are available for order now. I must say, I am a bit disappointed at the lack of information on the website with the release. I'll definitely be waiting to hear some reviews, and for a package that includes a pair of 10x12's and 6x8's. My biggest question right now would have to be what is the actual weight and thickness of these plates? I saw that d-r mentioned 4.5mm in an earlier thread, post, but also that he hasn't had any to test yet. Definitely keeping an eye on these as information progresses though!

They are positively, 100% 4.5mm thick. I can attest to that. Weight of the finished 10X12 is still not certain, as I have not handled one yet. The 8X10 are 3.5 lb. each. These will be, by definition, the thinnest and lightest III+ steel plates available.

There will be package deals with both 10X12 and 6X8 side plates, I have been told.

Hang in there, guys, these are going to be worth the wait!